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Old 14th March 2009, 06:57   #91
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Originally Posted by nishant kar View Post
...i also feel scorpio has less niggles and a more quiet and refined engine, thanks to Bosch common rail. even the A.S.S in scorpio is cheaper. also i have heard horrible engine problems in safari from my frens and also read quiet a few in Team BHP. cant take chances. i hope pavan now u would understand why i am inclined towards scorpio...
Nishant,

Honestly, Scorpio, similar to Safari, has a very proven engine. But, having said that, it is a fact that the cost of spares has a considerable difference if you take one on one between the both. Similarly, the cost of service is also lighter if you take the comparion.

But then, if you talk about horrible stories, it might be that Safari has more niggles than Scorpio, if you take a stat of say, every 1000 vehicles. But then, this does not mean that the Scorpio is a trouble free 'Buy it, ride it' vehicle. The reason why you see so many issues noted, is because the Safari crowd is more vocal about their issues and a collective effort for resolution.

Now, having said about the cost part, Safari has its own advantage - ride comfort. Scorpio is good to drive, Safari is better. And if you are using the middle row ofter, meaning, if you are being driven or have family members who travel in the middle, then a Scorpio is definitely not something that will give traveling comfort.

As said, take a long distance in both vehicle and decide. After all, at the end, YOU are the one who is spending YOUR HARD EARNED money. So, firstly I would respect comments from people with similar standing, but then, the final result will be my own inference from the TD is do with my family.

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Originally Posted by PAVAN KADAM View Post
... With a bouncing drive i dont feel the scorpio can give anyone a comfortable drive than a Safari.
...
MODS: the thread starter has vanished of-late.
The one and only reason that is keeping me away from the Scorpio, since my wife and kid will be the full time occupants of this. This is even after having a family member heading the service center of one of the largest and oldest M&M dealer at my home town.

And yes, where is the thread starter?

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Originally Posted by anjan_c2007 View Post
Today I was chatting with a second hand car broker who said he had a white 2008 Safari 2.2 L Dicor whose owner was willing to sell it for Rs 6L.Did not see the SUV but is that how this truck depreciates in the second hand market?
I am sure that this might be an accident vehicle or something, else you will never get this price, that too for a 2.2 of 2008 make. If this was so, we would have almost 2 (or was it three) happy second hand owners here in this forum.

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Originally Posted by raj_5004 View Post
... i have driven/travelled in the scorpio on highways for lakhs of kms & never faced a problem till now. i dont see a reason why others should feel so.
No seriously, "lakhs"? WOW!
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Old 14th March 2009, 08:46   #92
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Originally Posted by HappyWheels View Post


No seriously, "lakhs"? WOW!
because i have been owning a scorpio since 2003! and that is the accumulative distance of both driven & travelled.

Last edited by raj_5004 : 14th March 2009 at 08:47.
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Old 14th March 2009, 11:22   #93
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Originally Posted by nishant kar View Post
On second thoughts with ur budget of 10 lk and if u can go over by say 30k u can get a Scorpio vlx Automatic (6 speed automatic) its convenient for city traffic. scorpio vlx AT is bharat stage 4 with all luxury technology like, cruise control, micro hybrid, tyre tronics, electric orvm, reverse parking sensors or intellipark, automatic wipers and headlights, 2 din audio with usb and sd, digital immobilizer, steering mounted controls, smart window, alloy wheels, tiltable steering the list goes on, if u dont want automatic the same package is also available with vlx at 9.2 lk ex chennai. i know ur against scorp but just td and a long one, make sure u have a Mhawk it will impress u. i have personally driven scorpio on long trips 3000+ km and there aint any prob.
Nishant,
I had a chance of speaking with a Sardarji on Mehrauli road about 3 weeks back who was driving a Mahindra Scorpio Automatic, and he told me that he is'nt satisfied with the gear box ratio of the automatic version as the vechicle does behave "funny" after crossing 40KMPH mark in AT version. But again, that was the opnion of one person with whom I spoke for 5 minutes.
Regards
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Old 14th March 2009, 13:38   #94
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Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
So you have the LPSV(Load Pressure sensive valve) which tries to prevent the rear wheels from locking up.
Its LSPV, or Load-Sensitive (or Load Sensing) Proportioning Valve.

Its function is not to prevent the rear wheels from locking up. Quoting the Dictionary of Automotive Terms Abbreviations, this is what it does:

A valve which regulates hydraulic pressure to the rear wheels as a function of chassis height-to-axle distance. A vehicle weight transfer during hard braking increases this distance and, via a spring or rod linkage, will close the valve to reduce braking pressure at the rear wheels; also, a heavily loaded car will have more braking power at the rear wheels


Basically it adjusts brake-bias based on the weight the vehicle is carrying, providing more braking force when the vehicle is fully laden (and the chassis sits lower). When set incorrectly, it provides more braking force to the rear even when there is no load.

Last edited by Steeroid : 14th March 2009 at 13:39.
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Old 15th March 2009, 14:30   #95
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@HappyWheels

thanks for the info but i do want to confirm one thing Are Scorpio spares and service & maintenance cost on the lower side as compared to safari.

@Raj and happywheels

i know the scorpio ride was very bouncy in earlier versions but i also know for a fact that M&M did approach Lotus engineering of germany after which the ride in the New Scorpio was far better as compared to before.

@jimmyjagga

thanks for the info of Scorpio Automatic but that i had suggested for Abhi I am more inclined towards Scorpio Sle ABS


At a price piont of 8.5 lk is is better to take Scorpio Sle with ABS (all the regular goodies) or is it better to go for safari Lx
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Old 15th March 2009, 16:18   #96
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Go for the sle if thats your benchmark. Safari sob stories (whether the car or the asc) are horrific. I would kill myself if i experience these things after plonking down 10l. I pity m upreti who has an mhawk and tanveer who has a safari 4x4. Now, a few members have also claimed havoc from the mhawk. God, this is tough!
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Old 15th March 2009, 17:18   #97
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@nishant kar > Hopefully 7 pages of advice should help you make up your mind.
There arent many options to choose from anyways.
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Old 15th March 2009, 20:56   #98
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Quote:
nishant kar
At a price piont of 8.5 lk is is better to take Scorpio Sle with ABS (all the regular goodies) or is it better to go for safari Lx
Better to stay away from these so called SUVs and buy a good reliable sedan for that price.
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Old 15th March 2009, 21:10   #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nishant kar View Post
@HappyWheels

thanks for the info but i do want to confirm one thing Are Scorpio spares and service & maintenance cost on the lower side as compared to safari.

@Raj and happywheels

i know the scorpio ride was very bouncy in earlier versions but i also know for a fact that M&M did approach Lotus engineering of germany after which the ride in the New Scorpio was far better as compared to before.

@jimmyjagga

thanks for the info of Scorpio Automatic but that i had suggested for Abhi I am more inclined towards Scorpio Sle ABS


At a price piont of 8.5 lk is is better to take Scorpio Sle with ABS (all the regular goodies) or is it better to go for safari Lx
yes, scorpio spares & service is cheaper than safari.
though the scorpio's suspension is tuned by lotus, it is not as comfortable as the safari.
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Old 15th March 2009, 22:37   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raj_5004 View Post
yes, scorpio spares & service is cheaper than safari.
though the scorpio's suspension is tuned by lotus, it is not as comfortable as the safari.
sir,

Could we tally some bills, since you've mentioned about spares for both the cars.

We do have spare list and prices put up by Dadu on this forum somewhere.

Thanks for admitting Safari ride is better and comfortable that the Scorpio.

I would give a 8/10 for the Scorpio engine for its liveliness.

Hope this starts the confusion
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Old 15th March 2009, 23:19   #101
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The key question here is would you rather sit in a car thats comfy to be in but doesnt go anywhere or a car thats mildly comfortable and does actually go somewhere? That is the pondering that many of us are going through. Though both upreti and tanveer are going through similar issues, its about how the respective manufacturer treats them.
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Old 16th March 2009, 00:23   #102
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Originally Posted by breezydrive View Post
Better to stay away from these so called SUVs and buy a good reliable sedan for that price.
I've owned one of those for nearly four years now. So have several thousand others.

Its a bit ridiculous to be saying things like these based on odd incidents. Over 3 years ago there was this Autocar article on a Ford Endeavour purchased by someone in Mumbai which had a list of issues from engine to transmission to chassis to everything else. Havent people bought Endeavours after that?

Similarly with Skodas, the Hyundai lemon sold by the dealer in Trivandrum, etc.

It is quite tempting to go with the mood of the moment and keep painting the two manufacturers in question black and blue based on 2 individual members experiences. Yes they are not the perfect pictures of reliability, this is something we all know.

I have taken my truck to various places and not gotten stuck. I've travelled with my family in the middle of the night through jungles, we've never gotten stuck. I've driven it through rocky riverbeds, it hasnt given up on me. I've driven it through slushy paddy fields and mixed terrain, it hasnt let me down.

The only major issues I have had with my truck are those that have occurred when I was away and it was used by several others. Perhaps I am lucky in that respect, but I did resist the attempt to shout out from the rooftops and instead went about finding solutions.

What I found was that the manufacturer in question is every bit as responsive as others, once you cut through the first layer of dealerships. They had enough and more cause to have charged the job to me without honouring the warranty - the point is that they didnt even bring up the topic but went about getting the vehicle sorted out.

Yes the dealer in question did screw up big time. I nearly lost my patience on occassion, but some perseverance and some personal attention (not by me but by fellow member nikkibike) have ensured that I have today a truck that is as good as it was when it left the showroom 3 years and 70k kms ago.

Owning these vehicles is not as trouble-free experience as with a Toyota or a Honda - it does take some amount of involvement on your part as you cannot take service quality for granted. These things are built to a cost, therefore some compromises on parts quality are expected - if you dont want those compromises, feel free to pay about twice the cost for a similar vehicle with better (but not the best) quality.

None of this is a justification for the vehicle getting you stranded in the middle of nowhere - that feeling can be sickening. That is something that shouldnt happen to anyone, but its not like people only get stranded in these vehicles. We've had people stranded in a Skoda in Idukki district and even in a C Class on NH 17 on the way to Mumbai - these were not punctures or accidents. Its just that incidents with both these vehicles tend to get highlighted because the owners are usually like people like you and me and will therefore ensure that their voices are heard. The profile of a 20-lakh plus vehicle owner is different - few of them spend time online, to begin with.

On a personal level, perhaps I could've spent the extra 10 lakhs for the more 'reliable' vehicles. The point is that at 20+, they still did not meet all my requirements like the one I ultimately bought did at about half the price. Again, my requirement was different - I would use this vehicle on my occassional trips to India, where they would be driven hard and driven for long distances. I needed something that would take that punishment and not cost me a fortune in service afterwards. Has it fulfilled that purpose? Hell, yeah! With the kind of punishing drives we put in, I would expect the 20 lakh plus choice to have cost me at least 2-3 lakhs in regular service + repairs by now.

Last edited by Steeroid : 16th March 2009 at 00:28.
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Old 16th March 2009, 01:38   #103
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I somehow get the feeling that all is not Kosher with the 2.2 VVTI. I suspect that the CRDe pump etc.. sourced has some issues. I know that Tanweer's issues are exceptional and his car is a particularly bad one. But pretty much all the 2.2 VVTI owners have had some problem or the other with the VVTI engine/injectors.

Hope Tata gets to the bottom of this and sorts this out.
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Old 16th March 2009, 01:53   #104
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Originally Posted by 4x4addict View Post
I somehow get the feeling that all is not Kosher with the 2.2 VVTI.
The Service Manager at Concorde (who has spent time at other Tata Dealerships before) seems to think otherwise. He says there were Common Rail related issues with the 3.0 initially but the 2.2 has very few engine-specific issues if at all. Its another matter that the chap likes the mid-range of the 3.0 better.
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Old 16th March 2009, 09:04   #105
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There are 3-4 other members with 2.2 on tbhp who get service light on coasting after going ti 80kmph on 4th/5th gear.
At autolinks there were 2 other safari's(2.2) with similar service light problem, waiting for injectors.
So something is seriously wrong with QC at the manufacturer end. I have been stranded with my indica, but the car had done 70K kms, and she was more than 4 years old.
But I guess the thread starter needs to look at the percentage of people who have not had any problems with their safari's and then see if he is lucky enough to take the chance
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