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Old 19th January 2014, 22:50   #361
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Volvo is good but BMW has better service packages. Haven't spend a penny in over a year on 3 series (except for broken sunroof). Also our experience with BMW service has been good. So a little biased in favor of BMW
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Old 12th February 2014, 00:10   #362
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Default Re: Which 7 Seater SUV for 17-25L? Endeavour vs Fortuner vs Captiva vs Pajero vs Sant

Guys planning to buy a SUV soon. Wanted to have a look at Santa Fe but the pricing (Approx 29.25L for 4x2 MT & 30.5L for 4x2 AT Onroad) seems to have killed it for me making the Fortuner seem like a steal for 25L for 4x2 MT & 26.25L for 4x2 AT (Both onroad).

There are a few things about which I need a bit of clarification

a) Ride quality of the Fortuner since the the main usage would in the city.
b) MT or AT ?? Is AT reliability on par with the legendary reliability of the MT ?? AT costs nearly 1.25 L more & offers cruise control in addition which might be useless in the city.
c) Any facelifts that we can expect in the near future ?? Waiting in my city is 3 months approx & I wouldn't wanna be stuck with a model with a facelift / update coming up in an 6 months or so even if its a bit expensive.
d) Would looking into XUV 5OO / Q3 (badge) may be of any help keeping the requirement in mind esp ride quality & reliability??

7 seater is mandatory requirement even though it might be rarely used during trips etc. Any advice would be highly appreciated.

P.S. Ruled out Rexton, Captiva, X Trail & Pajero due to service quality related reasons. Endy since TD didn't impress. CRV - Petrol.

Last edited by beanstalk_230 : 12th February 2014 at 00:16.
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Old 12th February 2014, 10:16   #363
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Default Re: Which 7 Seater SUV for 17-25L? Endeavour vs Fortuner vs Captiva vs Pajero vs Sant

let me share my view. the fortuner is the best Bang for the Buck in an already overpriced segment ( > 20L) The Santa Fe is seriously overpriced ! it would have been worth maybe 6L lower and am glad i did not wait for it.
a) Now Ride quality is a different ball game and 1:1 the Innova is more comfortable by a proverbial Mile especially in the 2nd row .The Fortuner, from all my research can be improved with a suspension upgrade (Bilstien/Tien) costing 85-1.8 L which still makes it more value for money although with a warranty impact.
The problem is really high at low speeds and that was a deal-breaker for me as in Bangalore Roads, roads are offroad even within the city in sudden stretches and this does not do well here for the price segment it is in. at higher speeds it is a lot better, but a problem still although there are enough reports of folks who have played around with tyre pressures etc etc to get this right in this forum.

b) For the Fortuner, If you do a lot of Highway runs at high speed, the 4x4 is what makes the most sense as it has a better road grip, in the city the 4x2 AT would make more sense as the gear shift is not all that great- very trucklike . The Fortuner is the most Nimble among all at low speeds and brakes will not be an issue unlike in Highways.

d) The XUV is truly Value for money but the worry is you could still be one of those who gets stuck by the (in)famed "Niggles". I personally got worried with reports of the vehicle no starting during trips, but felt it is very comfortable and a breeze to drive and the ride quality like a fortuner (at a much lower price) also the view from the drivers seat is a lot better as the fortuner lets you see only the front scoop. Its electronics are mind boggling.
But the question is, if you have the budget for a Fortuner, would you still be happy with an XUV 2 years from today ?

Last edited by sh@rpshooter : 12th February 2014 at 10:18.
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Old 12th February 2014, 11:15   #364
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Default Re: Which 7 Seater SUV for 17-25L? Endeavour vs Fortuner vs Captiva vs Pajero vs Sant

Grrrrrr... The Santa Fe pricing really ruined it! So, now that we have thrown that out of the equation altogether, what are our options?

Needs:
1. AT Gearbox
2. 6-7 Seats
3. Excellent Ride Comfort
4. Good Safety Features
5. Reasonable A.S.S and Reliability
6. Diesel Fuel
7. New (No Pre-Owned)

Wants:
1. Sun Roof
2. Integrated GPS and Gizmos
3. Leather Seats
4. 4x4 - Low Range NOT required

Maximum budget (post all extensions and additions ) - INR 28 Lacs On Road Delhi

What are our options here? We are currently considering the Rexton AT, Fortuner AT and the Endevor 4x4 AT.
The Car will be purchased through Company Leasing, so cannot be modified for 4 years.

EDIT: The Ownership Horizon is 8-10 years and we will buy the car out, after the leasing term, at 20% of the initial value (fixed upfront).

Last edited by roy_libran : 12th February 2014 at 11:40.
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Old 12th February 2014, 11:30   #365
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Default Re: Which 7 Seater SUV for 17-25L? Endeavour vs Fortuner vs Captiva vs Pajero vs Sant

if you are Leasing, the Captiva should be a good option. It anyway depreciates too fast to buy on loan or otherwise as resale is low
As per specs it has a really powerful engine, good electronics , 6 Airbags and the full works and a better GC than the Santa Fe.

I was considering the leasing options as well but then decided against it
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Old 12th February 2014, 11:38   #366
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Default Re: Which 7 Seater SUV for 17-25L? Endeavour vs Fortuner vs Captiva vs Pajero vs Sant

Quote:
Originally Posted by sh@rpshooter View Post
if you are Leasing, the Captiva should be a good option. It anyway depreciates too fast to buy on loan or otherwise as resale is low
As per specs it has a really powerful engine, good electronics , 6 Airbags and the full works and a better GC than the Santa Fe.

I was considering the leasing options as well but then decided against it
Depreciation is not a concern really, since the buy out value is fixed at 20% of the initial price, after 4 years.
Captiva is not being considered, since:
1. It is a Chevy, and their products (except Cruze and Beat) are a bit dodgy (family opinion). Also, the A.S.S is nothing to talk about.
2. It is an outdated model.
3. We didn't feel it was comfy enough for 7 people.

Last edited by roy_libran : 12th February 2014 at 11:40.
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Old 12th February 2014, 13:58   #367
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Default Re: Which 7 Seater SUV for 17-25L? Endeavour vs Fortuner vs Captiva vs Pajero vs Sant

Not interested in the 4x4 since 90% would be city driving & rest highway. No off roading as such. The only problem with the AT is that I could not find any long term reviews of the same & nor do I know anyone around me driving the same unit. That puts a question mark on the reliability factor since that is a major concern & in any way won't wanna lose out on it thus leaving me with the 4x2 MT as the only option.
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Old 12th February 2014, 14:11   #368
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Default Re: Which 7 Seater SUV for 17-25L? Endeavour vs Fortuner vs Captiva vs Pajero vs Sant

Quote:
Originally Posted by roy_libran View Post
what are our options?

Needs:
1. AT Gearbox
2. 6-7 Seats
3. Excellent Ride Comfort
4. Good Safety Features
5. Reasonable A.S.S and Reliability
6. Diesel Fuel
7. New (No Pre-Owned)

Wants:
1. Sun Roof
2. Integrated GPS and Gizmos
3. Leather Seats
4. 4x4 - Low Range NOT required
I would stick with the Fortuner just for the bullet proof reliability, economy of post-ownership, take it anywhere vehicle and resale part.

What it has is - AT, 7 Seater, Sufficient Safety (though would have preferred 6 Airbags), Reasonable ASS, Excellent Reliability, Economical Servicing and Spares, Diesel, Leather Seats, For 4x4 you need to opt for MT, Sufficient Gizmos (rear camera etc.)

What is doesn't have - Excellent ride (little bumpy but that's with most SUVs), Sun Roof (mostly useless in Indian conditions), GPS (can easily be added on)

Last edited by dkaile : 12th February 2014 at 14:12.
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Old 12th February 2014, 14:20   #369
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Default Re: Which 7 Seater SUV for 17-25L? Endeavour vs Fortuner vs Captiva vs Pajero vs Sant

Quote:
Originally Posted by dkaile View Post
I would stick with the Fortuner just for the bullet proof reliability, economy of post-ownership, take it anywhere vehicle and resale part.

What it has is - AT, 7 Seater, Sufficient Safety (though would have preferred 6 Airbags), Reasonable ASS, Excellent Reliability, Economical Servicing and Spares, Diesel, Leather Seats, For 4x4 you need to opt for MT, Sufficient Gizmos (rear camera etc.)

What is doesn't have - Excellent ride (little bumpy but that's with most SUVs), Sun Roof (mostly useless in Indian conditions), GPS (can easily be added on)
Thanks.
We realize that a Fortuner 4x2 Sportivo is the default choice in this segment. But, we detest the Ride quality, and it is a bit low in refinement and features.

Also the fact that this will be purchased through leasing means we'll not be able to get the suspension upgraded for 4 years; which in turn means putting up with it's horrid ride quality for 4 years! This is what if currently forcing us to look at the other options in this segment.
We might as well come to realize eventually, that the Fortuner still remains the best in that segment overall, and may end up buying the same, but we need to thrash out the others before we get there.
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Old 12th February 2014, 14:30   #370
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Default Re: Which 7 Seater SUV for 17-25L? Endeavour vs Fortuner vs Captiva vs Pajero vs Sant

My vote would be for Santa Fe or the Fortuner. The only grouse with Fortuner is that the design looks a bit jaded. Not sure if it's because we see a lot more of Fortuner's offlate on the road. The new Santa Fe looks fresh and appealing. Hyundai seems to have addressed many of the previous issues in the new version. My two cents!
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Old 12th February 2014, 14:45   #371
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Default Re: Which 7 Seater SUV for 17-25L? Endeavour vs Fortuner vs Captiva vs Pajero vs Sant

Santa Fe is out of consideration, Period!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vid6639 View Post
The Fortuner should be removed from your list just because of the above one reason. It has one of the bumpiest ride quality out there.

The Santa Fe is expensive but trust me it is worth it. The interior quality, features, space is itself worth the premium. If you didn't know that the badge is a Hyundai you can easily mistake it for a euro SUV worth 2X the price.
Santa Fe 4x4 AT ticks all the right boxes except price (Leasing value is constrained by Income Level). So, that's out. The 4x2 AT doesn't have adequate safety for the price or segment.

Last edited by roy_libran : 12th February 2014 at 14:48.
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Old 12th February 2014, 14:45   #372
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Default Re: Which 7 Seater SUV for 17-25L? Endeavour vs Fortuner vs Captiva vs Pajero vs Sant

Quote:
Originally Posted by roy_libran View Post
Grrrrrr... The Santa Fe pricing really ruined it! So, now that we have thrown that out of the equation altogether, what are our options?

Needs:

3. Excellent Ride Comfort
The Fortuner should be removed from your list just because of the above one reason. It has one of the bumpiest ride quality out there. My dad refused to go for a TD of more than 5mins just because of the ride.

The Santa Fe is expensive but trust me it is worth it. The interior quality, features, space is itself worth the premium. If you didn't know that the badge is a Hyundai you can easily mistake it for a euro SUV worth 2X the price.

I sat in a BMW X3 then the Santa Fe and I kept wondering where the 30L extra is in the BMW.

The excellent interior quality coupled with the ride is worth the 5-6 L premium over the Fortuner. It's a stretch but well worth it imo.

Ofcourse, you should wait for our review to see how performance and actual ride quality is.
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Old 12th February 2014, 16:14   #373
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Default Re: Which 7 Seater SUV for 17-25L? Endeavour vs Fortuner vs Captiva vs Pajero vs Sant

Quote:
Originally Posted by roy_libran View Post
Thanks.
We realize that a Fortuner 4x2 Sportivo is the default choice in this segment. But, we detest the Ride quality, and it is a bit low in refinement and features.
...
We might as well come to realize eventually, that the Fortuner still remains the best in that segment overall, and may end up buying the same, but we need to thrash out the others before we get there.
The problem in this segment is there looks to be many options, but when we start going into details there seem to be very limited!!

The Fortuner is a Head decision as the economics make it fantastic and once you have test driven others it is not a heart decision by any means primarily due to the Ride Quality.
And if you want the Road presence of a Bison (albeit a common one), this is the real thing.

Since you are looking only for city driving, you are really looking at a Soft Roader in diesel which will have a far better ride quality and the only ones i know being the Santa Fe/Captiva

BTW is the Rexton Servicing bad ?
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Old 12th February 2014, 16:23   #374
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Default Re: Which 7 Seater SUV for 17-25L? Endeavour vs Fortuner vs Captiva vs Pajero vs Sant

Quote:
Originally Posted by sh@rpshooter View Post

Since you are looking only for city driving, you are really looking at a Soft Roader in diesel which will have a far better ride quality and the only ones i know being the Santa Fe/Captiva
Never said that we are only looking for driving in the city. We mean for this vehicle to be used as a family tourer as well as a daily city drive. What we don't intend doing, is taking it off-road, certainly not to any tough trails.
Santa Fe and Captiva are out of consideration completely, for totally different reasons, as mentioned above.
What are the Pros and Cons of a Rexton or Endevor, especially when compared to a Fortuner?
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Old 12th February 2014, 21:02   #375
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Default Re: Which 7 Seater SUV for 17-25L? Endeavour vs Fortuner vs Captiva vs Pajero vs Sant

Quote:
Originally Posted by roy_libran View Post
Needs:
1. AT Gearbox
2. 6-7 Seats
3. Excellent Ride Comfort
4. Good Safety Features
5. Reasonable A.S.S and Reliability
6. Diesel Fuel
7. New (No Pre-Owned)

Wants:
1. Sun Roof
2. Integrated GPS and Gizmos
3. Leather Seats
4. 4x4 - Low Range NOT required

Maximum budget (post all extensions and additions ) - INR 28 Lacs On Road Delhi
Santa Fe was the car for you, but the pricing ruined the game for you. Santa Fe feels premium enough to make the Trucks you are considering feel poverty spec. Also since you have the Gurkha for all the hardcore offroading, Ladder frame SUVs with bulky Solid Axles and unsettled on road dynamics will only serve as full time irritants.

Is the Automatic Transmission really a must have, you must be really spoilt after you bought the Ecosport AT. If you can settle for Manual transmission, then my one word suggestion is Fortuner 4x4.

Endeavour is ageing, may not be in the showrooms after a few months. The replacement new Endeavour seems promising, only if you are willing to wait.

Rexton is one car which gives me zero thrills, i get to drive it like everyday, my friend and business partner owns it(MT version). In Total this car has spent 30+ days in the service center and still has niggles. Drive experience is not to my taste, only saving grace are those premium interiors and the creamy smooth 5 cylinder engine.

Pajero Sport is equally good as Fortuner, slightly better Ride but Slightly inferior Handling, minus the service support.

The real VFM is XUV 500 AWD. Talking about niggles, my car is absolutely niggle free since the last update some 10,000+ kilometers. If you do not really care for off road competence, the on road dynamics are superior than any the chassis based trucks i mentioned earlier. The tall gearing and peppy engine is good, you'd get better FE than the trucks. Another sample is my Sister's XUV, done 20k, no issue to report. Service support is really good, service station staff know the car really well(unlike the Rexton, which requires inputs from factory team and even Korea tech team), parts are readily available and will be in production a decade later.
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