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Old 1st June 2010, 19:40   #121
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This one is just about 60-70 bhp,and unlike FZ and other indian bikes is rear heavy with approx ratio being about 44/56.it has a very powerful rear brake,really bitefull (because of big ventilated disk and reall mamoth 3pot dual acting nissin caliper,also bigger surface area of tyre helps ),once i complete the whole thing,i will test brakes viz a viz indian bikes (bullet and fz ect).But you got that right,once i jump over the 100bhp bracket,i would need better front brakes as well,dual disk set up will be order of the day i guess,ofcourse i will have to fabricate and design a few brackets,but that isnt too tough to make brackets,or is it?
Regarding tyre,yes i would love to change it to 240/50 motorcycle tyre,i will change it as soon as i find one(don want to import yet another thing Via Ebay),lets see when that happnes!
This bike is just a rough copy,i am learning the tricks of the trade of custom cruiser building,lack of equipments make it even better learning experience.Next project i will do quite neatly as i have gained valuable experience regarding things to be taken care off on such project!Thanks
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Old 15th June 2010, 16:32   #122
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Originally Posted by dustom_99 View Post
I did not use any fancy space age material, usually mild steel seamless tubes of dia 2"-3" are used largely.,welding has been commonly used electric arc with 3.15mm flux coated electrode with medium to deep medium penetration characteristics.

engine i bought was 12k,gearbox zen 6k,standard specs,now valve lift increased by 2mm,inlet dia(manifold increased ),little bump in compression,now running close to 10:1(approx),machined flywheel,flywheel power came out to be 67bhp.

i had to waste a lot of money in developing new solutions for the problems i faced,
approx expenditure has been around 1.7l,out of which i guess 45-50 % has been wastage.
let me know what are you planning ,may be i could give some inputs!
best of luck jeepster
great work ! i must say. I am curious about the fact that in the longitudnal engine setup as yours, doesnt anti-torque from the engine produce the body roll problem at high speeds or sudden bursts?

secondly, i am wondering why dont you go for a really small final drive ratio to use all that torque for greater top speed/powerband usability.

In layman terms if a 1000cc 4 pot 60+bhp engine has the kind of torque/rpm to cruize at 130 kmph with 4 people plus 900 kg body, i wonder what it can do to a 70 kg rider plus 250 kg approx bikes weight.

hope i am making sense.

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Old 15th June 2010, 16:45   #123
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great work ! i must say. I am curious about the fact that in the longitudnal engine setup as yours, doesnt anti-torque from the engine produce the body roll problem at high speeds or sudden bursts?
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Old 15th June 2010, 20:50   #124
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Anti Torque?? what sort of Term is anti torque? but the way i understand your question,my guess is you are asking about inertial gyroscopic effect that the flywheel produces while accelerating or de accelerating the engine! I guess you might have copied the term from various TV programs ,where half of the MBA in mass communication guyz does not even know ABC,and come out with various new terms!
Anyways inertia of various rotatating parts specially crank shaft and flywheel(they are the heaviest) does produce a force which tend to tilt motorcycle towards left ,while under sudden bust of throttle,and towards right when throttle is closed suddenly from a wide open position.
This effect is quite famous in USA,and those guyz usually call is torque reaction i guess.in there world this is suppose to be macho as it gets,and this effect alone sells half of the V-8 motorcycles in US.
In zen engine this effect is not too prominent,it does give tilters while one is standing still and playing with throttle,but nothing much .while moving one will hardly notice it(as the engine does not have enough power and torque to accelerate the rotational masses significantly enough to cause any noticiable difference)

another thing is,i had calculated what sort of gearing ratios i want,and already running quite low final wheel ratio,and first gear takes very close to 55-60kmph(exact i will tell you later),while still able to start and get rolling in 3rd gear,hang around 100kmph in 4th.
Longer gear ratios would increase the top speed,but up to a limit only,if you run too big a ratio,there will not be enough torque left to even hold the speed from previous gear,let alone increase it.
Gear ratio should only be increased if you are consistently hitting the red line of rev limit.
I think its better to get to a 170kmph in a hurry,then to get to 190kmph in a two days ride with wide open throttle.how many times will i ever reach 190 on our highways,but there will be plenty of days when i ll need to get from 100 to 150 ,slow down and again 150 in seconds.
I am not saying this will do all that stuff in seconds but that is the idea in my mind,not the top speed.
update on project is,i havent touched tools for past 15 days i guess.did not find time,but i am thinking of quiting my job and start making big cruisers .thats the only way i will find enough time and be happy i guess
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Old 16th June 2010, 13:11   #125
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Anti Torque?? what sort of Term is anti torque? but the way i understand your question,my guess is you are asking about inertial gyroscopic effect that the flywheel produces while accelerating or de accelerating the engine! I guess you might have copied the term from various TV programs ,where half of the MBA in mass communication guyz does not even know ABC,and come out with various new terms!
Anyways inertia of various rotatating parts specially crank shaft and flywheel(they are the heaviest) does produce a force which tend to tilt motorcycle towards left ,while under sudden bust of throttle,and towards right when throttle is closed suddenly from a wide open position.
This effect is quite famous in USA,and those guyz usually call is torque reaction i guess.in there world this is suppose to be macho as it gets,and this effect alone sells half of the V-8 motorcycles in US.
In zen engine this effect is not too prominent,it does give tilters while one is standing still and playing with throttle,but nothing much .while moving one will hardly notice it(as the engine does not have enough power and torque to accelerate the rotational masses significantly enough to cause any noticiable difference)

another thing is,i had calculated what sort of gearing ratios i want,and already running quite low final wheel ratio,and first gear takes very close to 55-60kmph(exact i will tell you later),while still able to start and get rolling in 3rd gear,hang around 100kmph in 4th.
Longer gear ratios would increase the top speed,but up to a limit only,if you run too big a ratio,there will not be enough torque left to even hold the speed from previous gear,let alone increase it.
Gear ratio should only be increased if you are consistently hitting the red line of rev limit.
I think its better to get to a 170kmph in a hurry,then to get to 190kmph in a two days ride with wide open throttle.how many times will i ever reach 190 on our highways,but there will be plenty of days when i ll need to get from 100 to 150 ,slow down and again 150 in seconds.
I am not saying this will do all that stuff in seconds but that is the idea in my mind,not the top speed.
update on project is,i havent touched tools for past 15 days i guess.did not find time,but i am thinking of quiting my job and start making big cruisers .thats the only way i will find enough time and be happy i guess

hmmm. You got my point! actually anti-torque is a term relevant to helicopter design where in engine tends to produce a force in the opposite direction to that of the spinning rotor, because of which the chopper tends to rotate in the opposite direction. Thats why need another propeller at the end of its tail to counter balance it.

It the same effect you see when you zap open the throttle of a car engine and the engine rocks back and forth once

Anyways, how did you deal with the front drive differencial from the GB did you lock it on one side or remove/bypass it?
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Old 21st June 2010, 20:25   #126
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ok folks,news is that I have managed to crack the Hydraulic code,now the clutch is being operated by power hydraulics,now by human power.however the clutch operation is pretty much manual,all the controlling of engaging and disengaging still depends on the human hand,so one can ride on half clutch,jerk release it ect as you can do with normal motorcycle clutch.
this is a giant step as now with this even bigger and more powerful engines can be used without having to worry about how there bigger and harder to pull clutch could be operated with hand.one way of solving the problem was using an automatic transmission which the boss hoss did to avoid this problem.but i would call it bypassing the problem,not solving it.

Also i have gained valuable knowhow about designing hydraulic systems,and soon i will be doing lot of funny stuff with hydraulics such as ride hight control systems,seat hight adjustment etc.

tomorrow i will post a video of clutch operation.and i am also purchasing a verna crdi engine,just yesterday i was in meerut,where i found a clean engined total loss verna.the shop owner is asking 1.60lack for entire package(engine,gearbox,ecu,wiring harness,radiator,air filter box.)by the time i left the deal had broken down to 1.20.
i think in about 1.1l this is a good deal. please suggest if you guys think otherwise
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Old 21st June 2010, 20:43   #127
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Quote:
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hmmm. You got my point! actually anti-torque is a term relevant to helicopter design where in engine tends to produce a force in the opposite direction to that of the spinning rotor, because of which the chopper tends to rotate in the opposite direction. Thats why need another propeller at the end of its tail to counter balance it.

It the same effect you see when you zap open the throttle of a car engine and the engine rocks back and forth once

Anyways, how did you deal with the front drive differencial from the GB did you lock it on one side or remove/bypass it?
effect of rotation of heli's rotor is pure and simple Newtons Law of action and reaction.if rotor rotates in clockwise direction,equal and opposite force is exerted to Heli.to counter the rotation of body of heli,tail rotor is employed.
But this is not same as what we encounter with automobile engine.

In helicopter the reaction is ever present,Helicopter rotors do not accelerate or retard suddenly,there acceleartion and retardation is gradual and never sudden and is controlled very accurately by electronics,sudden change is centrifugal force,can actually rip apart rotor blades,and also creates difference between reaction force produces by tail rotor and main rotor reaction,which could send heli into a spin(as both main rotor and tail rotor cannot accelerate at same rate because of difference in there size and mass).

In automobile engines,the force is only observed while engine accelerates at a very high rate of retards.The tilting force is Absolute Zero at constant speed.
Both forces are different in nature!

As for the gearbox,i have redesigned the lay shaft,Differential has been taken out,and space left empty by differential has been chopped ,making gearbox quite smaller and lighter.
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Old 9th July 2010, 19:42   #128
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you are the Mr.Burt Munro from Haridwar.... keep up the good work dude.. so did you finish your Falcon? update us with ur input.
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Old 9th July 2010, 23:39   #129
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yes the motorcycle is completed,and riding well,now i need to make or buy a fuel tank,headlight and bit of body work like rear cowl side panels etc.i plan to make most of the stuff myself,just now finding time for sheet metal fabrication as it is more time consuming job without too much of tech involved.i have started turbo diesel motorcycle project as well,that you guys can catch in my other thread.
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Old 18th July 2010, 02:17   #130
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respect! and total admiration! - two things that I can say about you and your work!

I mean Hat's off. I always thought of myself as a petrol-head, but you have given a new definition to that word.

Dustom - awesome work!

the falcon (Zen bike)- I mean I just read about an RD350 engine in a FZ16, then a Zen engine put on a bike!! WOW!

the falcon 2 (Verna -CRDi) - I have the same engine on my car and when the turbo kicks on it - it is fast - I can just imagine how it does on a bike.

Godspeed on the LandSpeed record!
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Old 19th October 2010, 21:29   #131
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HI Dushyant

Sorry for bumping this thread but there hasn't been any updates to this since july. i went through this thread in a single breath and must say what a journey it has been.

So what are the current updates to this thread . Is bike road ready and running ?

What about the Verna Diesel Engine project ?
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Old 21st October 2010, 15:12   #132
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Well,thread has not been updated for a reason.i have filed a few applications for grant of patents regarding some of novel concepts used. My lawyer adviced me against using media before that stuf is done. What I can tel u is,falcon has been compleately re designed ,frame remade using lighter material and cad n simulation.bit of engine mods aswell. Be with me 4 a while,trust me both will be worth the wait. Cheers

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Old 22nd October 2010, 23:31   #133
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i have filed a few applications for grant of patents regarding some of novel concepts used. My lawyer adviced me against using media before that stuf is done.
all i can say is best of luck.
AFAIK the patent process is very lengthy it will take months for confirmation.
so at least share some pics.

Quote:
What I can tel u is,falcon has been compleately re designed ,frame remade using lighter material and cad n simulation.
where did you did the CAD job?
at home or from any design Firm?

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Old 25th October 2010, 13:54   #134
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Patents will take take time,as much as 18 months or so,however once the application is accepted , patent pending status will apply.
And this dewali , not only pics but burn out videos and lil bit of touring video will be posted on youtube and TBHP.
Also doing a 400bhp 2.4l turbo vtec motorcycle in 2011(a guy is intrested ,says he will get me the tuned motor from japan) lets see.
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Old 4th November 2010, 18:38   #135
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Here are the current pics ,sorry for low quality,I thought sony was good.HUH!

Mods please edit the title to : Pics Uploaded .I am not able to edit the thread title,please advice how to do it!
Attached Thumbnails
'1000cc custom cruiser, project completed and pics uploaded"-dsc00010.jpg  

'1000cc custom cruiser, project completed and pics uploaded"-dsc00011.jpg  

'1000cc custom cruiser, project completed and pics uploaded"-dsc00012.jpg  

'1000cc custom cruiser, project completed and pics uploaded"-dsc00013.jpg  


Last edited by dustom_99 : 4th November 2010 at 18:45. Reason: change of title
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