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Old 19th July 2012, 14:05   #1276
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Default Re: Traffic and life on the road in Chennai

SB, if in a car, only your car will suffer if you have the seat belts on, but in a bike, it is unthinkable.
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Thats the very reason, I was forcefully packed off from India by my loved ones.
To save themselves from you ?

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Old 19th July 2012, 14:09   #1277
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But yes, there would be a reason for the signal to be there and I guess it is for the pedestrians to cross across.
Just a few yards ahead there is a foot over bridge bulit in early 2000 using the funds of, then MP of the locality Mr. Murasoli Maran. Sadly the pedestrians never used it and instead preferred to sprint across the road. Maybe the signal was introduced due to this.
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Old 19th July 2012, 14:55   #1278
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I do this as a biker. When its red, then I make sure I dont move an inch. I just switch my engine off and wait. Poor pillion rider(mostly mom or friends) would be begging me to move as the vehicle behind me would be honking or shouting like hell, and I would be in my helmet and pose like a deaf. I dont care if its a MTC or a water tanker.
OMG, Dont do this esp'ly on a bike!. What esteem_lover and SupreBaleno pointed is correct. atleast for the sake of pillion-ers. It might not be good everytime. Thank god you never came across the same MTC guy who was behind me .

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Old 19th July 2012, 16:09   #1279
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OK, since this leads to a one-way from that point onwards towards VillageRoad/SterlingRoad, people ignore it, which was why maybe he referred to it as dummy. But yes, there would be a reason for the signal to be there and I guess it is for the pedestrians to cross across.
As a rule I do not question the logic of placement of signals and their effectiveness. If its red - I would stop and wait for it to turn green on every occasion rather than rely on my judgement to jump the signal. Only exception would be if a traffic policeman asked me to proceed at a red light. And I recognize that you are not supporting the taxi driver's action but only trying to decipher his logic.

If we start letting our judgement overrule traffic signals - its a downward spiral from there as personal judgement is extremely subjective. A case in point is the indifference that most public transport vehicles show towards traffic rules and regulations. They sincerely believe that they are not doing anything wrong and that they are only reacting to the demands of the traffic situation - in other words relying on their judgement to navigate through traffic rather than relying on traffic management systems.
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Old 19th July 2012, 16:52   #1280
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Default Re: Traffic and life on the road in Chennai

@Zed, you are right. And yes, my post was only trying to interpret the cabbie's action, not justify it. I also agree that if we all start interpreting rules individually, it would be CHAOS.

But the practise of cops waving people off (frantically at that) in Chennai even before the signal is green is also wrong. When it is still red for us, it means it is green for someone from the other direction - and if we move on based on the cop's direction, you can guess the result. But how do you argue with a cop in India ?

Same issue with the situation mentioned by AlphaKilo. He is actually in the right by standing his ground at a red signal and the violator is the MTC guy, but we have to advice him to do wrong (break the signal). Ofcourse it is because of the inherent danger to him and his pillion, but get the drift ?

@John, yeah in a car we are OK, compared to when on a bike. Many years ago, I have also occasionally stood my ground on my bike in front of a revving bus like KiloAlpha, but deep inside it was definitely unnerving and the thought of "what if he hits my bike?" did cross my mind.
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Old 19th July 2012, 17:21   #1281
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@Zed, you are right. And yes, my post was only trying to interpret the cabbie's action, not justify it. I also agree that if we all start interpreting rules individually, it would be CHAOS.

But the practise of cops waving people off (frantically at that) in Chennai even before the signal is green is also wrong. When it is still red for us, it means it is green for someone from the other direction - and if we move on based on the cop's direction, you can guess the result. But how do you argue with a cop in India ?

Same issue with the situation mentioned by AlphaKilo. He is actually in the right by standing his ground at a red signal and the violator is the MTC guy, but we have to advice him to do wrong (break the signal). Ofcourse it is because of the inherent danger to him and his pillion, but get the drift ?

@John, yeah in a car we are OK, compared to when on a bike. Many years ago, I have also occasionally stood my ground on my bike in front of a revving bus like KiloAlpha, but deep inside it was definitely unnerving and the thought of "what if he hits my bike?" did cross my mind.
Thanks for all your concern guys. I understand the danger of the issue and that is the reason I used to move out(not cross the red light) of the way to let the stupid rule breaker go ahead and break the rule, when I feel things are getting out of hand.(provided if I have some pillion rider! If not, you already know what i would have been doing). I have been brought up like that and even my family members are no different. Moreover, some military blood running, I stand really firm when I know I am correct.
As I already said, now that I am being chucked out of my lovely country to exile, I am sure my family is feeling safe(their own first ! and mine too of course!).
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To save themselves from you ?
On a general note, I feel someone must stand up to this non-sense and stand firm. India and our politicians are infact not that bad. I have some personal experiences to prove this fact. Provided, we get behind them and ensure that the job gets done, it does happen. We people just need some good person to stand and show the way. Some one is always needed to lead us. For example, there have been many or most of the time, when I stand my ground in the signals, I see atleast other car drivers(private vehicles) and motorcyclists also tend to stop. And if someone honks, they get pressurized and when they realise that I am not going to move, the honker gets the stare. I have got support from many of such good souls, on more than one occasion. At the end of the day, we all are good humans, just that we dont want to stand like a sore thumb and for me, I don't care if I am a sore thumb but at the end of the day if discipline is installed, I am happy.

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Old 19th July 2012, 19:04   #1282
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But the practise of cops waving people off (frantically at that) in Chennai even before the signal is green is also wrong. When it is still red for us, it means it is green for someone from the other direction - and if we move on based on the cop's direction, you can guess the result. But how do you argue with a cop in India ?
As per law the traffic policeman has precedence over the traffic signal. But I can imagine a situation where the light is red, the cop say's go and vehicles are still crossing the signal. Hmmm I guess its back to the judgement thing then - just to protect ones life and limb - in such a situation.

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On a general note, I feel someone must stand up to this non-sense and stand
.
For example, there have been many or most of the time, when I stand my ground in the signals, I see atleast other car drivers(private vehicles) and motorcyclists also tend to stop. And if someone honks, they get pressurized and when they realise that I am not going to move, the honker gets the stare. y.
I agree. At a traffic signal, we need to stand our ground and respect the lights even if the idiot behind us thinks otherwise.
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Old 19th July 2012, 19:15   #1283
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ok, assuming you are at a traffic signal and the traffic cop waves you on inspite of the red light and you T-bone someone, whose fault is it? Will the cop accept responsibility or will he say it's your fault?
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Old 19th July 2012, 19:19   #1284
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ok, assuming you are at a traffic signal and the traffic cop waves you on inspite of the red light and you T-bone someone, whose fault is it? Will the cop accept responsibility or will he say it's your fault?
This has been a very common practice in chennai, I am not sure about other cities, I don't have much experience driving in other states. But in TN or most parts of it, this is general practice. Most of the time, the cop will wave you only if all side are clear.

OT: Its of course your fault. You should know the basic rule of life:

1. An Indian Cop is never wrong.
2. If he is wrong, see point 1.

Last edited by AlphaKilo : 19th July 2012 at 19:21.
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Old 19th July 2012, 21:11   #1285
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Default Re: Traffic and life on the road in Chennai

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As per law the traffic policeman has precedence over the traffic signal. But I can imagine a situation where the light is red, the cop say's go and vehicles are still crossing the signal. Hmmm I guess its back to the judgement thing then - just to protect ones life and limb - in such a situation...
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ok, assuming you are at a traffic signal and the traffic cop waves you on in spite of the red light and you T-bone someone, whose fault is it?
Yours. Categorically and with no doubt.

Paraphrasing, for I do not have a UK Highway Code to hand, what does a Green signal mean there? Go? No! It means Go if it safe to do so.

Assuming Indian law to be something not too different, we can see that the responsibility is always with the driver.

OK, that's my theory session done! I think it is always potentially dodgy when a junction is police controlled, because it is sometimes very easy not to see a policeman. Of course, that doesn't make the driver who ignored, or didn't see, the policeman, innocent.
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Old 19th July 2012, 23:41   #1286
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ok, assuming you are at a traffic signal and the traffic cop waves you on inspite of the red light and you T-bone someone, whose fault is it? Will the cop accept responsibility or will he say it's your fault?
That is just street justice just the same way we are cribbing here in this thread. Where is our sense of responsibility at that time ? Did we leave it at home as suggested by the thread OP? Even if the top cop signals you to take the turn, doesn't our basic instincts ask us to look right and left and then take the turn ? Why blame the public official ? Because you have paid your taxes or your bribes whichever comes first ?
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Old 20th July 2012, 10:08   #1287
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Spotted DMK leader Stalin coming out of the party headquarters today morning in a new Range Rover. Looks like he has changed his ride - IIRC he used to be seen in a Lexus SUV earlier.

@safe-driver vikram-ayya, that was not meant to be taken literally.
IMHO the best one is the black Hummer with after market alloys. Have seen it numerous times outside Green Park Vadapalani. The Hummer looks sexy to say the least. It also appeared in the tamil movie Manmadan Ambu. I used to eat at midnight briyani at Green Park. Seen Suriya and Udaynidhi once.

O.T.: Arcot Veerasamy, once incharge for electricity owns a Civic hybrid. What a nice guesture by a minister, Thinking about the environment. I can make out that everytime by seeing those plate like alloys.
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Old 20th July 2012, 10:33   #1288
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Default Re: Traffic and life on the road in Chennai

No denying that a cop takes precedence over traffic signal, but that is for special situations. Eg, for giving way to an emergency vehicle (ambulance / fire truck) or totally useless un-emergency vehicles (a minister's convoy), he might and can overrule the signal.

But that is not what we are discussing here. This is the common practice seen in Chennai where the traffic cop signals vehicles to go even before the signal has turned green for them. Leaving apart the fact that this could cause accidents (for which the errant cop won't ofcourse take responsibility), the main side-effect is that this leads to people thinking that is the norm and maybe the revving MTC drivers learn from here. Also this is possibly why we see the impatient folks at the signals - slowly inching their bikes/cars even when signal is red and then driving off before it is green. The cop is wrong here - no doubt about that. And this is not a good practice on his part. Yes, we have our instincts and common-sense, but try using that with a cop who is bellowing his lungs out, "Poya, Poya. Yen nikkre" + other words that can't be used here.

@rajanprash, doesn't the Hummer belong to Stalin's son ? Or does Stalin use it ?

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Old 20th July 2012, 12:11   #1289
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No denying that a cop takes precedence over traffic signal, but that is for special situations. Eg, for giving way to an emergency vehicle (ambulance / fire truck) or totally useless un-emergency vehicles (a minister's convoy), he might and can overrule the signal.

the main side-effect is that this leads to people thinking that is the norm and maybe the revving MTC drivers learn from here. Also this is possibly why we see the impatient folks at the signals - slowly inching their bikes/cars even when signal is red and then driving off before it is green. The cop is wrong here - no doubt about that. And this is not a good practice on his part. Yes, we have our instincts and common-sense, but try using that with a cop who is bellowing his lungs out, "Poya, Poya. Yen nikkre" + other words that can't be used here.

@rajanprash, doesn't the Hummer belong to Stalin's son ? Or does Stalin use it ?
1. Well said and rightly brought out. I have had these words hurled at me due my adamance(ignorance,as they call it), who stood behind me at teynampet signal. I was asked to go in the red, because, usually traffic policeman who mans the signal, waves the people off before it turns green. Regular users might know this route and habit too.

This clearly shows that it has certainly become an habit for people to start off while the signal is still red and cops do nothing about it.

2. His son uses it. Mr. Stalin uses the Range Rover.

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Old 20th July 2012, 22:47   #1290
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This is the common practice seen in Chennai where the traffic cop signals vehicles to go even before the signal has turned green for them. Leaving apart the fact that this could cause accidents (for which the errant cop won't ofcourse take responsibility), the main side-effect is that this leads to people thinking that is the norm and maybe the revving MTC drivers learn from here. Also this is possibly why we see the impatient folks at the signals - slowly inching their bikes/cars even when signal is red and then driving off before it is green. The cop is wrong here - no doubt about that. And this is not a good practice on his part. Yes, we have our instincts and common-sense, but try using that with a cop who is bellowing his lungs out, "Poya, Poya. Yen nikkre" + other words that can't be used here.
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ok, assuming you are at a traffic signal and the traffic cop waves you on inspite of the red light and you T-bone someone, whose fault is it? Will the cop accept responsibility or will he say it's your fault?
So, now we are saying that when the signal is green and you still get T-boned by one of these other morons (which we obviously aren't), the blame will fall fairly and squarely on that moron (legally, yes) and not us (morally) for not even looking where we were going (don't we know this happens all the time at all our signals ?) ? Either we guys with this amazing sense of discipline should live in Europe or just stop pretending. Everyone knows what it is in India, why do we always find someone else to blame for all our problems ? Where is our intelligence ? Please correct me if I am wrong, I don't mean to 'attack' anyone here.
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