Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP India > Motorbikes > Superbikes & Imports


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 15th December 2014, 11:58   #511
Team-BHP Support
 
Jaggu's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 17,752
Thanked: 7,471 Times
Default Re: Triumph India: Sold Bikes in India with fake performance figures!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ACM View Post
Just curious: you or someone else could clarify?

1) For a 106 bhp striple if one adds the Arrows what is the rough revised bhp figure?
2) There was a dyno chart posted somewhere of the 79 bhp striple testing at about 100 bhp with arrows a gain of 21 bhp?
3) While I understand it cannot
1) Couple of bhp more, so might be 109-110 max

2) It had arrows plus, arrow remap and was running 97 ron petrol, this will give a spike at max power readings

3) Add error and correction factors, but wheel horse power difference between stock and this bike was quite normal for the changes it had

This infact created lot of speculation and misfire from people who did not understand dynoing as well as correction factors. In fact the RD guys also got some flack from few for this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricci View Post
but they weigh 10-12kg less (or even more , depending on which bike - heard 25kg saving for the 2 pipe Bonnie).
For Striple no such huge savings, since its just the end can that comes as part of the arrow system.


Quote:
Originally Posted by gthang View Post
So, what exactly is different in the bike?
1. Restricted airbox. Nothing a sharp blade can't fix.
2. Restricted exhaust. Option to switch to Arrow or buy stock Euro market exhaust.
3. Camshafts. Not confirmed since no one has opened their engine
No camshaft changes, confirmed. It is just 1 & 2 and in 2 stock euro Triumph would not be able to sell since that is what made the whole bike takenforaride in the first place.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricci View Post
The EU exhaust isn't being sold here, since it doesn't meet the noise emission regulation, I'm told.
====
Arrows being aftermarket pipes but sold by the Triumph dealers as official accessories, the question really is, is it within India's noise regulations? Other brands get aftermarket pipes from 3rd parties, not official dealers.
EU stock pipe cant be sold, but Arrow can be sold since it is a competition part sold around the world and india for Triumphs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bblost View Post
If god forbid there is an accident, won't the insurance company automatically cancel the coverage?
Nope

Quote:
Originally Posted by gthang View Post
Really? Guess you haven't seen any Harley bikes with Screaming Eagles around.

And the insurance company knows of the mods how?

Are you guys serious?
Yes things does not work like that, i know people who run modification and goof up but still process warranty and/or insurance claims by putting stock parts for the inspection.

Quote:
Originally Posted by harsha.muvva View Post
The after-market parts(exhaust,frame sliders,levers..etc) wont be covered under insurance since it is an accessory according to rules.But if you have good rapport with the showroom guys it is not at all an issue to claim after-market parts under insurance as well(showroom guys should include the value of aftermarket bits in the repair invoice for this).
====Very less number of insurance claims related to big bikes might be a reason for this!
Just one reason, doing non-legal speed! That itself is just needed to create issue, why take accessories and all. So this is a very complicated and twisted matter.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steeroid View Post
The primary issue is that of trust, and that cannot be reclaimed by asking people to cut plastic boxes with a knife.
Bingo!! Trust, that is the key thing. Just wanted to let you guys know that in the last one week there has been many GOOD turn arounds for Many of the customers across India.

Quote:
Originally Posted by J.B View Post
But their attitude following the fallout has not been direct and honest as you would find in this thread (various high headed facebook posts, deleted comments, dealer offering deals then taking them back etc).
====
Even then, it doesnt absolve them of the initial goof up and they still owe an apology for the heart burn caused to the customers.
I just wanted a 106 tune but the way in which they handled it, got me peeved off. I shared that feedback with them, and now they are turning around and trying hard to fix it! Which i really appreciate.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ani_meher View Post
What's the deal for a new Street Tripple?
106 in India will never be a reality and no options would be provided, as far as i have come to know. Heard few of the potential customers are already making use of the news and asking for discounts at dealership.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR View Post
Lot of arguments on the previous page- as to the solutions offered by Triumph. Is there any official offer, or just that the owners have been contacted by dealers with their own suggestions? What if Triumph says later that there was no official offer made, and those who went with dealer offers missed to read the 'disclaimers'.
===============
By the way- anyone has an idea how many STriples would have been sold in India till date?
Yes many people have signed up to "revised offers" across the country. And yes dealers were making offers on behalf of Triumph, since they know the customers best at ground, due to they being integral part of Triumph activities for owners.


Quote:
Originally Posted by J.B View Post
Dude, I do not understand why do you want to think otherwise. Prima facie, it appears they have every reason to do it. If it was not for 106 bhp, a lot of striple owners guaging from the comments in this thread itself would have bought a z800.
True this ^

Quote:
The dealerships knew or not is a different issue, but they took the bike to ARAI and got it certified and are you saying no one in Triumph ever glanced through the ARAI certificate? I even saw people posting Fb and twitter messages from Triumph india saying its 106bhp.
No idea, but i think someone actually took notice and that is when they decided to publish the figures. And for the one goof up in Street model, they decided to go full honest and replaced all figures with Arai quoted number (my guess). Which is very good, if you ask me.

On the other hand, i am not sure how many are aware what are the objectives of Arai testing? Quoting from the landing page.

Quote:
The Automotive Research Association of India ( ARAI ) has been playing a crucial role in assuring safe, less polluting and more efficient vehicles. ARAI provides technical expertise in R & D, testing, certification, homologation and framing of vehicle regulations.

ARAI is research association of the Automotive Industry with Ministry of Heavy Industries and Public Enterprises, Government of India. It works in harmony and complete confidence with its members, customers and the Government of India to offer the finest services, which earned for itself ISO 9001, ISO 14001, OHSAS 18001 and NABL accreditations.

ARAI is well-equipped with state-of-the-art infra-structural facilities and highly qualified manpower.
In short they are not there primarily to check power rating, their objective is clear, get the vehicles tested if they are legally compliant to the environmental and pollution norms. That says a lot.

Quote:
Even after all this, I would have given them the benefit of doubt had they been pro active and came out with an apology first, the rest could have been sorted later, even that has not happened. What wrong did the customers do to go through this?
101% true, this was a total PR disaster. This could have been handled so much better. Just calling the 100 odd customers, explaining them the issue with resolution or offers and then a public acknowledgement would have been enough!! This will be another case study for Indian Automotive industry in customer relationship management.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jaysmokesleaves View Post
I will also add, that, given the fact, that a company like Triumph, with such a long history, should definitely show much more maturity than what it is displaying in the way it is handling this episode.
They are responding, took a while but now they are on the right track. Many, rather most of BLR customers i know and who are Street Owners have signed up to the offers, which are respectable. Yes, me included.

Like someone mentioned in one of the meetings that happened over the weekend, this whole negotiation was like a poker game. When its time, each one would fold (make the call for oneself). Good thing was we as a group could cut a decent deal and are quite happy about it.

Could it have been better? Will someone else get better deal? Can it be a landslide victory at courts? All this does not matter to me now, i will be getting back the 106 tune i had paid for and some goodwill gestures for my heart burn.

May not be the best offer, but i am happy for now.
Jaggu is online now   (8) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 15th December 2014, 13:33   #512
Senior - BHPian
 
black12rr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Ridin earth now
Posts: 1,259
Thanked: 272 Times
Default Re: Triumph India: Sold Bikes in India with fake performance figures!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaggu View Post

Could it have been better? Will someone else get better deal? Can it be a landslide victory at courts? All this does not matter to me now, i will be getting back the 106 tune i had paid for and some goodwill gestures for my heart burn.

May not be the best offer, but i am happy for now.
Well nobody wants to bell the cat ! Even If I was a owner why would I take the headache of dragging them to courts and teaching them a proper lesson , unless I have tons of money and time . For a salaried person this is just too much headache .

Whats more pathetic is there is no Central or state mechanism who steps in to protect customer interests . So does the mechanism ends just after issuing licenses for sales and service ? After that no checks to see if they are doing it correctly ,ethically and honestly ? Then again chaltha hai attitude ! I am really angry to see them commit a crime and get away so easily .

This is just like saying ,I stole 100rs , I kept quite , some one found it , I gave it back . They are happy they got the money back .I walk away happily looking for some other 100 rs .

Last edited by black12rr : 15th December 2014 at 13:35.
black12rr is offline   (4) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 15th December 2014, 14:42   #513
Distinguished - BHPian
 
CrAzY dRiVeR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Bangalore / TVM
Posts: 8,972
Thanked: 16,753 Times
Default Re: Triumph India: Sold Bikes in India with fake performance figures!

Quote:
Originally Posted by black12rr View Post
This is just like saying ,I stole 100rs , I kept quite , some one found it , I gave it back . They are happy they got the money back .I walk away happily looking for some other 100 rs .
More like you were given a 90 instead of a 100. And finally when you found out and protested, they are giving a option of a counterfeit 100 or some free chocolates to forget that missing 10. Nobody is getting the original 100 back now, are they?

From my understanding - doesn't look like the so called modified 106 will be legal anymore (Another story if the state / insurance surveryor can find it or not). STripple has already become the stuff of whatsapp jokes and lost the favour of the market with the current specs - possibly resale value as well. That's not what the owners signed up for when they payed up for a new UK spec STripple.

Anyways, if the owners feel they have received decent compensation- good for them. But let's not applaud Triumph as a company for what looks like 'under the table' transactions for now.

Last edited by CrAzY dRiVeR : 15th December 2014 at 14:50.
CrAzY dRiVeR is offline   (2) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 15th December 2014, 14:49   #514
BHPian
 
neil.jericho's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Bangalore / Coc
Posts: 760
Thanked: 1,350 Times
Default Re: Triumph India: Sold Bikes in India with fake performance figures!

Quote:
Originally Posted by A_v_i View Post
Everyone has been contacted with the same offers, including me. Without going into details of the 106BHP option (because it might become a sensitive topic in the future for the owners who opt for it, i am sure your friend can brief you on the details), i don't think it is a very fair deal.

I will most likely opt for the upgrade, not because it is a fair option but because i as an existing owner don't have very many choices.
Can you share the details of the offers with the rest of us?
neil.jericho is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th December 2014, 15:37   #515
Senior - BHPian
 
naveenroy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 1,319
Thanked: 694 Times
Default Re: Triumph India: Sold Bikes in India with fake performance figures!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaggu View Post
Just wanted to let you guys know that in the last one week there has been many GOOD turn arounds for Many of the customers across India.
That is indeed very good to know. Can you tell us what was the good turn-around? Or is there by any chance an asterisk somewhere asking you guys not to speak to anyone about it? No offense.

But most it is about the trust. I am sure their PR agency has also screwed up big time. The best way is to acknowledge the mistake, own up, apologise. Would have made things so much easier and cleaner.
naveenroy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th December 2014, 15:41   #516
BHPian
 
udainxs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 179
Thanked: 69 Times
Default Re: Triumph India: Sold Bikes in India with fake performance figures!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaggu View Post
1) Heard few of the potential customers are already making use of the news and asking for discounts at dealership.

I did speak to Jaikant at Keerthi Triumph, fishing for offers for the Striple
Apart from immediate delivery, there was nothing else on offer.

The add-ons are only for existing customers is what I was told. Still 9.2 OTR, Bangalore

That apart, they are pushing the Street mentioning top speeds in excess of 230kmph and the top speed in each gear etc!

Earlier, just the '106' figure sufficed!
udainxs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th December 2014, 15:49   #517
Team-BHP Support
 
Jaggu's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 17,752
Thanked: 7,471 Times
Default Re: Triumph India: Sold Bikes in India with fake performance figures!

Quote:
Originally Posted by naveenroy View Post
Or is there by any chance an asterisk somewhere asking you guys not to speak to anyone about it? No offense.
None taken! Honestly i don't remember any "*" anywhere. I will get the original hard copy in another hour or so and should be able to confirm.

I am sure the offer would be public sooner or later, it is just that there are concerns from the owners also, how certain group of people would want to play around with such information. Harsh reality of India and no one wants to take any chance by putting all the details in public forum and in writing.

This was across the table discussion with some amount of documentation and legality taken care. It was transparent and uniform for Striple owners in BLR, that much i can vouch. This brought back some credibility into the conversation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by udainxs View Post
That apart, they are pushing the Street mentioning top speeds in excess of 230kmph and the top speed in each gear etc!

Earlier, just the '106' figure sufficed!
Yup it indeed is a brilliant bike even at 85 ps, but ego's and emotions got hurt big time. Will take some more selling now to convince "Heard" someone touched 230 with optional silencer and old tune yday, so this still ain't that neutered as our ego's are.

Last edited by Jaggu : 15th December 2014 at 15:53.
Jaggu is online now   (2) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 15th December 2014, 16:18   #518
BHPian
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Pune
Posts: 97
Thanked: 21 Times
Default Re: Triumph India: Sold Bikes in India with fake performance figures!

Quote:
Originally Posted by neil.jericho View Post
Can you share the details of the offers with the rest of us?
Well, given that most negotiations are still on-going and Triumph has not officially released anything, i am not sure its the right idea to post all the details on a public forum. Though i don't think there is any official gag order from Triumph, on my part, i haven't accepted any offers yet so still need to see the fine print.

Quote:
Originally Posted by udainxs View Post
That apart, they are pushing the Street mentioning top speeds in excess of 230kmph and the top speed in each gear etc!
Yeah, AFAIK, there is no immediate price correction anytime soon. If and when it happens, it will destroy any resale value the existing bikes have

I don't think a stock 79PS Striple will do true 230kmph

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaggu View Post
"Heard" someone touched 230 with optional silencer and old tune yday, so this still ain't that neutered as our ego's are.
What old tune?

Last edited by A_v_i : 15th December 2014 at 16:21.
A_v_i is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th December 2014, 16:54   #519
Team-BHP Support
 
Jaggu's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 17,752
Thanked: 7,471 Times
Default Re: Triumph India: Sold Bikes in India with fake performance figures!



Quote:
Originally Posted by A_v_i View Post
What old tune?
Arrow tune for arrows pipe, but this bike was supposedly on another aftermarket pipe with arrow tune if i am not mistaken.

Just saw the letter, no "*' or obelix in it, if i wish to i can speak freely.
Jaggu is online now   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 15th December 2014, 16:57   #520
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 2,534
Thanked: 984 Times
Default Re: Triumph India: Sold Bikes in India with fake performance figures!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricci View Post
I understand your sentiment, but if that "dream" bike has no worthy rivals, current or expected, why decline your dream for this alone? I don't think Bonnie class of riders are that hp-centric, as compared to supersport riders for whom hp is not just performance but also bragging rights?
Agree completely! I dont have any other marquee or bike in sight and its not for the HP alone that I like the bike. And Avinash's extensive and detailed updates in his thread egged me on more to get one in the next couple of years. It was just the integrity of the company but going by the last few pages, they seem to be working towards ensuring customer satisfaction for disgruntled folks. So the Bonnie is still in the sights!
abhinav.s is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th December 2014, 17:01   #521
Senior - BHPian
 
naveenroy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 1,319
Thanked: 694 Times
Default Re: Triumph India: Sold Bikes in India with fake performance figures!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaggu View Post
Just saw the letter, no "*' or obelix in it, if i wish to i can speak freely.
Aha, that is good. So, as a responsible moderator of a world-famous motoring forum, you should speak freely
naveenroy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th December 2014, 17:08   #522
Team-BHP Support
 
Jaggu's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 17,752
Thanked: 7,471 Times
Default Re: Triumph India: Sold Bikes in India with fake performance figures!

Quote:
Originally Posted by naveenroy View Post
Aha, that is good. So, as a responsible moderator of a world-famous motoring forum, you should speak freely
It is just an acknowledgment letter that says: "what happened", explanation rather clarification on "what happened" and finally how they are compensating me, to retain my confidence in the brand.

As a private individual i also have the right to keep my matters private also But honestly in my field of work, this can be termed at the best as an acknowledgement letter and a gentlemans sign off ending the matter with the company.
Jaggu is online now   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 15th December 2014, 17:30   #523
Senior - BHPian
 
naveenroy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 1,319
Thanked: 694 Times
Default Re: Triumph India: Sold Bikes in India with fake performance figures!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaggu View Post
It is just an acknowledgment letter that says: "what happened", explanation rather clarification on "what happened" and finally how they are compensating me, to retain my confidence in the brand.

As a private individual i also have the right to keep my matters private also But honestly in my field of work, this can be termed at the best as an acknowledgement letter and a gentlemans sign off ending the matter with the company.
Hey, I was kidding but yes, seems like a good ending finally. But hopefully, Triumph will put out an official announcement in a few days when they've closed all discussions with the bike owners. They should seriously rebuild the trust that they have surely lost - make an open statement, not behind closed doors.

This will surely make or break future customers for them. Even I have a Bonneville in there somewhere in my signature
naveenroy is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 15th December 2014, 19:49   #524
Senior - BHPian
 
Ajaybiz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 1,354
Thanked: 140 Times
Default Re: Triumph India: Sold Bikes in India with fake performance figures!

So it's over two weeks now and no confirmation from them about their plan of action, or they themselves are confused that what to do in situation like this?
Good thing is all CBU models are still showing international market power output in their Indian web site.
Ajaybiz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th December 2014, 20:52   #525
BHPian
 
RiderZone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Hyderabad
Posts: 121
Thanked: 161 Times
Default Re: Triumph India: Sold Bikes in India with fake performance figures!

Quote:
Originally Posted by naveenroy View Post
Hahaha, did any of you read this article on RiderZone - http://riderzone.in/what-happened-3rd-december-2014/

Did Triumph really do that? Damn, what a PR agency.
Yeah that happened

Quote:
Originally Posted by anilp View Post
This is how someone else dealt with Vodafone in a similar situation.

https://www.google.co.in/url?sa=t&so...lHZTNaNx6jkBhw
Cool! I took down the original article, but re-posted it here after making sure Triumph had no opportunity to harass me again.

Anyways, the attempt to include international bikers by posting on ADVrider has been a giant failure. That place is so unbelievably racist and useless! Team-BHP is the first forum that I'm active on, so I guess you guys have spoiled me You can see the ADVrider thread here.

As far as the recent comments made by fellow TBhian trivializing the issue are concerned, I find them to be mechanical and unfair. Any motorcycle purchase, no matter how small the amount, has an emotional side attached to it, apart from the obvious economic one. You can't just say "Oh this company cheated you and is now ready to do these little things to make it all go away, so you should totally accept that without a single squeal of opposition". I don't understand that attitude, or the purpose of sharing such thoughts in a public forum.
RiderZone is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
My Triumph Bonneville. EDIT: Sold! mobike008 Superbikes & Imports 1046 27th June 2017 02:44
Triumph Bikes gendarmee Vintage Cars & Classics in India 48 24th September 2014 22:56
Fake Rockford Fosgate Speakers being sold in market blueraven316 In-Car Entertainment 19 13th May 2007 02:38


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 08:25.

Copyright 2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks