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Old 7th March 2012, 10:15   #1
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Exclamation Which is the best diesel 4WD (Not AWD) SUV under 22 lac INR?

I ve had this question in my mind for quite some time now and the more I think about it, the more confused I get.

1. I cannot afford a new Fortuner (and do not think it is VFM too) and I do not think that a new Pajero SFX is worth the money. The Yeti is too small for my needs.

2. I have two choices; buy a brand new Scorpio VLX 4wd or buy a pre owned around 40k kms run Pajero SFX not more than 2 years old for around the same price as a new Scorpio VLX 4WD.

3. I do not participate in OTRs and will venture into offroad or 4wd territory only if my destination demands it. I have so far managed to go to Leh, Coorg, Kudremukh, Waynad, Singrauli and a few other places/tracks when they are dry, however due to the lack of 4WD on my current ride, I ve had to forego a few roads where I would have gone, especially in the wet, hence the need for 4WD.

4. I do not exceed speeds of 120-130 kmph on the highway and I do not want the vehicle to feel stressed doing those speeds and give me an FE of at least 11kmpl.

5. What I need is one vehicle, which will be my primary/only vehicle for highway trips (around 30k kms/year) and going everywhere that I need to with 5 people and luggage in comfort at the same levels of FE and upkeep as the Scorpio. My intra city travel is negligible and hence the size, city FE and other factors do not concern me.

6. My grouse with the Scorpio, at the moment is the life of the vehicle, especially when it comes to plastic parts being rattle free, availability of spares, again, rubber and plastic parts, and the rate of suspension wear and tear, especially at the rear.

7. Lastly, this vehicle will be used by me at least for the next 10 years.

Looking into the above, could you guys out there please recommend a choice between a pre-owned 2-3 yr old 40k km run Pajero SFX and a brand new Scorpio VLX 4wd?

Last edited by n.devdath : 7th March 2012 at 10:19.
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Old 7th March 2012, 10:40   #2
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Default re: Which is the best diesel 4WD (Not AWD) SUV under 22 lac INR?

Hi n.devath, I was in a similar dilemma a few months back, only difference was that I had lesser budget. In this case I would surely have gone for a well maintained Pajero. I had looked at quite a few Pajeros, the ones that were retailing for about 10 lacs were absolutely crap and the owners were shady. Some of them would look immaculate till you get them on a ramp. Power steering oil leakage was the common factor among all the specimens. I was getting one immaculate 2008 Pajero for 14 lacs. It had run only 17K kilometers, but it was way beyond my budget. All these prices are in Kolkata and I am sure they will be on the higher side in Bangalore. Pajero is in a different league compared to Scorpio, please go for it if you have the budget. I am sure you will not regret.
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Old 7th March 2012, 10:52   #3
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Default re: Which is the best diesel 4WD (Not AWD) SUV under 22 lac INR?

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Originally Posted by BlackPearl View Post
I was getting one immaculate 2008 Pajero for 14 lacs. It had run only 17K kilometers, but it was way beyond my budget. All these prices are in Kolkata and I am sure they will be on the higher side in Bangalore. Pajero is in a different league compared to Scorpio, please go for it if you have the budget. I am sure you will not regret.
It is precisely these kind of vehicles that I am looking for Black Pearl, but, like you said, they are few and far between, which brings me back thinking; "What is wrong in buying a New Scorpio? It will be a new vehicle, with no existing issues."

See my dilemma.
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Old 7th March 2012, 10:59   #4
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Default re: Which is the best diesel 4WD (Not AWD) SUV under 22 lac INR?

If I were you, I would buy a Pajero if I get a good one. It might take some patience to find one you like as I won't suggest compromising on anything as far as the condition of the vehicle is concerned. I would also be open to look at any used Fortuners that come my way.
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Old 7th March 2012, 11:04   #5
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Default re: Which is the best diesel 4WD (Not AWD) SUV under 22 lac INR?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BBR_SHR View Post
If I were you, I would buy a Pajero if I get a good one. It might take some patience to find one you like as I won't suggest compromising on anything as far as the condition of the vehicle is concerned. I would also be open to look at any used Fortuners that come my way.
I too am open to used Fortuners but they are very expensive due to the vehicle selling like hot cakes. My only concerns with a Pajero are:
Fuel Efficiency
Highway Cruising ability
Cost of regular upkeep and spares.
Ascertaining the condition of the vehicle to a T.
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Old 7th March 2012, 11:23   #6
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Default re: Which is the best diesel 4WD (Not AWD) SUV under 22 lac INR?

Finding a good pre-worshiped vehicle in Bangalore is no mean task (although not impossible). We tried for more than six months. I agree that the quality of vehicle provided is purely dependent on the previous owner (Good or Bad), but in most cases you never actually meet the owner himself. You deal with these used car dealers and most of them try to push stuff that they know aren't well kept to make quick money.

Their word of mouth (Which is everything, in this business) is of question here, as you take the next step of making the deal only after checking things out, till then you depend on what the guy has to say about the car. In most cases that we tried it turned out to be either a lie or they did not have sufficient knowledge.

So in my view, with whatever experience i have had (six months to a year) i would suggest either wait and stretch your budget to XUV/Fortuner or buy a new Scorpio. Alternatively if someone known is willing to sell their car and you know them well, that would be a killer deal.

Last edited by mayankjha1806 : 7th March 2012 at 11:24.
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Old 7th March 2012, 11:42   #7
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Default re: Which is the best diesel 4WD (Not AWD) SUV under 22 lac INR?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mayankjha1806 View Post
Finding a good pre-worshiped vehicle in Bangalore is no mean task (although not impossible).

So in my view, with whatever experience i have had (six months to a year) i would suggest either wait and stretch your budget to XUV/Fortuner or buy a new Scorpio. Alternatively if someone known is willing to sell their car and you know them well, that would be a killer deal.
The XUV is certainly within budget, say after 6 months and I am in no hurry to buy/upgrade, BUT, the only reason I m shying away from an Indian/European brand is availability of spares, be it M&M, Tata or otherwise, AND, the interior quality. They begin to rattle in small places, plastic locks break, rubber gaskets fail, nothing big but then you dont get replacements.

As and when models get outphased, the supply of spares drops drastically.

On the other hand, I see people buying decade old Landcruisers, for example, and restoring them pretty easily since their spares, big or small are available.
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Old 7th March 2012, 11:43   #8
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Default re: Which is the best diesel 4WD (Not AWD) SUV under 22 lac INR?

If you can afford to wait and find a good used Pajero, then the Paj is the vehicle to go for. Of course you will need patience and the willingness to run around a little, maybe even outside Bangalore, but inside Karnataka, to find a good example.

The one concern with the Paj is the A.S.S or rather lack of it, with the way HM looks like it is going to go bankrupt any day now.

If OTR is a major concern then the Paj is definitely better than the Scorpio.
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Old 7th March 2012, 11:58   #9
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Default re: Which is the best diesel 4WD (Not AWD) SUV under 22 lac INR?

If I was in your place, I would go for a new Scorpio 4WD.

The AWD XUV cant go to places where a Scorpio 4WD can take you.

I have driven a Pajero, and with no offence to Paj owners, it's engine just does not cut it when compared to the Scorpio. The car feels unrefined, very coarse at high speeds & lacks the punch like in the mHawk. Of course, the ride quality is simply superb & I know for sure that it will be great off road as well. But you dont plan to do hardcore off roading anyways.

Secodnly, if you buy a used Paj, you will have to spend more on maintainence & upkeep costs would be high as Pajero's spares are not exactly cheap. So in my opinion, the Scorpio 4WD it is.
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Old 7th March 2012, 12:03   #10
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Default re: Which is the best diesel 4WD (Not AWD) SUV under 22 lac INR?

n.devdath - I am in pretty much a similar dilemma as you. However in my case the city running is a lot as well but I dont mind driving a large vehicle.

I am inclined towards the scorpio vlx 4wd as it will be a new vehicle so easier to maintain (also under extended warranty) plus has excellent resale value. However my wife hates the interiors (cramped and cheap)... with I dont disagree with.

Used 2009 Fortuners are going for 14-16L in Delhi which is maybe about 1L more than a similar Pajero. However the Fortuner sways from side to side as speed increase which is very unsettling but the maintenance costs are very reasonable. Then there is the Pajero which I have read is relatively more expensive to maintain.

Sorry, dont mean to hijack your thread but will follow it closely.

Cheers
Ankit
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Old 7th March 2012, 12:37   #11
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Default re: Which is the best diesel 4WD (Not AWD) SUV under 22 lac INR?

Quote:
The XUV is certainly within budget, say after 6 months and I am in no hurry to buy/upgrade, BUT, the only reason I m shying away from an Indian/European brand is availability of spares, be it M&M, Tata or otherwise, AND, the interior quality. They begin to rattle in small places, plastic locks break, rubber gaskets
Dev, its not as bad when it comes to rattle, quality for the given price they are available ie MM & Tata. Since you want to keep it for 10 years , its always better to opt for a new vehicle. IMO stay away from Pajero , with present HM condition, A.S.S & spares will be an issue. I would suggest Scorpio or XUV.
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Old 7th March 2012, 12:42   #12
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Default re: Which is the best diesel 4WD (Not AWD) SUV under 22 lac INR?

You should go for a used Fortuner if you can get a good VFM specimen. The Fortuner cruises effortlessly at 120-130kmph (in my experience, it doesn't sway at these speeds at all unless the road is uneven), and returns 11kmpl at those speeds. But you will have to live with a little bumpiness and hard ride quality. The Fortuner will also go where the Pajero will go...and one gets used to the bumpiness after a while.

I am not sure that a Scorpio will run well over 10 years - maybe some will, some won't. Maybe if you are lucky, yes. I do read about Toyota SUVs and to a lesser extent Mitsubishis running for 15-20 years in various parts of the world.

Last edited by nilanjanray : 7th March 2012 at 12:44.
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Old 7th March 2012, 12:59   #13
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Default re: Which is the best diesel 4WD (Not AWD) SUV under 22 lac INR?

If you're planning to keep the car for atleast 10 years, then a new one would be your best bet. No niggles or problems for some years and the initial maintenance costs would be low as compared to a used car however well-maintained it is.
I would buy a brand new scorpio if I was in your place. But if you're interested in used cars then you can consider the Endevour too.
Why don't you consider the safari storme?
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Old 7th March 2012, 13:00   #14
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Default re: Which is the best diesel 4WD (Not AWD) SUV under 22 lac INR?

Quote:
Originally Posted by pganapathy View Post
If OTR is a major concern then the Paj is definitely better than the Scorpio.
P Ganapathy, well OTRs are not deliberate in my case, but yes, I want the best possible OTR package, which is why I was inclined towards the Pajero

Quote:
Originally Posted by raj_5004 View Post
If I was in your place, I would go for a new Scorpio 4WD.

Secodnly, if you buy a used Paj, you will have to spend more on maintainence & upkeep costs would be high as Pajero's spares are not exactly cheap. So in my opinion, the Scorpio 4WD it is.
Two of my exact and prime concerns Raj, which is why I am not attracted to the XUV and nervous about the Pajero's cost of spares since I intend to retain this buy for a long long time. In fact, since my spouse would also need a car, this could very well be my last purchase for my own use.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoSlow View Post
I am inclined towards the scorpio vlx 4wd as it will be a new vehicle so easier to maintain (also under extended warranty) plus has excellent resale value. However my wife hates the interiors (cramped and cheap)... with I dont disagree with.

Used 2009 Fortuners are going for 14-16L in Delhi which is maybe about 1L more than a similar Pajero. However the Fortuner sways from side to side as speed increase which is very unsettling but the maintenance costs are very reasonable. Then there is the Pajero which I have read is relatively more expensive to maintain.

Sorry, dont mean to hijack your thread but will follow it closely.

Cheers
Ankit
Welcome aboard Ankit. I do not find the Scorpio's interiors cheap but the middle row feels small if the front seats are occupied by 6 footers for sure. My only grouse against it is the small squeaks and rattles it tends to develop over 5-6 years of use, which when told to the ASC, are reported as: "Itna to hota hai sahab, M&M hai."

Now since this vehicle in all likelyhood will be my last conscious purchase, I want to be able to retain it as long as I want to, without squeaking, rattling and hence the Japanese lure.

Quote:
Originally Posted by v&v View Post
Dev, its not as bad when it comes to rattle, quality for the given price they are available ie MM & Tata. Since you want to keep it for 10 years , its always better to opt for a new vehicle. IMO stay away from Pajero , with present HM condition, A.S.S & spares will be an issue. I would suggest Scorpio or XUV.
Vinod: For the price that they are made, they are certainly very much VFM and I do not mind changing rubbers, fasteners, clips and the like too, but they are simply not available, anywhere. That is the problem.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nilanjanray View Post
You should go for a used Fortuner if you can get a good VFM specimen. The Fortuner cruises effortlessly at 120-130kmph (in my experience, it doesn't sway at these speeds at all unless the road is uneven), and returns 11kmpl at those speeds. But you will have to live with a little bumpiness and hard ride quality. The Fortuner will also go where the Pajero will go...and one gets used to the bumpiness after a while.

I am not sure that a Scorpio will run well over 10 years - maybe some will, some won't. Maybe if you are lucky, yes. I do read about Toyota SUVs and to a lesser extent Mitsubishis running for 15-20 years in various parts of the world.
Yes Nilanjan, the Fortuner is the perfect vehicle for me, alas, I cannot afford it new and while the hunt is on for a pre-owned version, they are few and far between and the prices demanded just do not make sense.

I m sure that the Scorpio will run for 10 years as far as its engine and other critical components are concerned but the other parts will need a lot of TLC for which half the spares are not/will not be available, especially after XUV takes the centre stage with those Ssyangyong models.


MODS: I was wondering if it is possible to add a poll to this thread with the following options:
1. A Brand new Scorpio VLX 4WD
2. A 2-3 year old Pajero SFX run 40k Kms
3. None, if the ownership intent is very long term, wait and buy a new Fortuner.
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Old 7th March 2012, 13:01   #15
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Default re: Which is the best diesel 4WD (Not AWD) SUV under 22 lac INR?

I would suggest take some time and look for a well mantained Pajero. Once you have a feeling that 'This (Scorpio) is not what I want', The feeling would stay forever. Hunting for a pre-owned car isn't easy but over a period of time you will find a good deal.

Question is over period of 10 years how much kms do you think you will clock? (Keep in mind, your used Pajero would have atleast 25k~35k on the odo.) Upkeep cost is a major factor here.

Last edited by mac187 : 7th March 2012 at 13:09.
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