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Old 11th May 2011, 11:16   #91
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Default Re: Garware to sell Hyosung 650 - 700 cc motorcycles. EDIT : Launched! Details on Pg.

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Originally Posted by DevilsOwn View Post
there are a dime a dozen supersports trading around in the used bike market. Got one myself last week 12k on the odo (that's nothing for a bike capable of doing 50000 miles, not kms) looks/rides as new. Most importantly, fully legal.
dime a dozen? legal ones? where? Bangalore? thats a pretty rare thing, more so in hyd, pls do lemme know if you come across any good sbk with fully legal docs. pref intruder, would appreciate it a lot.

and congrats on you bike! am guessing it to be a R1? which year? and more imp, if you don't mind how much?



coming back to the topic, does anyone have any clue about who has been appointed as the hyosung dealer for hyd and when will it start up?

Last edited by aadix : 11th May 2011 at 11:18.
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Old 11th May 2011, 13:36   #92
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Default Re: Garware to sell Hyosung 650 - 700 cc motorcycles. EDIT : Launched! Details on Pg.

aadix: Thanks man, not an R1 (Superbike), am done with 1s owned 2 already, this ones an R6 (Supersport). Just got it to complete the Yammie collection. All will be on the market starting next month to get corresponding kwackers (1970s Z1000, 1984 Gpz900, ZX-11, ZX636, ZX12R, 04 ZX10R)

Dime a dozen is right buddy, saw quite a few bikes with the bill of entry and complete import papers (including some bought from DRI auction), RC, comprehensive insurance etc. Just gotta know where to look Also so a zillion grey ones.

In my opinion, an R6 or a CBR600RR or the likes which are 4-6 years old well kept with 10-20k on the odo make perfect sense for 4-6 lakhs (depending on the condition, especially if ridden by a fairweather rider only on weekends).
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Old 11th May 2011, 22:50   #93
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Default Re: Garware to sell Hyosung 650 - 700 cc motorcycles. EDIT : Launched! Details on Pg.

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Ricci - If paying 2x as much for a Hyosung is an issue (and a valid one at that because it has a questionable history here) you dont really have to buy it, there are a dime a dozen supersports trading around in the used bike market.Most importantly, fully legal.
Yes, I have some thoughts on similar lines, but even in Team BHP classifieds, all I found was ,in recent short search, a 1992 CBR600 for 400k. That's more than a bit much for a nearly 20 year old bike. From what I gather outside T-BHP, used prices still are 7+ , and the cheap ones are either not legal or 80s/90s models.

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Greatmana2000: To answer your rather profound question, I beg to differ. Bikes are not costlier than a car... for every Nano there is a Splendour which is cheaper (taking economy as an eg.), and for every Hayabusa/ZX12R/ZX14 (taking speed as an eg.), there are much more expensive Ferraris/Lambos.
True, but the comparison isn't of cheapest car vs cheapest bike or most expensive bike vs most expensive car. It's more like : 300k gets you an 800-1000cc car, but only a 250cc twin. 600k gets you a 1500cc car, but barely a 600cc supersport. Engineering complexity is greater for cars, so it must be the volumes that raise unit price of bikes so high , I wonder what kind of margins the manufacturers make on a $11000 600RR or a $13000 R-1 ( US price , double in India thanks to our gubmint levying generous duties ).
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Old 11th May 2011, 23:17   #94
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Default Re: Garware to sell Hyosung 650 - 700 cc motorcycles. EDIT : Launched! Details on Pg.

Ricci: Classifieds everywhere are usually full of people trying to make a fast buck quoting prices much higher than what they themselves paid for!! Not generalising, just something I've noticed.

But yeah, I still maintain there are dime a dozen legal bikes roaming around the countryside. Me and friends bought quite a few between ourselves last year!

Hunt. If a Hyosung doesnt satisfy the need, a full blown Supersport/Superbike surely will.
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Old 12th May 2011, 13:16   #95
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Default Re: Garware to sell Hyosung 650 - 700 cc motorcycles. EDIT : Launched! Details on Pg.

Guess what, i thing Hyosung deliveries have started as i spotted the first of many to hit the roads. The bike was extra silent and looked very nice, atleast to me that is. If i had not seen the emblem i would have mistaken it for a Honda or suzuki for sure. Here is a rear pic as thats all i could manage as the guy just rode off in traffic.
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Old 12th May 2011, 13:46   #96
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Default Re: Garware to sell Hyosung 650 - 700 cc motorcycles. EDIT : Launched! Details on Pg.

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Guess what, i thing Hyosung deliveries have started as i spotted the first of many to hit the roads. The bike was extra silent and looked very nice, atleast to me that is. If i had not seen the emblem i would have mistaken it for a Honda or suzuki for sure. Here is a rear pic as thats all i could manage as the guy just rode off in traffic.
That was quick Speedy. Nice shot. The rear looks very meaty owing to the end can and the tire.

The ergonomics look pretty aggressive, but i guess the rider it pretty tall too.

Waiting for the showroom to open up here so i can see them in the flesh.
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Old 12th May 2011, 14:02   #97
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Default Re: Garware to sell Hyosung 650 - 700 cc motorcycles. EDIT : Launched! Details on Pg.

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That was quick Speedy. Nice shot. The rear looks very meaty owing to the end can and the tire.

The ergonomics look pretty aggressive, but i guess the rider it pretty tall too.

Waiting for the showroom to open up here so i can see them in the flesh.
By the time i got the phone out of the pocket he was ahead of me, so could not get a side shot of the bike. I actually for a minute did think the bike was a GSX1000. She was in black and looked mean.

The rider is a tall person and if you notice his body posture he does not seem uncomfortable on it. So i guess the bike has a relaxed riding approach unlike the R1's and other bikes of its class. I am sure there would be a large nomber of this affordable sports bikes on the road soon. I just want to see how it would hold out against the Kawasaki's 600. I heard that too would be in a similar price bracket.
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Old 12th May 2011, 14:35   #98
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Default Re: Garware to sell Hyosung 650 - 700 cc motorcycles. EDIT : Launched! Details on Pg.

That is a great shot speedy, the rear is looking really really good owing to that huge exhaust and those big tyres. Here the deliveries will start only in June-July as per the manager of the showroom.

I had a good look at the bike and also a test ride for 3-4 kms + a pillion ride for 7-8 kms.
I loved the bike and the attention i was getting, it was a red/black gt650r, there is oodles of torque and you can just go from 30 to 130 in 3rd gear without any fuss, once in a lean the bike is stable and brakes are okay, heating too was alright though the 3-4 kms i rode was a clean open stretch.

The big fat tank does come in the way - am just 5"4 and 19 years old so no muscle etc but feet were planted and i had no issues handling the bike, taking u turns would be a task though.

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Old 15th May 2011, 10:59   #99
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Default Re: Garware to sell Hyosung 650 - 700 cc motorcycles. EDIT : Launched! Details on Pg.

Hi, am in the market for a SBK and am currently doing the rounds of all the dealers in Pune.
Went to the Hyosung showroom and had a close look at the GT650R. Got a feel of the seating position, starting and revving the bike.
I found the plastics used to be quite below average and was a bit disappointed to be honest. ,
Although the price tag is really tempting, 5.75 on road for the dual colour model, wasnt too impressed with the quality of fitments apart from the paint job which is quite good.

Hope the experts here can guide us as to whether these are indeed a good buy !

Cheers.
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Old 15th May 2011, 15:25   #100
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Default Re: Garware to sell Hyosung 650 - 700 cc motorcycles. EDIT : Launched! Details on Pg.

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Dime a dozen is right buddy, saw quite a few bikes with the bill of entry and complete import papers (including some bought from DRI auction), RC, comprehensive insurance etc. Just gotta know where to look Also so a zillion grey ones.

and what would those places be? do pass on the info about clean bikes brother, it would be a great help for many ppl here on the forum, who are looking out for a clean bike

no offense, but how can a 600cc be legally imported, afaik anything below 800cc cannot be imported at all. so how does the question of valid docs come in?


i have seen like a dozen bikes in the last one month claiming to be totally duty paid and all, but once you sit down the the docs, u'll see the most of them have about only 70% of the duty paid, some people are claiming frame bikes to be legal ones! guess it not their fault.

honestly in my hunt two years ago, it took me close to year to track down, a genuine import. same was the case when netchef was hunting for a clean bike.

also there is a lot of counterfeiting going on i believe, faking the docs for a grey market bike with the papers of a legal bike of the same vintage and so-on.

that said, if once can pick up a bike directly from the owner who has imported it, that would be the safest option.


anyways, getting back to the topic, any clue about the rumors of hyosung in talks with two Indian motorcycle companies for a sell out? and if-so will it effect the current tie up with garware?
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Old 15th May 2011, 22:46   #101
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Default Re: Garware to sell Hyosung 650 - 700 cc motorcycles. EDIT : Launched! Details on Pg.

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any clue about the rumors of hyosung in talks with two Indian motorcycle companies for a sell out? and if-so will it effect the current tie up with garware?
What?

Where did you come across this info? If some one can please confirm, as if its true, service might see an improvement along with a bit lowered price tag. (Ninja 650-R helping this cause to some extent)
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Old 16th May 2011, 01:21   #102
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Default Re: Garware to sell Hyosung 650 - 700 cc motorcycles. EDIT : Launched! Details on Pg.

Disclaimer - Long post coming up:

aadix: 2 years??? Took me just a week. I know what you mean, for every 9 grey bikes there is 1 which has clear titles. Am not sure how but somehow the legal ones fall into my lap, he he he, for eg. the R6 bought last weekend was imported by the seller himself, had a valid bill of entry with the appropriate duty amount with his passport number etc, and other supporting documents from the RTO.

Incidentally, he's on Tbhp too

Netchef = cbr900rr? I remember meeting him for a cuppa many years ago, sadly couldnt pick up his blade because I was more inclined towards another..

You can import any motorcycle you want on TR, there is no cc restriction as long as you pay the duty, it's as simple as that. Dont believe ANYTHING else you read anywhere.

Some tips for those who want to buy a used SBK:

1. Check the VIN (first thing.... use google, for help on what to look for and how)

2. Get info on the bike from anyone who knows the seller, someone must know its history, these bikes are unique enough to be known (lot of sports bikes are usually crashed, repainted, crashed again, repainted again, an easy way to figure that is a weird pain job or a lot of unnecessary aftermarkets, though it is unfair to generalise as a lot of people use aftermarkets on their whim too..), its ok to buy a crashed bike, except that the price has to be lowered and the repair has to have been top notch.

3. Import Papers for grey bikes: Ask for a bill of entry, see how much duty is on it, simple. If you see a 600/1000 with 50000 duty (part payment facility) on it, stay away. If you see a 600/1000 with 150000 duty on it, buy it, still makes sense, just put a lakh in a fixed deposit in the event that you are called by the DRI to clear the dues (usually duties for used bikes range between 2-4 lakhs, usually around the 3 mark), here again, in my experience bikes prior to 2002 usually have no issues because a lot of them are genuine TRs and besides the whole DRI crackdown was on the schmucks who were bringing them in by the truckloads post 05 dismantled and/or on fake TR with part duty. You can factor depreciation of the bikes value upto 70% from its sale price when negotiating for balance duties to be paid.

**There are fake and re-used bills of entry going around so be careful to match ALL data accurately with that mentioned ON the bike for sale**

4. RTO papers for grey bikes: The make and model should be accurate (eg. not R15 for an R1!), same goes with displacement, cylinders, weight, etc etc etc.. Typically, comprehensive insurance for a 4-6 year old 600/1000 should be in the range of 4000-6000 Rs with the valuation at 4-6 lakhs, Road tax should be in the region of 40000-60000 (for eg. my V Max has 45k, again with valuation of around 4.5L, the R6 has 52000), if everything falls in order, you are moving towards a legal bike. My friend almost bought a "legal" Hayabusa last week with no BOE, and 8k road tax on it. The sellers argument: It has a "Smartcard". Sorry, that makes NO difference. A 5 lakh machine cannot have 8k road tax (though I wish it did!) even if the BOE has gone "missing" over 5-10 years.

Briefly put, its ok to buy a grey bike provided the source is credible and the above basic parameters check out. For eg. If the BOE duty is less, you can bargain on the price and put some of that money aside to clear the duties yourself (something the DRI appreciates), if it has a crash history, further lowering of price, if it is legally imported BUT has faulty RTO papers (yes, strangely, that happens too), further price reduction (you can always get a fresh RC made simple because your bike is not an R15 or an FZ15, it is an R1 or an FZ1.)

So all in all, as I said earlier, for 4-6 lakhs, it is well possible to get a fully legal 600/1000 sports bike (or any bike for that matter.) by using your common sense.

The places to look? I call a few friends and they pass on the word and that goes around and finally results in 5-10 bikes to choose from, some grey, some legal. The inbox is usually flooded with bikes, let me know if you want some forwards, will be happy to help.

I personally have no issues with a grey bike. An eg. was offered a crashed 08 CBR600RR for 2.5 yesterday with some damage, but easily repairable within 50000 or so. Let us assume (because I dont have BOE details yet) the bike has a duty of 1.5L on it, I would buy it straightaway. Because if you do the math, I spend 2.5 on the bike, 50000 to fix it, that makes 3L, now, I keep aside 2 lakhs for duties and that makes 5 lakhs for a 2008 CBR600RR (2nd best supersport in the world for its year just behind the ZX-6R) with drop dead looks, PC, exhaust etc etc.

Hence I recommend those who arent satisfied with the Hyosungs capabilities to take some time out and hunt for a machine which does satisfy their needs.

Most importantly: Although, let me state here that it has taken a few years and a lot of broken bones to continue riding, so if anyones plan is to buy a fast sports bike and become the next street Rossi, you are in for a very rude surprise, please make an informed decision regarding your riding abilities and which bike suits those abilities, no ego here, be practical. Buying a bike is very easy. I've seen way too many 18-24 year olds spending papas money on SBKs around Maddur/Intl Airport roads and get sms of crashed bikes for sale the next day (One guy died right outside my office because he thought his R1 was fast enough to go through a traffic light without needing to look left or right and went into a Sumo), his bike was on sale for 90000. Being an "enthusiast" too, counts for NOTHING, unless you practise. One too many enthusiasts from many forums here and there have bitten the dust sooner or later. The smart ones survive and ride till they're ripe. If Wayne Rainey could lose his legs, so can you

Feel free to send me a pm if anyone wants a bike, will help all I can.

Note from the Team-Bhp Support Staff: Kindly note that mention of alcohol is not allowed.

Last edited by Technocrat : 17th May 2011 at 00:43. Reason: removed mention of alcohol. Only 2 smilies per post allowed, thanks
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Old 16th May 2011, 01:39   #103
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Default Re: Garware to sell Hyosung 650 - 700 cc motorcycles. EDIT : Launched! Details on Pg.

watch ur back max , garware and hysong might come after you for sabotaging their thread and diverting their sales . he he he

well from my point of view if i were to be putting around 6 lacs on a motorcycle - i would rather put it on a jap , specifically a CBR600RR '08 or after BUT i would have to pick up something from the second hand market. Most 600s are abused alot more than the litre class bikes.

what is the average 2nd hand market rate of a "completely documented, clean & legal legal - 100% duty paid " 600 RR 08 in bangalore ?

Does buying a "2nd hand" 600 with all of its doubtful pervious use/maintainance and documentation factor, make more sense, than buying a "Brand new 100 % legal" GT650R for the same amount?

How does an average example, of each motorcycle ( second hand 600RR vs brand new GT650R ) compare with each other in terms of of durability, reliability, service, utility, satisfaction , DRI , peace of mind and finally VFM ?

Once again id just like you to remember that most 2nd hand 600 are pretty often abused. Your thoughts ?

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Old 16th May 2011, 02:19   #104
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No sabotaging happening here, am the first one to defend the twins on the basis of their lowered price!

600s abused: Absolutely!

2nd hand Jap 600 better VFM than a Hyosung twin: Absolutely!

Does it make sense to buy one in spite of the abuse: Absolutely!

To put it briefly, the Jap supersports/superbikes were almost made to be abused and then some more, they can take it. Ive rarely seen a machine (except those that have had terrible crashes) that couldnt be fixed back to bone stock reliability. (eg. My R1 had a blown gearbox, the VMax had a wiring/rectifier issue)

Note, for every abused 600, there are 9 more that were taken out on weekends to impress chicks and thats ALL so things arent that dark. Just set aside 50k for clutch plates, pads, etc including a full service. for eg. Remember an 08 Ceeber600RR comes with stuff such as the unit pro-link rear suspension among others, its something that does duty day in and out the world over on race tracks and in the hands of some very good riders, its not so easy to f up unless crashed or in the hands of a total monkey.

Used Jap 600 vs Hyosung:

Durability: Jap 600, no question about it

Reliability: Jap 600, no question about it

Service: am not sure how well Garware is shaping up with A.S.S but I have had NO issues with servicing the machines at the mechanics around town. Garware will have an edge there due to parts availability. Quality of course is a different matter, time will tell. I rather doubt Garware can hire tuners/mechs who can turn oil to gold the way some of my mechs do.

Utility: Hyosung 650R, no question about it. It's cheaper to run, easier to ride, is just fast enough for the city, and can be taken out on the highway while still keeping an SBK in its sight.

Satisfaction: he he he he...that's so relative now, sooner or later, faster the better, or something like that? But yes, smiles per gallons will be higher on the Jap 600s

DRI/Peace of Mind: Depends wholly on the paperwork. If done right, you can wheelie outside the DRI office and come away with just a traffic fine for dangerous driving (that too if there's a flatfoot around) If not, then better keep 1-2 lakhs in an FD gaining interest because if you're caught, you pay.

VFM: Depends on what one is looking for, for outright high rpm adrenaline pumping machine with some serious corner carving (nandi hills anyone?), a Jap 600 fits the bill, and for those looking to enter into the world of fast bikes or learn how to ride, the GT650R offers good pricing with decent facilities (at least on paper, lets see what Garware makes of it).

sorry I missed out a couple of your questions:

average price for a fully legal 08 CBR600RR is around 6-8 lakhs depending on the condition, although, take my advice, if you're in the market for a Supersport, get an old ZX636, or an 07 ZX-6R Both, to put it succinctly, burn gas, kick @ss.

Just to bust an old myth, aftermarkets on a bike DO NOT fetch a better price. They count for nothing, reason that with the seller (most think that filters, PC, exhaust etc should get them a lakh more!)

Last edited by khan_sultan : 5th June 2011 at 17:55. Reason: Only 2 smileys per post please. Thanks for understanding.
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Old 16th May 2011, 04:12   #105
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Default Re: Garware to sell Hyosung 650 - 700 cc motorcycles. EDIT : Launched! Details on Pg.

Thats was an enlightening post , cleared up a lotta doubts in my head . Thank You ! Hows the R6 vs the CBR ?
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