Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP India > Super-Cars & Imports in India


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 10th June 2009, 22:07   #31
BHPian
 
carlover84's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Delhi
Posts: 256
Thanked: 27 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by speedy View Post
I saw a 325ci 2003 model done 26thousand odd kms and the car in the condition it was in was worth not more than 10 or 12 lakhs but the dealer was asking 25 lakhs for it. I spoke to my cousin who also deals in cars and he mentioned it was not worth more than 10 according to him. Now what do you say about this. All i am saying is that dealers should keep the prices as realistic as possible. I am sure you would agree with me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by canonball View Post
Since the trade by itself is commission driven it will always be baised/lean towards overpricing. No matter what carlover84 says, 99% of the dealers are upto this and he maybe part of the 1% so all generalisation on dealers out here is completely legitimate. I have come across more situations like the one speedy mentioned over crazy inflations in prices than respectable/clean dealers. Its like a needle in a hay stalk

Some of the most reputed "dealers" in most metros are known to be the most unprofessional and the least resourcefull.
well speedy if the condition of the 325ci was not good then i cannot comment but as per the actual market pricing going, 2003 325ci's sell for 18-19 lakhs if its a good car....

I'am not only the 1%, maybe cannonball I feel you have not met the right kinda people till yet. There are many nice dealers also who do genuine deals...I'am not the only one (Maybe I'am not too for some people). Its all about the relationship between customer and dealer. If the customer trusts dealer and if the dealer is genuine, they get good deals for them...Sometime even happens that if a person if misbehaving or showing off alot, then the dealers don't even like to entertain them and tell them high prices so that they go away...

So there are many things in which a customer can be good or bad, and a dealer can be good or bad....You cannot say a person who is buying a car worth 50 lakhs will be definitely good...He can be worse also..And a dealer selling a maruti 800 worth 40000-50000 can be good also and bad also...So you know there's nothing like a dealer is a fox who just knows how to be clever and how to earn.....
carlover84 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10th June 2009, 23:42   #32
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Pune
Posts: 352
Thanked: Once
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dipen View Post
The Indian 325i is a depreciation disaster. You can easily find them in the sub 20 lak (read 18, 19 max) range in Bombay for a 2 year old example.
Wow! That would be an amazing deal. If you come across anything similar can you drop me a PM?

Thanks a lot!
CarsPG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th June 2009, 00:01   #33
BHPian
 
mlcarrera's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: chennai, Tn,INDIA
Posts: 237
Thanked: 74 Times
Default

I agree, the same thing when u go to sell, I have an a6 3 litre quattro fully loaded, just 11 months old, in chennai the on road price is around 56, i quoted 40 for a car thats not even a year and has jus 4000 kms on the clock,the brokers(4 different guys) tell me i wont get more than 35, i cant figure that one out
mlcarrera is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th June 2009, 00:28   #34
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: mumbai
Posts: 2,035
Thanked: 315 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CarsPG View Post
Wow! That would be an amazing deal. If you come across anything similar can you drop me a PM?

Thanks a lot!
Currently, Carwale has about 3 2007 325i models for sale by dealers in Bombay lowest at around 22.5 laks. With some negotiation you could surely bring it to about 21 lak. If you find a direct seller 19-20 shouldn't be a difficult deal.
For a car that may have done around 30-35k in 2 years, 18-19 lak is perfect price.
dipen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th June 2009, 00:38   #35
BHPian
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: delhi/calgary
Posts: 286
Thanked: Once
Default

Sorry about my Little knowledge and a little off topic then discussing the integrity of used car dealers ( though i must admit that a very few rarely ask right prices , some one i know sold one used car for 16 lacks now the dealer is asking for 25 lacks for that car i dont know how much will the person bargain in this case its like trying to keep 70 % margin)

What i wanted to know is, would it be a good idea To pick these beauties that are 3-4- 5 years old like a BMW 3, 5 series or Audi A6 or Q7 or what ever due to the kind of Complex electronics that these cars come along with

I dont know but Due to issues with Skoda I have a thing stored in my mind that the one car that will not create a Havoc in my life Due to electrical AC ,Engine Leaks it would only be A Japanese Car , Like Land cruiser or Montereo ,Lexus and Camry and so on and not a BMW or a Audi or Mercedes , I know these German cars are way better
than Japanese But after its 3-4 years it will be always better to have Japs

Previous generations of Mercs and BMWs did last easily for 10 years but they never had these I drives and touche screens and 20 other things here and there I am honestly not comparing Japs and Germans and dont want to get in any kind of discussion just wanted to know about this thought that i had in my mind so any help would be appreciated

Can you guys GTO,Mcarrera Speedy and carlover 84 shed some light on this I will be grate full

Last edited by rubin2006 : 11th June 2009 at 00:39.
rubin2006 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th June 2009, 00:56   #36
BHPian
 
mlcarrera's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: chennai, Tn,INDIA
Posts: 237
Thanked: 74 Times
Default

Hi rubin, you are partly right , no doubt japs go less wrong in such issues, its too early to comment on bmw and audi as they did not exist in the indian market 5 years back
(only imports and most of them were not tropicalised eg my audi 80 1988 model used to heat up), the only german mark was benz, and they sucked,the s classes and c were terrible, faulty acs, fuel pump,especially in the c180, e was a little better
mlcarrera is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th June 2009, 01:51   #37
BHPian
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: delhi/calgary
Posts: 286
Thanked: Once
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mlcarrera View Post
Hi rubin, you are partly right , no doubt japs go less wrong in such issues, its too early to comment on bmw and audi as they did not exist in the indian market 5 years back
(only imports and most of them were not tropicalised eg my audi 80 1988 model used to heat up), the only german mark was benz, and they sucked,the s classes and c were terrible, faulty acs, fuel pump,especially in the c180, e was a little better
Yes sir this is exactly what i meant one of a friend who is a Auto analyst with a top research firm says if u need to buy German car buy it new when its under warranty , and this maintenance spare parts and reliability are the only issues why u get a one year old 325I for 20 lacks which is by chance still under warranty
rubin2006 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th June 2009, 11:44   #38
Senior - BHPian
 
canonball's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 1,466
Thanked: 188 Times
Default

mlcarrera I am with you on the selling esperience as well. I have found Times of India to be the most effective at least in Mumbai. Practically sold all my cars at very handsome prices through times. They are good for premium cars and fast moving stuff like swifts etc. Not great for low volume cars like Palio/Rhino/Aveo/Amby etc.

Eg: Bought a Jan 2001 MB E220CDi with 8000km in June 2003 for 23.5 from Autohanger. Full years insurance, NCB (worth 11k), and 6 months warrenty included. Sold her after exactly a year and 19000km for 22.5. This without insurance so roughly lost 75k on her. Autohanger had similar eg for 20 to 21, and dealer were quoting me 17 to 19 at the time of me selling mine. She was indeed scratchless (u can imagine ). Advertised on Times for 2 Fridays and a guy came did not even drive her just walked around her and bought her on the spot.

Did get a good (30% above market) price on a hard to sell Accent Petrol GVS (1.5liter) through Carwale in 2006. They were good back then but to many dealers have crowded it in the premuim space and created inefficency in the real market place. But "Times" still rules I would try several times and post ads in all metros there will be a guy with kink for the 3 liter quattro and will reach out hope, this helps

Last edited by canonball : 11th June 2009 at 11:48.
canonball is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th June 2009, 14:24   #39
Senior - BHPian
 
speedy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Mumbai Meri Jaan
Posts: 6,197
Thanked: 926 Times
Default

Hi Rubin,
I would agree with Mlcarrera here. Japs were you could say better preferred here before the German giants came in. You would find the one offs like the Audi and bmw quite a bit of Mercedes here but more of the Hondas and toyotas.
All the older cars do end up with some issue which needs to be fixed or checked. Could be electrical or body wise. This is due to the fact that most of the direct imports are not tropicalised to the Indian conditions. When the car is under warranty is does turn out to be a bit practical as the service costs are high.

Mlcarrera i would agree with cannonball. Use the papers and word of mouth to advertise your car. This would allow you to keep a tab on exactly what price is being offered and also get your desired price or closer to it.

Last edited by speedy : 11th June 2009 at 14:27.
speedy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th June 2009, 16:43   #40
Team-BHP Support
 
manson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Bombay
Posts: 3,547
Thanked: 2,034 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by carlover84 View Post

You cannot depreciate the value of the car just like 25% for first, then 15 for second etc etc....
And why not? Irrespective of the segment, almost every other vehicle depreciates by an odd 25% in the first year, 20% on the reduced value in the second and another 20% on the further reduced value. Now it obviously would have been quite the opposite if we were talking vintages.
Infact why would one buy a one year old vehicle for anything over 75% of the original price tag? If someone were seeking a loan, the difference in interest rates between for new and used cars would make up for a good chunk of the 20% odd difference in price.

There may just be a handful of cases that may probably beat the above basics of vehicle depreciation, but then those are pure exceptions.

manson.
manson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th June 2009, 19:50   #41
BHPian
 
Raj1008's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Toronto
Posts: 119
Thanked: 12 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by speedy View Post
All the older cars do end up with some issue which needs to be fixed or checked. Could be electrical or body wise. This is due to the fact that most of the direct imports are not tropicalised to the Indian conditions. When the car is under warranty is does turn out to be a bit practical as the service costs are high.
.
Even here, used Japanese cars are a better buy than EU ones because of serious maintenance issues. Its like EU put a timer in the car to fall apart as soon as the warranty is over. So it prolly has nothing to do with Indian climate.
Raj1008 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14th June 2009, 11:24   #42
BHPian
 
S600BENZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 305
Thanked: 4 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by speedy View Post
a 03 BMW 325 ci (convertible) done 26,000 odd kms asking was 25 Lakhs. The BMW should ideally be in the 10 to 12 lakhs range.
I am also a Dealer/Commision agent operating in Mumbai(Bandra) since 10 years. You have got the pricing evaluation of 10 to 12 lakhs on the 325Ci completely wrong. One simple reason being lack of supply of a low budget German convertible in the Mumbai market. You have to understand that depreciation and condition of the car are not the only factors that come into play while evaluating a car. Demand and Supply play a major role in this scenario. I know the particular car and the dealer who owns it personally and in fact have got him an offer of 19 Lakhs for the same car yesterday from an outstation client. I agree that you will get a 07 BMW 320i for around 18-19 lakhs also, but then that is because they are available in abundance.
I also know the price that the dealer has purchased the particular 325Ci for and it is slightly lower than what my client has offered him, so that why he is not selling it for 19 lakhs.
There are also some off hand cases where the seller is in dire straits and is in desperate need of money. At such times they sell their car at a price way below the current market value. But such deals do not come through to clients cause these kind of desperate sellers usually go to Dealers who will give them the amount upfront immediately, usually within hours. Such cases do not really reflect the market value of the car.

Last edited by S600BENZ : 14th June 2009 at 11:25.
S600BENZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14th June 2009, 11:59   #43
BHPian
 
S600BENZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 305
Thanked: 4 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by speedy View Post
The point discussed was of the amount added to the actual price for a car. The example of the Rolls 4.1 cr by the dealer and 3 cr from the owner. I could understand is if the dealer asked for 3.5 cr for the car knowing it would be gegotiated upon. Yes everyone wants a good deal on the car and hence the negotiations.
Till date, Sharma's prized deal was a 2008 Rs 4.1 cr Royce that had done 4000 km. In the end, he managed to sell it for Rs 3 crore.

What Sharma meant in the above statement was that the price of a Brand new Rolls Royce was 4.1Cr and he manged to sell it for 3 Cr. Nowhere in the article is it mentioned that he was quoting 4.1Cr for it.
Also checked on Carwale and the Ex Showroom price for a Phantom is mentioned as 3.5Cr, which I am guessing translates into an on road price of 4.1Cr with Delhi reg. You really need to read the article completely and do your research before passing comments on a persons credibilty. Not that i know Sharma personally or have heard about him prior to reading this article.
S600BENZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14th June 2009, 14:03   #44
Senior - BHPian
 
speedy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Mumbai Meri Jaan
Posts: 6,197
Thanked: 926 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by S600BENZ View Post
Till date, Sharma's prized deal was a 2008 Rs 4.1 cr Royce that had done 4000 km. In the end, he managed to sell it for Rs 3 crore.

What Sharma meant in the above statement was that the price of a Brand new Rolls Royce was 4.1Cr and he manged to sell it for 3 Cr. Nowhere in the article is it mentioned that he was quoting 4.1Cr for it.
Also checked on Carwale and the Ex Showroom price for a Phantom is mentioned as 3.5Cr, which I am guessing translates into an on road price of 4.1Cr with Delhi reg. You really need to read the article completely and do your research before passing comments on a persons credibilty. Not that i know Sharma personally or have heard about him prior to reading this article.
I would not like to give out your name S600Benz but if you do meet me you would know who i am. I am aware you deal in cars from bandra and also had fallen in trouble during one of the raids conducted on foriegn bikes and cars. I do not know how much it is true but nonetheless.

I know Sharma from the early 90's where he would only deal with indian cars and one or two odd forign cars from a shared office in delhi. Just for your knowledge all cars land in Delhi and then come to bombay, i presume the taxation in Delhi is cheaper than in Bombay. Sold it for 3 crores but the car is still in the market for sale, just got a call yesterday for it. So is the arcticle lieing or Sharma is. It does not really matter to me. Like i have mentioned before with pictures of my car, he wanted to sell it to me. When i asked him for the car he mentioned it just got sold to my own brother. So what kind of credibility are you talking about. I do not pass judgements on people due to some paper or Arcticle S600benz, its only personal experience that counts for me. I still dont hold anything against Sharma.

As far as the Bmw goes, how come i see it being driven everyday with the driver on the highway while going to andheri, if it is indeed bought by the dealer. I do understand the demand and supply and the very few convertibles available in India, but if the car is not worth the price it is not. I am sure if you were buying the car for yourself it would be a different story. Now since the car is going to an outstation client who probably has only seen pictures of the car, he has offered 19 lakhs for it. I can list a whole lot of things that need to be fixed on that car, and trust me these parts are not cheap, you would know since you deal in them. For the record i never asked him for a bargain and neither was i looking for one. My budget was of 30 lakhs and i did not feel the car was worth the 25lakhs he was asking. He asked me what i felt the worth was and i gave him my feedback. If i was looking for a bargain my friend i would not have seen the Sl 500 that was also with him. asking price was 53 for the car.

No offence meant to you or any of the Dealer community.

Last edited by speedy : 14th June 2009 at 14:07.
speedy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th June 2009, 14:42   #45
Senior - BHPian
 
canonball's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 1,466
Thanked: 188 Times
Default

Speedy you got it 100% bang on the buck. My personal opinion is if you are a professional dealer let your work speak for it as there is no point conter pointing or clarifying first hand experiences folks like us have had with dealers.
canonball is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Chennai Flood Impact: Large number of cars up for online auction at throwaway base prices Rajeevraj The Indian Car Scene 59 29th February 2016 09:41
pre-owned Baleno vs pre-owned Accent vs ikon flair rohantn Sedans 36 16th February 2007 20:27
pre-owned Wagon R or pre-owned Bolero - pls advice rohantn Hatchbacks 26 7th February 2007 17:02
Pre-owned Ford mondeo vs Pre-owned Skoda octavia azifali Sedans 6 24th July 2006 13:46


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 13:04.

Copyright 2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks