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Old 20th March 2014, 09:00   #271
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Default Re: Harley Street 750 Test Ride: Handling, Exhaust Note & more

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Originally Posted by niranjanrvce View Post
Off late, my wife has been pestering me to buy a bike that can seat her too; I guess I did one too many road trips all alone (and happily so ).
I'm in the same boat too. The 750 is definitely not going to be a pillion friendly bike, going by the size of the bike. It will be cramped for two up riding even with a large-ish pillion seat added.

At the risk of going OT, i would suggest you to test ride the bonny instead. It is understated but super comfy, has oodles of torque and can cruise all day long at 120 kays. Else, wait for the 390 adventure which should be out next year. I'm more inclined towards this one than the bonny for practical reasons
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Old 1st April 2014, 15:40   #272
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Default Re: Comparison Report: Harley Davidson Iron 883 vs Triumph Bonneville

Hello All,

I got an opportunity to finally test ride a brand new Harley Davidson 883 Sportster for a fairly large amount of distance (20kms) on one of best highways in our country NH7 ( Hyderabad to Bangalore Highway).

This bike was fitted with screaming eagle air filter and had its baffles cut-out just the previous night and coincidentally when i was astride this bike, the odometer crossed "883" kms

Till I switched over, Mani (T100) owner was riding the Iron 883 and Iron 883 owner was enjoying the Triumph Daytona. I signalled to Mani and he pulled over and he got onto my Bonnie and I took over the Iron 883.

Started off the line smoothly and first thing that hits you is the torque, the bike surges forward smoothly and takes you till 80kmph quite nicely.

However, from 80kmph onwards the hand rest and foot pegs start off with a slight vibration. But, as speed increases, the vibrations become simply too much to bear.

1. Handle bar and foot pegs vibrate real badly. I almost felt like taking my feet off the footpegs. And, this is on ultra smooth highway

2. At high speed, the front tyre seemed bit wobbly and was not at all confidence inspiring. Maybe with some practice i can push the bike but, i was not confident due to vibrations and front tyre not seeming at all times in contact with surface (got that feeling)

Well, this was a brand new Iron 883 and I was kind of shocked to see so much vibrations in a new bike. Iam not sure if Iron 883 is built to give out that feeling or some issue with this particular bike.

Perhaps, a few owners here can throw some light on this aspect.

Post that 20kms ride, getting back on saddle of Bonnie was pure heaven.

Butter smooth and "zero vibrations" until 20% higher speeds than maximum speed of Iron 883 that I rode. Infact, the owner was grinning and said the same thing after I got off the Iron's saddle. Iam sure after riding the Bonnie, your whole body must be shaking from the vibrations....I just smiled and didnt comment anything..Hehe!

Thankfully, this ride just re-enforced my decision.......

P.S: Iron 883 owner has booked a Speed Tripple ( first bike will be his) and fell in love with Triumph Daytona. So no idea if he will move his booking from Speed to Daytona. Only time will tell.

Last edited by GTO : 3rd April 2014 at 09:39. Reason: Removing line on speed, thanks :)
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Old 1st April 2014, 18:10   #273
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Default Re: Comparison Report: Harley Davidson Iron 883 vs Triumph Bonneville

There is no doubt about the capability of Iron or Superlow in getting to the sppeds being mentioned.

Its the relative effort it takes beyond the 80 kmph and the vibrations etc which probaly unnerved the one off rider, even if it were for a fairly long ride. If you compare the effort the Bonney is definitely better off and usually will not unnerve even a first time rider - that is one of the usp of Bonney.

At least that is my opinion, mind you I have used all the 3 bikes being mentioned 1 currently and the other two in the past)

Best Regards & Thanks

Ram

Last edited by r_nairtvm : 1st April 2014 at 18:14.
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Old 1st April 2014, 21:01   #274
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Default Re: Comparison Report: Harley Davidson Iron 883 vs Triumph Bonneville

Well, even a Ninja 250 can go up to those speeds. What matters is :-

1. How quickly you get there?
2. How planted you feel?
3. Are the vibrations manageable?
4. Does it give the feeling of confidence if its required to stop in a hurry

Dont know about you, but, I would look at these parameters for any bike !!

Vibrations in footpegs in Iron 883 at 120kmph was just unbearable. It's a different story if the rider is hellbent in going at a higher speed just to prove a point. It's engine certainly has the capability in reaching those speeds!!

Last edited by moralfibre : 2nd April 2014 at 15:30. Reason: Quoted post deleted.
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Old 1st April 2014, 22:14   #275
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Default Re: Comparison Report: Harley Davidson Iron 883 vs Triumph Bonneville

Quote:
Originally Posted by mobike008 View Post
What matters is :-

1. How quickly you get there?
2. How planted you feel?
3. Are the vibrations manageable?
4. Does it give the feeling of confidence if its required to stop in a hurry

Dont know about you, but, I would look at these parameters for any bike !!
Please don't belittle me by judging my riding capabilities by presuming the figures I am quoting are just in jest and are being quoted to prove a point.

My bike is absolutely planted at 120kph speed unlike your experience and therefore I do NOT agree with your observations. Even at 120kph the bike was absolutely stable without any vibrations that you have felt and it gave me the feeling of confidence that I could even breach 10~20+ speeds over and above those if I had a full face helmet. Mind you that the current helmet was also DOT certified 3/4 one.

I would also like to mention that such speeds on the Harley should ONLY be tried after the break-in period has completed (1600kms) and the bike has undergone its first oil change. The engine opens up much more after that especially if you have Screamin Eagle exhausts installed. And if you have a Free flowing Air intake and a Fuel remap done the bike should easily cross triple digit speeds. Hope that clarifies...

Note from Support - Post edited. Please do not mention high speed figures unless it was attained on a closed stretch of road such as a race track. Such posts could be perceived as careless/dangerous riding inviting unnecessary debates and arguments.

Last edited by n_aditya : 2nd April 2014 at 14:20.
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Old 1st April 2014, 22:22   #276
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Default Re: Comparison Report: Harley Davidson Iron 883 vs Triumph Bonneville

Wow, you do 120 kmph on a bike with a half face helmet? I thought these are meant only for in city rides at commuter speeds.

Please seriously switch to a full face helmet immediately, dot approved at minimum. My max speed on the Classic 500 has been 120, so I am a baby amongst you guys but the windblast at that speed was pretty strong with a full face helmet.

I think senior bhpians should practise safe riding, not just advocate it in posts. Sorry if this comes out too strong, but please take it in good spirit.

Last edited by bblost : 2nd April 2014 at 14:18.
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Old 2nd April 2014, 11:35   #277
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Default Re: Comparison Report: Harley Davidson Iron 883 vs Triumph Bonneville

Gentlemen please don't be so unkind to the HD Sportster afterall it has been a successful range since 1957 which you can't disregard by any standard. Now out of my personal experience (Still in run-in) there are noticeable but definitely not annoying vibrations from the gem of the engine.

Please note you are comparing different animals. The Iron is a V-twin with rubber mounts and Bonnie is a parallel twin with balancers. By construction a V-twin will have more vibrations given the firing order. Anyone who has ridden a top end Ducati compared to an inline motor would have experienced this. Therefore given the engine architecture at the same RPM, Iron would be more "animalistic" compared to the bonnie but not the kind that puts you off
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Old 2nd April 2014, 12:14   #278
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Default Re: Comparison Report: Harley Davidson Iron 883 vs Triumph Bonneville

Well put AC. Each bike/engine config. has its own idiosyncrasies and character and charm.

Speaking of vibes and vibrations, I used to revel in those of my Bullets and used to wonder at the non-Bullet types going on and on about Bullet vibrations yada yada yada (pansies! we would mentally sneer ....).

Then I moved on to the little Duke which is smooth in comparison. No vibes from anywhere.

And I realised the basic truth - for long distance riding, as masochistic as you may be, vibrations tire, vibrations fatigue.

You will be way more fatigued after X number of kilometers riding a bike which vibrates and shakes compared to doing the same X number of kilometers riding a bike which does not.

Ditto for exhaust sound. Screaming Eagles and Arrows and Akras and Goldstars sound great in the city and while ripping in the ghats. But for really long distance mile munching, nothing beats the muted over-long and slightly restrictive company provided decibel-controlled exhaust systems.

Finally, the other pertinent point is not the top speed a bike (just about) manages to hit, but how quickly and how effortlessly it gets there, and how long you can hold it there (both from rider as well as engine perspectives). A bike which labors to reach its theoretical top speed will also tire out the rider who tries to wring it out fom each slowdown.
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Old 2nd April 2014, 13:57   #279
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Default Re: Comparison Report: Harley Davidson Iron 883 vs Triumph Bonneville

Quote:
Originally Posted by ebonho View Post
And I realised the basic truth - for long distance riding, as masochistic as you may be, vibrations tire, vibrations fatigue.

You will be way more fatigued after X number of kilometers riding a bike which vibrates and shakes compared to doing the same X number of kilometers riding a bike which does not.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ebonho View Post
Ditto for exhaust sound. Screaming Eagles and Arrows and Akras and Goldstars sound great in the city and while ripping in the ghats. But for really long distance mile munching, nothing beats the muted over-long and slightly restrictive company provided decibel-controlled exhaust systems.
My thoughts exactly on vibrations and sound. I would not enjoy a bike for long distances if there is a constant vibration under the palm & feet and add to that constant loud chatter of exhuasts

If I take an analogy of my other bike, my Classic 500 would run without any vibrations till 90kmph...maybe even till 100kmph ( reaches till here pretty fast too) and post that it would vibrate as if it was ready to fall apart.

Now whenever I ride the bullet (which is almost everyday), it's engine feels simply too coarse, I think iam spoilt silly after riding a bike with a silky engine with zilch vibrations. but, that doesnt stop me from loving my bull's overall character. I think thats the issue, once you fall in love with a bike, its difficult to fall out of it despite knowing its idiosyncrasies

Btw, Iam now little apprehensive of putting the Arrow Silencers as iam given to understand they are too loud...Would be willing to compromise on sound trade-off only if it increases power (5bhp-7bhp) as claimed

Quote:
Originally Posted by ebonho View Post
Finally, the other pertinent point is not the top speed a bike (just about) manages to hit, but how quickly and how effortlessly it gets there, and how long you can hold it there (both from rider as well as engine perspectives). A bike which labors to reach its theoretical top speed will also tire out the rider who tries to wring it out fom each slowdown.
I missed this point---"How long can you hold the bike at that top speed" is also an important parameter vis-viz "just reaching it"
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Old 2nd April 2014, 14:04   #280
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Default Re: Comparison Report: Harley Davidson Iron 883 vs Triumph Bonneville

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Originally Posted by mobike008 View Post
Btw, Iam now little apprehensive of putting the Arrow Silencers as iam given to understand they are too loud.
Avi, I saw two bonny's at the Triumph dealer in Blore, one had only the Arrow slip on pipes and it was not very loud. Pretty muted but only a wee bit louder than the stock pipes.

The Arrow full system including the headers and exhaust pipes which was fitted on the test bike was extremely loud. This would definitely be uncomfortable over long rides.
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Old 2nd April 2014, 14:17   #281
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Default Re: Comparison Report: Harley Davidson Iron 883 vs Triumph Bonneville

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Originally Posted by ebonho View Post
And I realised the basic truth - for long distance riding, as masochistic as you may be, vibrations tire, vibrations fatigue.

Ditto for exhaust sound. Screaming Eagles and Arrows and Akras and Goldstars sound great in the city and while ripping in the ghats. But for really long distance mile munching, nothing beats the muted over-long and slightly restrictive company provided decibel-controlled exhaust systems.

A bike which labors to reach its theoretical top speed will also tire out the rider who tries to wring it out fom each slowdown.
+1 to the above from what Doc has put out very clearly.

Doc, the noise factor for the rider, practically gets reasonably cancelled to a high degree by a well insulated helmet - as most of the well known and established brands likes of Arais, Shoeis, Nolans etc.

But mind you no such luck for the rider following. In our mixed group rides this is constant problem - The biker following a HD fitted with V&H or SE, will be cursing the day the loudness was invented.

Issue is easily not resolvable, specially we can't have the HDs bring up the rear as they tend to get left behind once we are in to our natural ridding rithem and the riders complain of the added effort they need to make to keep with us (in my group in Dubai I have the honour of being the sweep)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mobike008 View Post

Btw, Iam now little apprehensive of putting the Arrow Silencers as iam given to understand they are too loud...Would be willing to compromise on sound trade-off only if it increases power (5bhp-7bhp) as claimed

I missed this point---"How long can you hold the bike at that top speed" is also an important parameter vis-viz "just reaching it"
Two very valid points - The Arrow issue - see what I have mentioned above - the pain will not be for you once you go for a good helmet, but for your wingman or sweep. "The power increase will definitely be there, specially if complimented by appropriately by K&N Filter in place of the standarf filter box. No ECU re-mapping required as the rugged ECU of Bonnie will self-remap to the free flows both ways". No othe fideling with stock set up required - as per expert aka BB.

That is what I mentioned in my earlier post as "effort" - the effortless equates to relaxed ride and all that follows

Best Regards & Ride Safe

Ram

Last edited by r_nairtvm : 2nd April 2014 at 14:43.
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Old 2nd April 2014, 14:19   #282
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Default Re: Comparison Report: Harley Davidson Iron 883 vs Triumph Bonneville

Mod Note:

Multiple Posts have been edited / deleted.

Team-BHP strongly discourages unsafe driving practices that put yourself and other road users at risk. Please do NOT post about illegal high speeds on public roads.

We advise you to read the Forum Rules before proceeding any further.

Last edited by n_aditya : 2nd April 2014 at 14:34.
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Old 2nd April 2014, 14:27   #283
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Default Re: Comparison Report: Harley Davidson Iron 883 vs Triumph Bonneville

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Originally Posted by dkaile View Post
Mind you that the current helmet was also DOT certified 3/4 one.
I am very sorry to go off topic. But are you actually saying an open face helmet is ok at high speeds because its Dot certified?

What is protecting your Jaw and cheeks?

NOTHING.

As someone who once walked away from a full face down crash, I pray to God you don't go thru that experience.
Because if you do then your helmet could be certified by anyone but you will never chew food again. Please think about this when you wear your open face helmet and twist that accelerator.

Again sorry for going off topic but I had to say it.
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Old 2nd April 2014, 14:36   #284
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Default Re: Comparison Report: Harley Davidson Iron 883 vs Triumph Bonneville

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Originally Posted by n_aditya View Post
Avi, I saw two bonny's at the Triumph dealer in Blore, one had only the Arrow slip on pipes and it was not very loud. Pretty muted but only a wee bit louder than the stock pipes.

The Arrow full system including the headers and exhaust pipes which was fitted on the test bike was extremely loud. This would definitely be uncomfortable over long rides.
Adi, the slip on's are known as "High Flow Silencers" and full set from bend pipe to exhaust tip is the full 2x2 set.

HFS is 21K
Arrow Full Set is 52K

Iam confused between them both. Can come to a conclusion only after hearing them. My only concern, that sound should not come in between the riding pleasure

Quote:
Originally Posted by r_nairtvm View Post
But mind you no such luck for the rider following. In our mixed group rides this is constant problem - The biker following a HD fitted with V&H or SE, will be cursing the day the loudness was invented.

I issue is easily not resolvable, specially we can't have the HDs bring up the rear as they tend to get left behind once we are in to our natural ridding rithem (in my group in Dubai I have the honour of being the sweep)
Actually, Ram I enjoy the sound of a loud exhuast on a Harley if iam riding behind them and dont mind following them just to sink in that sound but, not sure if i can say the same if iam the one riding it

Quote:
Originally Posted by r_nairtvm View Post
That is what I mentioned in my earlier post as "effort" - the effortless equates to relaxed ride and all that follows
Could you please explain the riding pattern that you adopt in your group in Dubai? I think everyone follows a different pattern with some of the signals being common
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Old 2nd April 2014, 15:35   #285
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Default Re: Comparison Report: Harley Davidson Iron 883 vs Triumph Bonneville

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Originally Posted by mobike008 View Post
Adi, the slip on's are known as "High Flow Silencers" and full set from bend pipe to exhaust tip is the full 2x2 set.

HFS is 21K
Arrow Full Set is 52K
Full set any day man. Most slip ons are a joke. Great for sound only.
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