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Old 19th November 2010, 16:47   #1
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Default People Carrier - What to buy and what not to buy!!

Before I start, let me list the competitors
1.Tata Safari
2.Tata Sumo Grande
3.Tata Winger Platinum
4.Tata Aria
5.Mahindra Scorpio
6.Mahindra Xylo
7.Mahindra Bolero
8.Mitsubishi Pajero (Used – priced around 6L)
9.Toyota Innova

Price range is about 10-11L. Something cheap is also great.

Now, coming to my criteria.
This is where things start to get a little bit overboard and confusing.

1.All of us want to be able to travel in comfort.
2.All of us want the car to be able to seat 7 people in comfort
3.No OTRs. So no 4X4 required.
4.My wife and my brother want the car to look good and ooze status.
5.My brother wants an SUV type of car.
6.All of us want something that is dependable.
7.All of us want good highway manners
8.My brother and I want a something that is a newer technology and not age old.
9.Price

Now, let’s apply the above criteria to the competitors listed.

1.Safari – Addresses 1,3,4,5,6,7,8,9
2.Sumo Grande – Addresses 1,2,3,4,8,9
3.Winger – Addresses 1,2,3,6,9. I am not sure of the highway manners of the Winger.
4.Aria - Addresses 1,3,4,6,7,8.
5.Scorpio – Addresses 1,3,5,6,8,9.
6.Xylo – Addresses 1,2,3,6,9.
7.Bolero – Addresses 1,3,4,5,6,7,8,9.
8.Pajero – Addresses 1,2,3,4,5,6,7.
9.Innova – 1,2,3,4,6,7,9.

Voting –
Based on a vote held at home, the contenders are stacked up as below –
1.Safari – 2 in favour, 2 against. (my wife and mother do not like the baby seats)
2.Grande – 0 in favour, 4 against.
3.Winger – 3 in favour, 1 against. (you might have guessed that this is my brother )
4.Aria - 0 in favour, 4 against. (pricey)
5.Scorpio - 0 in favour, 4 against. (looks)
6.Xylo - 0 in favour, 4 against. (looks)
7.Bolero - 1 in favour, 3 against. (I am in favour of this, afterall it’s the best selling UV of the country!!)
8.Pajero - 1 in favour, 1 against, 2 neutral. (The engine technology is very old, at least 18 years. Also, am not getting anything in the price range specified.)
9.Innova - 3 in favour, 1 against. (you might have guessed that this is my brother )

Elimination - Let’s eliminate some of the contenders which have received 0 votes.
1.Grande,
2.Aria,
3.Scorpio
4.Xylo

9 becomes 5.
I am eliminating the Pajero as well, because of non availability of reliable used ones.

So, 9 becomes 4.

So, all gurus here, please help me in making a right decision.

Should we go for the Safari and 'reclaim my life'?
Should I buy the Winger and use the additional money in modifications?
Should I pick up the Scorpio, 'because nothing else will do'?
Should I just play it safe and buy the market leader - The Innova?

Please advise.

I know, I have gone a little bit overboard. Please excuse me for that. I just wanted to put down all the facts so that a proper decision can be made.

Edit - I have a GP-MJD which serves wonderfully as an urban car. So this UV is for 90% highway rides and 10% city.

Last edited by gods-envy : 19th November 2010 at 16:54.
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Old 19th November 2010, 17:42   #2
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Go for the Innova with eyes closed. Its what you call fill the tank and hit those highway roads. Pleasure to drive even inside the city if the need arises. Rock solid reliability, Toyota badge, nice engine. I have one since 5 years now and it just doesnt leave you feel wanting in any department.

Forgot to add that the seating comfort is great. I have been inside the car for long distances(300+ kms) in all the 3 rows at different times. And being 5'11 and well built I was pretty comfortable even in the third row.

Last edited by drmohitg : 19th November 2010 at 17:44.
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Old 19th November 2010, 17:57   #3
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If you are OK with the used ones, check for Captiva.

Else, if this is not an immediate buy, you can wait for the new world SUV from Mahindra, I'm guessing that it would satisfy all of your needs. Mahindra would have improved many things on this vehicle after seeing the market response to Aria (Last row seating, features, pricing, etc.,).

Cheers,
Rajesh

Last edited by 2500cc : 19th November 2010 at 17:58.
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Old 19th November 2010, 18:31   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drmohitg View Post
Go for the Innova with eyes closed..
drmohit, Thank you for your response.
I agree with the market leader. It's a great car and I have no second thoughts about it.

But here is my argument on it -

As quoted, my budget is 10L. For this money all that I can get is the basic version with power steering which retails in Bangalore for 10.60L. I am not looking to invest anything more as I cannot afford it.

So, for close to 2L cheap, if I can get a little bit more in the form of a Tata Winger/Xylo/Safari, why not take the plunge?

So, among the three, I get better space and comfort in the Winger Platinum, though the Safari is in a different segment.
What I ask is simple, Is something wrong with the Winger?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2500cc View Post
If you are OK with the used ones, check for Captiva.

Else, if this is not an immediate buy, you can wait for the new world SUV from Mahindra, I'm guessing that it would satisfy all of your needs. Mahindra would have improved many things on this vehicle after seeing the market response to Aria (Last row seating, features, pricing, etc.,).
Rajesh, Did search on the net for a few Captivas but nothing were in my price range. As I mentioned earlier, if its a used car, my budget would drop even lower because of the high interest rates (16%).

As per ACI, the World SUV from Mahindra is quoted at the 12L price budget which again is beyond my budget.

Last edited by gods-envy : 19th November 2010 at 18:34.
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Old 19th November 2010, 18:38   #5
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Agree to what someone else has said here. Go for the best people mover in India with your eyes closed. Buy the Innova and you will certainly end up satisfied.
It is comfortable, classy in its segment, hugely dependable and most of all, a very very successful model.

You could also look at buying a used top end version if you cannot afford a new one.
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Old 19th November 2010, 18:45   #6
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I think you should go for the Innova with Captains seats in the second row. This will make it very comfortable when the four of you are on the highway and ingress and egress for the third row is also easy. Dependable, comfortable and good resale value. The best VFM of the lot.
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Old 19th November 2010, 18:53   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gods-envy View Post
Should we go for the Safari and 'reclaim my life'?
Should I buy the Winger and use the additional money in modifications?
Should I pick up the Scorpio, 'because nothing else will do'?
Should I just play it safe and buy the market leader - The Innova?
The Safari is old except for its engine. There is too much of body roll and pitching. So I am not sure if the highway journeys would be comfortable for all. Also in general they seem to be more prone to problems/failures.

When I have enquired with tour/travel operators for hiring the Winger for long distance highway travels, they have advised me against it. According to them, it is good for City or short distance travelling.

Innova should be your choice. It has got praises for its decent power, highway manners and the way the vehicle holds itself together over the years. Excellent resale value. The one with captain seats in the middle row would make it very comfortable for 4 adults and 3 children/3 people who are not very tall. Like someone said, you can try to get a used top end version that fits your budget.

If you ask my 9-year old son, he would choose the Xylo. Although I loved its space, the fit and finish were nowhere close to an Innova. I drove it only a short distance, so cannot comment on the other aspects of Xylo.

-Biju

Last edited by pjbiju : 19th November 2010 at 19:04.
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Old 19th November 2010, 19:51   #8
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I travelled in Innova for more than a year and a half in Bangalore and sometimes I had to sit in the last row. After a hectic night shift I used to curse myself for having to sit in the last row. Else, Innova is a great vehicle for highway cruising with 5 adults and 2 5.4 inchers on board. I do respect Innova for its quality and reliability. However, am not able to convince myself to invest 14+L on Innova Vx. But this is just my opinion.

Your next best bet is Xylo. I got a chance to travel between Pune-Mumbai on the old road (not the expressway). The Road condition was bad, but the ride was very comfortable. It was a 7-seater that i travelled in and i was sitting on the right side of the 3rd row. It was really good. Acres of space to stretch. The speed was between 120-130kmph, the potholes were hardly felt inside the cabin, Engine noise was well insulated, Body roll was highly controlled and all this was in the D2 version of Xylo.

Engine is not as old as you think it is and the looks tend to grow over . @ 10.30L OTR for the top-end in Bangalore, Xylo, i believe is a real VFM.

Am the guy who is particular about my hard earned money. So if I were you, then Xylo would have been my obvious choice or wait for the World SUV from M&M. Coz my next car should last me atleast 10yrs.

Cheers,
Rajesh

Last edited by 2500cc : 19th November 2010 at 19:52.
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Old 19th November 2010, 19:57   #9
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Why not wait for the tata venture? Launch is imminent.

Other than that, it's the innova which suits your criteria. (The one without captain seats so that 7 fit in comfort).
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Old 19th November 2010, 20:11   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gods-envy View Post
-

As quoted, my budget is 10L. For this money all that I can get is the basic version with power steering which retails in Bangalore for 10.60L. I am not looking to invest anything more as I cannot afford it.

So, for close to 2L cheap, if I can get a little bit more in the form of a Tata Winger/Xylo/Safari, why not take the plunge?

So, among the three, I get better space and comfort in the Winger Platinum, though the Safari is in a different segment.
What I ask is simple, Is something wrong with the Winger?
Hey I do not have any problem with the winger as such. But honestly just take a look at it and then a look at the innova or safari or scorpio for that matter- and you should be easily be able to rule it out. IMHO it doesnt look anything like an suv nor has any status value( 2 points on which your wife and brother seem to be firm).
As fas as safari is concerned I haven ever driven one. So I am not really sure. But compared to an Innova i believe it is slightly less reliable. Also I think it is up for a facelift soon right?

I totally agree that the Innova is a little pricey but believe me after splurging on it once you wont need to invest any money afterwards for a long long time. Also have you considered buying a used Innova? There must surely be a lot of them available and Innovas are good for atleast 2-3L kms if not more( from what i have read on TBHP).

Someone else pointed out about the third row comfort. Please keep in mind it is ofcourse not better then say the middle row. It cant be right? But compared to all other vehicles including 20L SUVs its the best.
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Old 19th November 2010, 20:38   #11
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Innova. If you want 7 people to travel in comfort.

The SUV's are 5+2 : the 2 is the two jump seats at the back, which wouldnt be too comfortable on long trips.

I really dont see any other option here.
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Old 19th November 2010, 21:30   #12
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To me the only options are Innova, Xylo or Aria. Since Aria is out of budget the logical buy would be either of Innova or Xylo. With VFM pricing and last row seating comfort, I would go for the Xylo.

I know it doesn't look good but do TD it, you'll be amazed!
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Old 20th November 2010, 02:06   #13
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My view is Innova. BTW, Innova is not old technology (I see that you have not Included Innova in the "New tech" criteria - No 8 in your list). It may have an engine first released in 2001 (2KDFTV was primarily designed for commercial vehicle use and generally has a hassle free life) but it is a Common Rail and pretty much up there with other engines in terms of reliability and performance. I would hasten to add that maybe this is the engine that will probably last the longest amongst your list of competitors.
Innovas last and age pretty well. I have been inside vehicles that have done 250000 kms + and they did not look very old, Interiors not rattling away to glory and engine still pulling hard as a new one.
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Old 20th November 2010, 10:03   #14
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Thank you all, guys!!

Innova sure seems to be the clear winner....

I did TD the Xylo once, but was not all that impressed. Also I do not like its looks.
Also, there are complaints in and around Tbhp about its bad road handling capability.

Eitherways, I am planning on TDing a Winger today. Though I am not very inclined towards it; no harm in taking one test drive.

I saw some snaps of the Tata Venture. Looking at it, I feel its a people mover for the city and not for the highways; my personal opinion.

Let's see how it goes.
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Old 20th November 2010, 11:21   #15
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Exactly. Venture is an amazing vehicle in its segment ie if you are comparing it with the maruti omni. I hope it becomes a best seller in that segment . Tired of those omni looks. Its been the same for more of a decade apart from minor changes.
Gods-envy looking forward to your TD report. Also i would suggest go and TD the Innova right after it. I am sure you will love the experience .
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