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Old 31st July 2009, 03:55   #31
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Originally Posted by maxj2005 View Post
I didnt rent it my friends did .I rode as pillion but did drrive for a few miles.

To your point I have had some experience riding R1s and Ninjas in India last year.It was'nt a long drive but I felt comfortable riding either of them.

Getting a used 5-6 hundred Sbk I am a little reluctant .But I will certainly count as a factor in my decision.How much/model should I expect for a used 5-6 hundred Sbk?
Not bad then,atleast you have a feel of how the R1s & Ninjas are.
IMO,Rs 6-7 lakhs should get you a decent 600cc bike,thats pretty new.

If you haven't had a chance to check out the CBR, then do give that a try.
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Old 31st July 2009, 12:17   #32
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Not bad then,atleast you have a feel of how the R1s & Ninjas are.
IMO,Rs 6-7 lakhs should get you a decent 600cc bike,thats pretty new.

If you haven't had a chance to check out the CBR, then do give that a try.
A friend of mine picked up a secondhand 08 Busa for 7 lakhs a few months ago. So i figure the 600cc bikes should be cheaper than 6-7 lakhs.
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Old 31st July 2009, 16:41   #33
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Originally Posted by speedy View Post
A friend of mine picked up a secondhand 08 Busa for 7 lakhs a few months ago. So i figure the 600cc bikes should be cheaper than 6-7 lakhs.
Plenty has changed since then mate if you know what i mean
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Old 31st July 2009, 16:48   #34
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Originally Posted by straight6 View Post
Actually, you don't have to take my word for this. Just ask Stuart and he'll tell you the same thing.

The 600 obviously cant keep up with the 14 in a straight line but the road to Lonavla isn't a straight one. I'll surely take you on if I can get my hands on a 600 after the rains.

Motorcycling is about cornering. Anyone can go fast in a straight line. There's 0 skill in that. I've seen videos of women maxing out Busa's in a straight line.
You are forgetting that this is not a Vmax or something. What I mean is that its not only meant for straight lines. 14R is known for good cornering, thats where it takes the Busa. Personally, whichever 600's I've been with to lonavla have never been able to keep up with the 14R. Its really quite simple, the 14R or even Busa will have the weight advantage. Hence it can get into & out of corners at higher speeds. Still, would love to show it to you, rather than chat about it.
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Old 31st July 2009, 21:49   #35
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Still, would love to show it to you, rather than chat about it.
I know but if this showdown happens, can you arrange for someone to record it for our viewing pleasure? Someone with a helmet or dash cam following you?
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Old 31st July 2009, 21:52   #36
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Erm. If all else are kept the same (weight, rake, trail, wheelbase & rider capabilities) and the only difference is in power, the only way that the more powerful bike would take on the lesser one is on a straight line.

Technically, cornering isn't about the the rider's capabilities alone, but the bike's as well. A corner, depending upon its angle of curvature & banking, can only sustain 'X' kmph through it.

A faster bike is only faster through corners because of gain on the braking points (better brakes shorten your entry line) and exit line, which also depends upon the centre of gravity of the bike and rider weight/positioning.

Personally speaking, a 600RR is plenty enough. Apart from the straights through the expressway section, the 600RR would actually be faster than any litre class through the corners, from what I've personally seen...the 600s are far more effortless to pilot around the twisties. Not that a big bike can't keep up, but it requires a lot more strength to muster the same speed through corners, which is all the edge that a smaller bike's rider would need.

On second thoughts max, if you DO have a Yamaha in mind, wait for the FZ1, due soon.
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Old 1st August 2009, 01:25   #37
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Originally Posted by insaneroller View Post
Still, would love to show it to you, rather than chat about it.
Pardon me, but I would love to take you up on that offer as well.
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Old 2nd August 2009, 01:28   #38
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Max, from the options listed out by you, the CBR 1000 RR seems to be the most viable option for you. Like someone mentioned, that bike handles brilliantly and it would be most effortless from the three options listed by you.

The R1 from what i have heard and read is more of a track weapon than half a decent leisure commute through the city. The 2007-08 had a crap ventilaton system, which meant your bike would always be running hot at 05-6 degrees odd whenever in city. Yamaha may have improved this on the new gen R1, please try taking an etensive test ride of the new R1 while you are in the US instead of falling for the sexiest set of two wheels available in the country.

The Hayabusa, God knows I would love to own one someday, but I have listed out a bunch of cons against the Busa with respect to your choice of bike.


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Originally Posted by insaneroller View Post

In any country, being fastest is a trophy.
Trophy (?), Lol. Having one of the fastest production motorcycles in the world is one thing, and riding it to its ideal (and not extreme) potential another.
To me it only certifies that the owner has bucket loads of moolah to afford a trick machine, little taste, and just about nothing else.

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Originally Posted by insaneroller View Post
So see the reviews of 14R vs Busa 09. 14R is quicker to take off & better cornering. Busa is not as badly restricted as the stock 14R, so it takes over in a straight line past 260kmph. Thats is when both are stock.

Now read the reviews of when both are fully opened up with the works. Busa had no chance to catch it. Thats the fact mate. Not because I own the 14R, but just check the reviews first before concluding
The above is a never ending war, its been around since forever on most forums.
Tojo, I've been smitten by the Kwacker bug since a really long time, makes me smile whenever I see one. I probably have even spent more time on Ninja forums than many Kawasaki owners may have. But, the Hayabusa is about authority, speed, power and beyond.
The Hayabusa with its wierdly designed front end and low stance is probably the only motorycle that sold rolling units inspite of not being good looking, and yet does the sales with not much change from its basic avatar from a decade ago.
The Zx-14 may be a fraction faster or whatever than the Hayabusa, but then that was the aim Kawasaki had after they couldn't get onto the act with the Zx-12 inspite of much consant effort they put in through the years. The Hayabusa instead was a fresh approach, and made with the sole aim of being the most imposing motorcycle around, for its power and oodles of character.
And, the Suzuki management did wonders, they struck and how.

The comparo between the Hayabusa and the Zx-14 is very similar to comparing the Veyron and the Mclaren F1 GTR (barring the prices and no. of units ofcourse). The Veyron was made to beat the Mclaren which it did, and the GTR was made from something else. What you choose then is simply your choice.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by insaneroller View Post
Even if I am not able to exploit 50% of a Busa's or 14R's potential, I would go for them.
The title should have read like Busa or 14R, because CBR1000 and R1 are smaller in cc and a lot smaller in size. In my opinion, you should look for Busa or 14R. They are both HUUUUUUUUUUGE. They guarantee maximum attention on road which is a bonus.
You do realise that you are suggesting a first big bike here, and not a second or third. The advantages you mention (size and volcano of power) are clearly the most immediate shortcomings for the fresh import rider.
A few rides on friends' or rented joy rides cannot make up for a few thousand miles of worthy ownership experience.
The Busa, irrespective how much I wanted to own one after the Thunderace is just not a first bike for anyone with a head on their shoulders.

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Originally Posted by insaneroller View Post
14R is known for good cornering, thats where it takes the Busa.
Takes it where, for a stroll? Heck, gone are the days when we had a superbike that did not handle in a coherent manner. Now, and since a few years from now, there have been bikes that handle well, and a few that handle exceptionally well.

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Originally Posted by insaneroller View Post
Personally, whichever 600's I've been with to lonavla have never been able to keep up with the 14R.
Those must have been single pots with 600 cc graphics and probably a NOS decal. Or to be fair, probably some noobs on their first bunch of Sunday rides.

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Originally Posted by insaneroller View Post
Still, would love to show it to you, rather than chat about it.
So what stakes are you guys at, winner takes all eh?

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Originally Posted by nitro.1000bhp View Post
Also I have heard of a scheme where NRIs can bring down there own vehicle when they come back to india for no duty costs at all. If the scheme is still applicable you can buy a litre bike there for almost half the price sold over here.. Warranty might be an issue though..
I can most definitely vouch that what you have heard is utter rubbish. There is no such scheme that exists, the only advantage a TR import provides is that you can import a motorcycle older than foure years if you have owned the same abroad for a minimum period of one year. Please get over it.

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Originally Posted by Dante View Post
But in some of the reviews i read the cbr is better than R1, i m not so sure.
I am yet to read a review that does not indicate that the test rider is not in love with the new Blade. The 2008-09 fireblade is apparently pure awesomeness!

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Originally Posted by YC.BALENO.CHD View Post
Get the Zx-10R screw everything else . end of the story .
Have you ridden a Zx-10R? A recent version?
From the reviews I have read over the years, the 2006-07 Zie ex ten did not have the neck breaking first gear, and lacked the superb top end of the 2004-05. Early reviews had suggested the 2008 10 was back, and almost as good as the first generation, but have heard nothing exceptional being carried on through this year.
Besides, the 2008 Zx-10 did not look the panache to stand against half a sexy looking bike.

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Originally Posted by YC.BALENO.CHD View Post
if you are not 6 foot+ you wont be able to sit on a busa properly .
That is another misconception on this thread, from first hand experience, the Busa is a great bike for the short, well built rider who has reaonable past experience on a biggie!

Quote:
Originally Posted by YC.BALENO.CHD View Post
and plus for indian roads busa is the most impractical because of its size and weight .
Could not have agreed more. My cousin who is almost 6 Feet and extremely broad built sometimes has issues chugging along his Busain daily traffic conditions. The Busa is what is has always been, a superb weekend touring motorcycle, or a lethal drag weapon.


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Originally Posted by YC.BALENO.CHD View Post
try riding the R1 for more than half an hour continuously in a little bit of traffic and then see what all joints in your body start paining .
+1
For the first few 15-20 minutes on an R1 everyone begins to think how comfortable the R1 is, just about everything falls into place. A fewmore minutes and wrists start to ache, the forearm goes sore, and the R1 becomes one of the uncomfortable bike to be aboard. Don't even get me started on how hot the frame gets in traffic conditions, ask Straight6 and he could possible write a fully blown review about the heating characteristics of the R1.

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Old 2nd August 2009, 13:08   #39
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Originally Posted by manson View Post
Have you ridden a Zx-10R? A recent version?
From the reviews I have read over the years, the 2006-07 Zie ex ten did not have the neck breaking first gear, and lacked the superb top end of the 2004-05. Early reviews had suggested the 2008 10 was back, and almost as good as the first generation, but have heard nothing exceptional being carried on through this year.
Besides, the 2008 Zx-10 did not look the panache to stand against half a sexy looking bike.
yes a latest ZX-10R was just imported 2 months back . personally i found it better looking than R1 , for some reason i dont like the look of the R1 and the CBR's front end too for that matter . what is wrong with the japs i just cant understand , they are hiring korean designers i guess .


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Originally Posted by manson View Post
That is another misconception on this thread, from first hand experience, the Busa is a great bike for the short, well built rider who has reasonable past experience on a biggie!
Yes but i am 5"8 and it was a horror stopping at traffic lights on the busa . obvibously as one gets used to it , these horrors are erradicated .


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Originally Posted by manson View Post
Could not have agreed more. My cousin who is almost 6 Feet and extremely broad built sometimes has issues chugging along his Busain daily traffic conditions. The Busa is what is has always been, a superb weekend touring motorcycle, or a lethal drag weapon.
yes , exactly my point . i would never ever buy a busa if i have the greens , to commute daily to collge in city traffic , even in chandigarh which has the most easy flowing traffic in the country .

Quote:
Originally Posted by manson View Post
+1
For the first few 15-20 minutes on an R1 everyone begins to think how comfortable the R1 is, just about everything falls into place. A fewmore minutes and wrists start to ache, the forearm goes sore, and the R1 becomes one of the uncomfortable bike to be aboard. Don't even get me started on how hot the frame gets in traffic conditions, ask Straight6 and he could possible write a fully blown review about the heating characteristics of the R1.
the R1 and R6 are the sort of bikes which are taken to the tracks regularly by the owners . track focussed bikes . not for the city at all , and yes the heating issue ofcourse .



I would say consider a ducati extend your budget a bit . it is hard to ride , Yes . Its got mad power delivery, yes . but boy .. just look at it .
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Old 2nd August 2009, 18:09   #40
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Originally Posted by YC.BALENO.CHD View Post
yes a latest ZX-10R was just imported 2 months back .
Any inputs on the riding experience?

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Originally Posted by YC.BALENO.CHD View Post
for some reason i dont like the look of the R1
Thats wierd, the R1 over the years has always had the most deirable front end, but then thats probably why people say looks are subjective.

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Originally Posted by YC.BALENO.CHD View Post
the CBR's front end too for that matter . what is wrong with the japs i just cant understand , they are hiring korean designers i guess .
True. The 2008 Fireblade was majorly criticised for its crap looking front end, but the bike is more than its front end, and the superb package that it is makes up for the ugly front end. Infact beyond the styling I even hate the christmas tree mirrors on the Fireblade.

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Originally Posted by YC.BALENO.CHD View Post
Yes but i am 5"8 and it was a horror stopping at traffic lights on the busa . obvibously as one gets used to it , these horrors are erradicated .
Are you big built though, the problem may be more due to not so strong frame than being an average height. If I am not mistaken the Busa has one of the lowest seat height in recent times, so I guess the difficulty must have been mostly cos' of the weight of the Busa.

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Old 2nd August 2009, 19:14   #41
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manson: buying a busa or a zx14 does not mean that the person has no knowledge about bikes or is merely going for the fastest bike out there. And they are no trick machines.They are the epitome of motorcycle engineering. On the contrary it may also mean that the person wants the absolute best. You may like a 600cc or a 1L , but that does not make the open class is lacking in anything.
Coming to the busa. its the ultimate firebreather. i ve had it for close to 6 months.For the size and weight its a commendable handler. nothing like a litle class but commendable nevertheless.Its a heavy bike and initially its like hauling a 18 wheeler. But slowly you gel with the bike like a glove and hand.
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Old 2nd August 2009, 19:46   #42
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Originally Posted by manson View Post
Any inputs on the riding experience?
personally i found the ZX-10r the most fun to ride in terms of rider involvement and also it has more useable power on the street , havnt ridden the CBR yet so cannot compare .

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Originally Posted by manson View Post
Thats wierd, the R1 over the years has always had the most deirable front end, but then thats probably why people say looks are subjective.
in terms of looks i like no full-faired bike by heart . when it comes to road presence IMO ducati streetfighter beats them all hands down .


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Originally Posted by manson View Post
Are you big built though, the problem may be more due to not so strong frame than being an average height. If I am not mistaken the Busa has one of the lowest seat height in recent times, so I guess the difficulty must have been mostly cos' of the weight of the Busa.
no , im not that well bulit . mostly skinny . i wouldnt even had a test ride if i had no previous superbike experience . seat height is low but the bike is too broad .
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Old 2nd August 2009, 19:50   #43
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manson: buying a busa or a zx14 does not mean that the person has no knowledge about bikes or is merely going for the fastest bike out there. And they are no trick machines.They are the epitome of motorcycle engineering. On the contrary it may also mean that the person wants the absolute best. You may like a 600cc or a 1L , but that does not make the open class is lacking in anything.
Coming to the busa. its the ultimate firebreather. i ve had it for close to 6 months.For the size and weight its a commendable handler. nothing like a litle class but commendable nevertheless.Its a heavy bike and initially its like hauling a 18 wheeler. But slowly you gel with the bike like a glove and hand.
living with the busa as a daily ride is a pain that you might agree since you have owned one ! feedback please ! and where is it now ? sold off ?

obvious you cant compare the busa and ZX14R with the 600's and litre class bikes . thats not we are doing here . its more like what are the person's requirements .
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Old 3rd August 2009, 00:23   #44
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Originally Posted by bigron View Post
manson: buying a busa or a zx14 does not mean that the person has no knowledge about bikes or is merely going for the fastest bike out there. And they are no trick machines.They are the epitome of motorcycle engineering. On the contrary it may also mean that the person wants the absolute best. You may like a 600cc or a 1L , but that does not make the open class is lacking in anything.
Coming to the busa. its the ultimate firebreather. i ve had it for close to 6 months.For the size and weight its a commendable handler. nothing like a litle class but commendable nevertheless.Its a heavy bike and initially its like hauling a 18 wheeler. But slowly you gel with the bike like a glove and hand.
Bigron, I suggest you read post # 38 on this thread once again before jumping to a conclusion about my opinions.
Like I have mentioned somewhere in that post, the Hayabusa is to bikes what the Mclaren F1 GTR is to cars. I intend to own one someday, infact I wanted to buy one before I bought the 954, but I strongly maintain that the Hayabusa, or even the ZX-14 should not be a first superbike for anybody, not only for its insane power, but even handling the bucket loads of weight is a major con.

I understand that gradually one gets a hang of the bike, and moving around gets much easier and balanced in a few weeks, and do some crazy straight line speeds in a couple of months. But I can guarantee that the rider will not be able to corner, or coordinate the braking and gear shifts half as well as a rider who has had some reasonable riding time aboard a smaller bike before jumping onto the Hypertourer bandwagon.

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no , im not that well bulit . mostly skinny . i wouldnt even had a test ride if i had no previous superbike experience . seat height is low but the bike is too broad .
See, I told ya
The Hayabusa is probably the average height broad built rider's most perfect third biggie, which for its pedigree would make something to keep for a lifetime.

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Old 3rd August 2009, 00:25   #45
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Not bad then,atleast you have a feel of how the R1s & Ninjas are.
.
I would stick with your original advice. Get a 600 before going for a hyper bike like Busa or ZX14. I did have a 600 and currently have a zx14. They are two different animals as far as power is considered. You can get in trouble before you know it. Above 7K rpm the zx14 accelerated violently as if you arms are about to be ripped of from the socket and you will kiss the maruthi infront of you before the blink of an eye. Same goes for busa. I had taken busa on the track too. So please be prudent and safe.
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