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Old 9th May 2014, 20:11   #241
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Default Re: Mahindra XUV500 vs Toyota Innova vs Others

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Originally Posted by Autocop View Post
Strome is a real SUV as they advertise. You can enjoy driving it both on and off the road (traditional body on frame design).
Real SUV? SUV is a blanket term. According to Merriam-Webster dictionary, SUV : a large vehicle that is designed to be used on rough surfaces but that is often used on city roads or highways. In their 4x2 avatar, there is nothing much different between the XUV & Storme (the notable differences being the body on frame vs monocoque & FWD vs RWD). Also, the Storme weighs 2000kg vs the XUV's 1785 +/-15 kg. But in the 4x4 avatar, the Storme has a low range transfer case, which is better in offroad conditions. But frankly speaking, weighing in at 2 tons, it is better to keep the Storme away from hardcore offroading, same is the case with XUV.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Autocop View Post
XUV vs Strome choice will be determined by your priorities (Seating comfort, driving pleasure, features, luggage space, On/Off Road usage, ownership period etc).
Totally agree. I considered these two vehicles but after a lot of deliberation, I went with the XUV AWD. The overall packaging of the XUV was much more appealing than the Storme. The ride was definitely better in the Storme, so was the 4x4 hardware as I was specifically looking for an AWD/4x4. The factors that pulled me towards the XUV were
Value it offered for the money that I paid.
Eventhough a bit cramped, it gave me the flexibility of 2 more seats. The side facing last row seats of the Storme is a joke, making it practically a 5-seater.
The drive in the XUV was more confidence inspiring for me.
For me, the most used seats are the the front ones and my son will be sitting in the middle row.
Another factor was the company itself and personally, I feel that Mahindra has that extra go compared to Tata in improving their products and are more customer focused. All these factors made me lean towards the XUV.
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Old 11th May 2014, 11:31   #242
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Default Re: Mahindra XUV500 vs Toyota Innova vs Others

Hi Guys,

I am in the market to buy a 7 seater car for my daily office routine.

My Shortlist
1. Innova Diesel GX with Captain seats
Pros: Toyota reassurance. Quality. Resale Value. Captain seats
Cons: Human nature to compare it to ertiga and wonder why the price difference. Underpowered. Above budget

2. Scorpio VLX AT with captain seats
Pros: Automatic Transmission (Big Plus). Expected refresh. 4x4 is an option (i hear the suspension setup in 4X4 is also better) captain seats
Cons: Wife wont sit in it. I will look like a politico. Drivers seat is cramped

3. Safari Storme EX
Pros: Principally none except for space on offer
Cons: Perception of Tata being unreliable and expensive to maintain

4. XUV500 W6
Pros: Looks, gadgets, nice drivers position
Cons: Will Monocoque construction survive my use. Slightly above budget

My end use
1. Travel of about 30 km a day in unruly traffic of Chennai
2. Atleast 5-6 km a day on unlaid roads (and during monsoons this is nothing short of offroading)
3. Carrying odd construction goods like wheelbarrows, 5 bags of cement/sand, some storage tanks every now and then
4. Ferrying the family (6 persons) for any dinners, social visits etc

My priorities are:
1. Less ownership niggles
2. Serve my end use
3. Low cost of ownership and good resale
4. Fuel Efficiency
5. Safety


So i request your kind views/suggestions
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Old 11th May 2014, 11:54   #243
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Default Re: Innova Vs Safari Vs Scorpio

Quote:
Originally Posted by acidkill View Post

2. Atleast 5-6 km a day on unlaid roads (and during monsoons this is nothing short of offroading)
3. Carrying odd construction goods like wheelbarrows, 5 bags of cement/sand, some storage tanks every now and then

My priorities are:
1. Less ownership niggles
2. Serve my end use
3. Low cost of ownership and good resale
4. Fuel Efficiency
5. Safety


So i request your kind views/suggestions
It you're carrying wheel barrows and cement bags, don't look beyond the Innova. Reason: The last row has a 50:50 split, folds and tilts away. This is very important to you as you don't want wheel-barrows, cement bags, storage tanks to rest on your last row seat, they could end up tearing it.

Why you should buy Innova:
  • Peace of mind
  • Good boot space without the last row interfering with your cargo
  • Captain seats are supremely comfortable
  • Amazing resale value

Even though Innova is a great car, it's not the greatest. Coming to negatives:
  • Short gearing is bad for highway runs. (You have not indicated the amount of highway driving that will be done by you) It can cruise at 90-100 kmph. Anything above that, the engine noise will irritate your passengers. (Can stretch to 140 kmph)
  • For your heavy use, the service at 5000 km will be inconvenient.
  • It's mechanically not changed for 9 years now! The replacement is due in less than a year

Does GX offer D+P airbag and ABS?
And Fuel efficiency of the Innova is 10~10.5 kmpl in city. Highway FE depends on your right foot.
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Old 11th May 2014, 12:22   #244
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Default Re: Innova Vs Safari Vs Scorpio

Quote:
Originally Posted by acidkill View Post
Hi Guys,
My end use
1. Travel of about 30 km a day in unruly traffic of Chennai
2. Atleast 5-6 km a day on unlaid roads (and during monsoons this is nothing short of offroading)
3. Carrying odd construction goods like wheelbarrows, 5 bags of cement/sand, some storage tanks every now and then
4. Ferrying the family (6 persons) for any dinners, social visits etc

My priorities are:
1. Less ownership niggles
2. Serve my end use
3. Low cost of ownership and good resale
4. Fuel Efficiency
5. Safety


So i request your kind views/suggestions
I would also recommend the Innova - but GX is certainly more expensive than your other options. If your use is mostly city drives, with less family use, then why don't you look for G model or E Model - see picture below (prices are Ex-Chennai). These have less price differential to your alternatives.
Name:  Innova Price list.JPG
Views: 16477
Size:  90.9 KB
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Old 11th May 2014, 13:43   #245
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Default Re: Innova Vs Safari Vs Scorpio

Quote:
Originally Posted by acidkill View Post
Hi Guys,

I am in the market to buy a 7 seater car for my daily office routine.

My Shortlist
1. Innova Diesel GX with Captain seats
Pros: Toyota reassurance. Quality. Resale Value. Captain seats
Cons: Human nature to compare it to ertiga and wonder why the price difference. Underpowered. Above budget

2. Scorpio VLX AT with captain seats
Pros: Automatic Transmission (Big Plus). Expected refresh. 4x4 is an option (i hear the suspension setup in 4X4 is also better) captain seats
Cons: Wife wont sit in it. I will look like a politico. Drivers seat is cramped

3. Safari Storme EX
Pros: Principally none except for space on offer
Cons: Perception of Tata being unreliable and expensive to maintain

4. XUV500 W6
Pros: Looks, gadgets, nice drivers position
Cons: Will Monocoque construction survive my use. Slightly above budget

My end use
1. Travel of about 30 km a day in unruly traffic of Chennai
2. Atleast 5-6 km a day on unlaid roads (and during monsoons this is nothing short of offroading)
3. Carrying odd construction goods like wheelbarrows, 5 bags of cement/sand, some storage tanks every now and then
4. Ferrying the family (6 persons) for any dinners, social visits etc

My priorities are:
1. Less ownership niggles
2. Serve my end use
3. Low cost of ownership and good resale
4. Fuel Efficiency
5. Safety


So i request your kind views/suggestions
I would recommend safari storme. It is very comfortable and relaxing to drive. Engine is a workhorse and the niggles are a few. Toyota Innova is too old now, Engine sounds crazy loud and it's not relaxing to drive on the highway. The Engine noise is so bad that u can't idle the car and sit in it with AC on. Performance and Engine noise are two thing to hate about innova. Rest it's a very good car but storme matches innova in the everything and exceeds in performance and NVH
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Old 11th May 2014, 14:18   #246
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Default Re: Innova Vs Safari Vs Scorpio

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Originally Posted by V12Doc View Post
.... but storme matches innova in the everything and exceeds in performance and NVH
I would completely and comprehensively disagree with this!
If this were true the world would have been lapping up these Tata vehicles like hot cross buns!

Your best bet is the Innova, any variant.
The only vehicle that will serve YOU rather than the other way around!
Too many in our great nation have forgotten what it means to have a car that serves you with reliability rather than you spending every other weekend at the authorized service centre! And there could well be times when the ASC decides to keep your vehicle for a few days for troubleshooting purposes, or awaiting requisite spare parts!
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Old 11th May 2014, 14:22   #247
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Default Re: Innova Vs Safari Vs Scorpio

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Originally Posted by anupmathur View Post
I would completely and comprehensively disagree with this!
If this were true the world would have been lapping up these Tata vehicles like hot cross buns!

Your best bet is the Innova, any variant.
The only vehicle that will serve YOU rather than the other way around!
Too many in our great nation have forgotten what it means to have a car that serves you with reliability rather than you spending every other weekend at the authorized service centre! And there could well be times when the ASC decides to keep your vehicle for a few days for troubleshooting purposes, or awaiting requisite spare parts!
I have both innova and a safari 2.2vtt and I drive the safari more because I find it easier and not irritating and safari has run 1,10,000 km and no breakdowns. Only regular problem like clutch wear at 70k. Suspension components changed due to rough handling at regular services. So I can vouch for the reliability. I find them more reliable than mahindras ownded in my circle
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Old 11th May 2014, 14:53   #248
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Default Re: Innova Vs Safari Vs Scorpio

Quote:
Originally Posted by V12Doc View Post
relaxing to drive. Engine is a workhorse and the niggles are a few. Toyota Innova is too old now, Engine sounds crazy loud and it's not relaxing to drive on the highway. The Engine noise is so bad that u can't idle the car and sit in it with AC on. Rest it's a very good car but storme matches innova in the everything and exceeds in performance and NVH
  • Safari is relaxing to drive? The safari has too much body roll and keep pitching up and down when you hit a rough patch in the highway. The Innova's body roll is well controlled and it is the only Body-on-frame UV that comes closest to matching the dynamics of a sedan and one more thing, it rides F-L-A-T on the highways. The only thing that goes against the innova is it's suspension is set towards the stiffer side, so in town, Safari will take potholes better.
  • The engine noise is controlled under 2K revs. It's far from unbearable at idle. Above 3000 rpm, it sounds very bad.(Personally, I like it)
  • If Storme matches Innova on every parameter, why are we still seeing so many Innovas on the road, even if it's an older vehicle, more expensive and has average performance? Get this right, home-grown companies(Tata & Mahindra, especially Tata) have a long way to go before they can challenge the Japanese.
Quote:
Originally Posted by V12Doc View Post
I have both innova and a safari 2.2vtt and I drive the safari more because I find it easier and not irritating and safari has run 1,10,000 km and no breakdowns. Only regular problem like clutch wear at 70k. Suspension components changed due to rough handling at regular services. So I can vouch for the reliability. I find them more reliable than mahindras ownded in my circle
Tata cars aren't unreliable, but there is that occasional car in which so many things go wrong that the owner is frustrated. Adding fuel to fire are horrible experiences with Tata ASS. Tata cars also have too may niggles which irritate owners.
I guess you're lucky with the ASS and niggle-free experience.
For any modern day car, 1 lakh km is a piece of cake with regular maintenance. Clutch will have to be replaced at 60K to 100K km, depending on driver. Suspension overhaul is standard for an SUV as it takes a beating.
The real challenge for a car is to last ~5 lakh km wihtout an overhaul, which only the Toyota cars can.
Still Tata is quite a distance from beating toyota at reliability. Actually, every brand is.
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Old 11th May 2014, 15:06   #249
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Default Re: Innova Vs Safari Vs Scorpio

Quote:
Originally Posted by D4D View Post
  • Safari is relaxing to drive? The safari has too much body roll and keep pitching up and down when you hit a rough patch in the highway. The Innova's body roll is well controlled and it is the only Body-on-frame UV that comes closest to matching the dynamics of a sedan and one more thing, it rides F-L-A-T on the highways. The only thing that goes against the innova is it's suspension is set towards the stiffer side, so in town, Safari will take potholes better.
  • The engine noise is controlled under 2K revs. It's far from unbearable at idle. Above 3000 rpm, it sounds very bad.(Personally, I like it)
  • If Storme matches Innova on every parameter, why are we still seeing so many Innovas on the road, even if it's an older vehicle, more expensive and has average performance? Get this right, home-grown companies(Tata & Mahindra, especially Tata) have a long way to go before they can challenge the Japanese.


Tata cars aren't unreliable, but there is that occasional car in which so many things go wrong that the owner is frustrated. Adding fuel to fire are horrible experiences with Tata ASS. Tata cars also have too may niggles which irritate owners.
I guess you're lucky with the ASS and niggle-free experience.
For any modern day car, 1 lakh km is a piece of cake with regular maintenance. Clutch will have to be replaced at 60K to 100K km, depending on driver. Suspension overhaul is standard for an SUV as it takes a beating.
The real challenge for a car is to last ~5 lakh km wihtout an overhaul, which only the Toyota cars can.
Still Tata is quite a distance from beating toyota at reliability. Actually, every brand is.
The reason I chose to buy an innova over another storme was that I already have a safari and Toyota has a better snob value to it. With the terms relaxing to drive I mean that the car pulls effortlessly and it's a breeze to overtake compared to Innova and my Innova has dieseltronic installed and I run it on p2 because thats the only thing that makes it driveable on highways or good city roads. Never has any of my car crossed 1 lakh km without breakdown. My Octavia Caught fire due to short circuit after coming back from regular service, Lancer had to get engine overhaul and rest of the cars became problematic. I have seen Innovas and fortuners run lakhs of kms and even Tata that are run that much but everything ages. The Indian Weather takes it toll on every car. My friend had an Innova from 2007 that had run 50k. It could easily run more but the body had taken some toll not due to rash driving but weather conditions and suspension had gone bust. Toyotas may have less niggles but the ownership is not an enjoyable one. It's bland like there is no connection with car. With a flat ride quality the experience is equally flat. It wouldn't plaster a smile on your every time u drive. It's awesome to get you from point a to b and any car can do that. For the A.S.S They have come a long long way. They replaced a Part under goodwill warranty after 1,00,000kms and 5 years. It's not the same Tata anymore and I have personally driven the storme and I would recommend it to anyone who is buying under 15 lacs.
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Old 11th May 2014, 16:30   #250
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Default Re: Innova Vs Safari Vs Scorpio

Quote:
Originally Posted by acidkill View Post
Hi Guys,

I am in the market to buy a 7 seater car for my daily office routine.

My end use
1. Travel of about 30 km a day in unruly traffic of Chennai
2. Atleast 5-6 km a day on unlaid roads (and during monsoons this is nothing short of offroading)
3. Carrying odd construction goods like wheelbarrows, 5 bags of cement/sand, some storage tanks every now and then
4. Ferrying the family (6 persons) for any dinners, social visits etc

My priorities are:
1. Less ownership niggles
2. Serve my end use
3. Low cost of ownership and good resale
4. Fuel Efficiency
5. Safety
  • Though a spacious, comfortable and reliable 7 –seater people mover , I wouldn’t buy an Innova today. I drive myself and the engine and performance is too crude to my liking. Though comes with best in class plastic quality, fit and finish, Innova still doesn’t convince me the premium it commands. I know there are many who think otherwise.

  • I wouldn’t buy a current Scorpio today, as a facelift is just around the corner.

  • With the kind of usage and road conditions you mentioned, I would pick a Storme EX over an XUV W6. Going by the feedback from real life owners, Tata Safari Storme is as reliable or unreliable as any other vehicle available in the segment. It comes with a decent warranty package as well, if I am not wrong.

  • I wouldn’t buy a 12 Lakh + car based on resale value. I plan to keep my vehicle as long as I can, provided there is no untoward incident in the ownership. The fun, comfort and driving pleasure throughout my ownership is definitely my priority than an additional few ten- thousand bucks I might earn when I sell it after 7-8 years of usage.

  • If I can buy another couple of months, I would definitely wait for the 2014 Scorpio to unleash. So, in my final shortlist, I will have a 2014 Scorpio against a Safari Storme within my budget for an extensive back to back Test drive.

Last edited by M35 : 11th May 2014 at 16:34. Reason: spell check
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Old 11th May 2014, 17:10   #251
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Default Re: Innova Vs Safari Vs Scorpio

Innova? Is that an SUV? It is an MUV. It is not even a proper car? More like a people mover, an airport taxi. A panel-van with glasses in place of sheet-metal. This thread should be about Scorpio and Safari- two budget end SUVs. My vote goes to Scorpio which beats Safari by just a wee bit.
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Old 16th May 2014, 12:02   #252
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Default Re: Mahindra XUV500 vs Toyota Innova vs Others

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Originally Posted by mpksuhas View Post
There was suspension updates for XUV in OCT 2013, so if your test drive vehicle was a pre- update model do take another test drive in newer vehicle.
As per your suggestion, I took a second test drive of the XUV. This car was manufactured in April-14.

Parents still complained of the same movement they felt in the earlier car. :(

A thing to note here: Wont name the showroom.
I visited the showroom a couple of days back and unfortunately the test drive car wasn't available. The sales rep promised to get the car at my place for test ride.
The appointment was fixed for the following day at 2:00 PM. After some 3-4 phone calls and waiting for around 3.5 hours, the test ride car shows up.
To my horror, they got an unregistered car. Upon enquiring they revealed that the car was indeed a customer car which was to be delivered the next day to customer.
I denied taking the test ride. The bigger horror was, there were a couple of guys wearing shirts with "Mahindra" logo, unlike the other two who had the showroom name.
After a lot of convincing and taking responsibility of any untoward incident on showroom, I agreed for the drive. (Though I know I shouldn't have done so.)
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Old 16th May 2014, 12:42   #253
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Originally Posted by ObsessedByFIAT View Post

To my horror, they got an unregistered car. Upon enquiring they revealed that the car was indeed a customer car which was to be delivered the next day to customer.

After a lot of convincing and taking responsibility of any untoward incident on showroom, I agreed for the drive. (Though I know I shouldn't have done so.)
Shame on Mahindra to issue out a customer vehicle as a TD car. You should write to Anand Mahindra (Tweet him may be).

When such things happen two people are not satisfied here:

1) The owner of that car if and when he knows / realises the car was used a TD vehicle;

2) The person actually TD'ing the car - Since the guy knows it is a customer vehicle he can't really do a whole-hearted TD as he would have to the originally assigned TD vehicle that is abused already. We don't have that right to abuse a customers vehicle for our future benefit.

Honestly speaking you should have denied the TD and built up pressure on the dealer for a TD car.

Anurag.
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Old 16th May 2014, 13:13   #254
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Default Re: Mahindra XUV500 vs Toyota Innova vs Others

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Originally Posted by a4anurag View Post
Shame on Mahindra to issue out a customer vehicle as a TD car.

Honestly speaking you should have denied the TD and built up pressure on the dealer for a TD car.

Anurag.
Completely agree to what you have said in the post. I was reluctant to drive the vehicle. However, the frustration of waiting for the test drive got the better of me.

On another note, parents as well as me are now more inclined towards the Storme.
With the polling results out, I am again in delima whether to wait and watch for possible policy changes or just make the purchase? Any suggestions?
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Old 16th May 2014, 13:16   #255
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Default Re: Mahindra XUV500 vs Toyota Innova vs Others

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Originally Posted by ObsessedByFIAT View Post
Completely agree to what you have said in the post. I was reluctant to drive the vehicle. However, the frustration of waiting for the test drive got the better of me.

On another note, parents as well as me are now more inclined towards the Storme.

With the polling results out, I am again in delima whether to wait and watch for possible policy changes or just make the purchase? Any suggestions?
Overall boils down on how urgently do you need the vehicle?

If you can wait then see what policies change if at all they do but seeing this I don't think any immediate effect will be there.

Anurag.
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