Jonga 4x4 or M&M Jeep CJ3B 4x4

[Samurai]

Diesels Jeeps can be stopped without brakes, use engine braking.

[yamaniac]

Originally Posted by Samurai

Diesels Jeeps can be stopped without brakes, use engine braking.

Yes, Probably. But the thought that the brakes have failed on a high speed drive will probably make someone nervous and he forgets what to do!
Say on a steep ghat section while coming down the slope? or while overtaking a vehicle just to find out that there is a bus coming from the opposite direction and your too close to ramming it you want to hit the brakes but nothing works. At this point the mind does not know what to do. Engine braking might slow you down but it wont help stop the vehicle completely.

[gd1418]

Been there and done that. In 1979 while returning from Allahabad to varanasi the accelerator cable of the Amby snapped. Drove 120 Kms with the snapped wire held in hand and operating the throttle. Took 5 hrs to do a journey of about 3 hrs..

Originally Posted by Sudipto-S-Team

One of my friends drove (some 100 km at night) an MM 540 with the accelerator cable broken.

His driver pulled the snapped cable out (I don't quite know from where) and was pulling it sitting on the front passenger side while he was driving. This on a horribly dark and pot holed highway with blinding trucks coming from the other side.
All the best
Sudipto

[gd1418]

Pray to God and jump out of the vehicle..

Originally Posted by yamaniac

Yes, Probably. But the thought that the brakes have failed on a high speed drive will probably make someone nervous and he forgets what to do!
Say on a steep ghat section while coming down the slope? or while overtaking a vehicle just to find out that there is a bus coming from the opposite direction and your too close to ramming it you want to hit the brakes but nothing works. At this point the mind does not know what to do. Engine braking might slow you down but it wont help stop the vehicle completely.

[yamaniac]

Originally Posted by gd1418

Pray to God and jump out of the vehicle..

*!GULP!* oh man! Thats the worse thing that can happen to anybody.

[gd1418]

Tell me if there is any other way. Else pray that the bus from the opposite direction swerves and falls in the gorge, letting you live..

Originally Posted by yamaniac

*!GULP!* oh man! Thats the worse thing that can happen to anybody.

[Sudipto-S-Team]

Originally Posted by gd1418

Been there and done that. In 1979 while returning from Allahabad to varanasi the accelerator cable of the Amby snapped. Drove 120 Kms with the snapped wire held in hand and operating the throttle. Took 5 hrs to do a journey of about 3 hrs..

You are a veteran sir and all veterans of driving have such stories that they recollect with a lot of pride and fondness.

Regarding brake failures - brakes don't snap just like that. They normally give enough advance indication. Careful drivers never ignore those indications and don't get into those situations in the first place. It's never like a fuse, where it is perfectly fine now and gone the next moment. Brakes take time to go 100 per cent soft.

[yamaniac]

Originally Posted by Sudipto-S-Team

, where it is perfectly fine now and gone the next moment. Brakes take time to go 100 per cent soft.

WHEW!!! Now that's a relief. I was a little paranoid about that!

[rowhun]

GD,
If u are still looking for a Jeep, there is a thread running around right now with regards to an Army Auction happening pretty soon.

But how are you going to buy a single Jeep? From what I know of Army auctions, there are Syndicates that exist who buy these Jeeps in lots, sometimes even buying a 100 vehicles , and bid for it.
What you can do is to buy a single vehicle from the syndicate.

Also the Jeeps that are rid of at these disposals, are generally pretty cannibalised, as the EME corps of the army responsible for the maintenance and upkeep of all vehicles of the Army, strip the vehicles of all working parts, and replace them with worthless parts before sending them away to the Disposal units.

There is a place in Delhi called Mayapuri, where you can go select Jeep chassis, engine of your choice (Gypsy, Toyota etc) and get the Jeep built to your satisfaction. Only drawback is that they give you a temp registration number and you will have to get the registration in some other state thru jugaad

[Brutus]

Hi,
The jonga has a 6 cyl 4 lieter powerplant producing 145hp and 32.5kgm torque(with the hitarchi carb) and 135hp and 30 kgm(with solex carb).
The diesel version produced 110hp on a hino 4 cyl.
If you are talking about relaiblity, the Jonga is more relaible than the Jeep petrol(hurricane motor), but as far as diesel is concerned, the Di Jeep is much more reliable.Leaving that aside, the jonga has a much more tough and relaible drivetrain than what the mahindra stable can ever produce(even the modern ones).
Reliablity issues are more to do with maintainence, when you dont retighten things when you are supposed to,, like when both the high low and 4x4 engagement levers fell off my moving Willys.
I am currently inbetween my project of a heavily modified jonga,with a thicker axle shaft to run 33 boggers and a cummins 6bt 250hp motor, a four speed low ratio (7.13)gearbox with a pto winch and a lot more stuff. And whenever i went looking for parts, i never ever found new parts(except seals and stuff). The only place you can find parts is mayapuri, where you'll get army hand me downs ,but you need to have an eagles eyes to get something worthwhile coz most good parts that could be reused have been degraded just coz they have been lying around for so long that rust eats them right through the grease layer.
If you want a good vehicle, my advise would be to stay off the jonga ,even though it is a much better option, coz you wont find parts. And even though you can change the entire drive-train and put dana axles and stuff, the body parts are still difficult to locate(but that i think goes for the jeep too, i just cannot find stock front mudgaurds anymore, not the classic ones but the originals). The jeep petrol parts too are difficult to locate, but the diesel parts are easily found. Not that the jeep unit is pretty sound too, the DI/inter motor sits too low on the chassis, keeping it in constant danger of damaging the chamber in rocky offroad conditions(happened to me twice). The 3 speed gearbox, though good enough,prohibits you to use a high ratio final drive, and if you assemble it with a turbo Di, you are more likely to have broken parts ever now and then(cannot handle the torque of a turbo dI).The 4 speeder is better, but you should overhaul it with new bearing coz its the only problem it has(besides having thin gears, but that would only trouble you if you have an engine that produces more than 28kgm torque). Axles and brakes should do fine enough if you upgrade to a Brake Booster with dual master cylinder, and classic's disc brakes. If you go with a full-floating rear axle, than you can even shoehorn rear disc brakes to it.
And yes, whoever said that you can use engine brakes in a diesel motor is wrong, coz unlike petrol motors, which control the air quantity entering the engine to produce more power and speed, a diesel motor has a constant supply of air flow and it controls power by the amount of fuel injected in it. A petrol motor can retard engine speed down a hill by just lifting your foot from the accelerator pedel, coz it closes the bullerfly/slide valve restricting the amout of air entering the engine, henve creating a sort of vaccum inside the cylinders, therefore slowing the motor, whereas in the diesel motor, the air entering the motor is not controlled(remember its controlled my fuel amout ,not air) ,so going downhill will only speed up the engine. That why heavy duty diesel motors have a exhaust brakes, to slow the vehicle when going downhill. An exhaust brake is nothing but aa butterfly valve, but used in the exhaust manifold. Closeing that valve restricts the amount to air exiting the cylinder and creating backpressure, hence having the same effect as in a petrol motor.
Regards,
Bikram

[cooldude1988765]

Wow brutus that was extremely informative. It would definitely help someone looking for a jonga. I would love to see the pics of your jonga.

[HotChillyPepper]

Very informative bro. Thanks.

['72 Bullet]

And yes, whoever said that you can use engine brakes in a diesel motor is wrong, coz unlike petrol motors, which control the air quantity entering the engine to produce more power and speed, a diesel motor has a constant supply of air flow and it controls power by the amount of fuel injected in it. A petrol motor can retard engine speed down a hill by just lifting your foot from the accelerator pedel, coz it closes the bullerfly/slide valve restricting the amout of air entering the engine, henve creating a sort of vaccum inside the cylinders, therefore slowing the motor, whereas in the diesel motor, the air entering the motor is not controlled(remember its controlled my fuel amout ,not air) ,so going downhill will only speed up the engine. That why heavy duty diesel motors have a exhaust brakes, to slow the vehicle when going downhill. An exhaust brake is nothing but aa butterfly valve, but used in the exhaust manifold. Closeing that valve restricts the amount to air exiting the cylinder and creating backpressure, hence having the same effect as in a petrol motor.
Regards,
Bikram[/quote]


not really true... yes, a diesel motor does have a constant air-flow. What it also has though, is a 'governor'. A governor is a spring-loaded device that's fixed to the diesel-pump, and reduces the amount of fuel being pumped. That is what provides the engine braking in a diesel. Try it out for yourself on a slope, or just take your foot of the throttle on a straight stretch. If you have experience with diesel engined jeeps then i'm sure you know how good the engine-braking is..

[dyer_made]

Originally Posted by gd1418

Pray to God and jump out of the vehicle..

Sorry ! Wrong answer. FIRST jump out and THEN pray to God.

cheers:

[desertfox]

Actually I have encountered brake line leaks and this brakes failing twice off road in 2009 itself on a CJ3B Jeep.