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Old 6th October 2008, 01:02   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by throttleking View Post
Ashish, give me some more and i would post complete information, about routes, food, places, risks, issues, fuel station, what to carry? and everythng else. with alternate options available.
For those who feel that their car wont make it, one of my friends is doing Leh every year in his M800 since last four years.
Leh - BikeNomads has all the data u asked for.
petrol guys - ~350km between fuel stations.
diesel:300km. (upshi had two, karu one, then leh).

and saar, sorry to be rude, but m800 is the BEST car by far for the leh circuit unless 4up - it has ok torque and is ultimate lightweight. For all the brouhaha, its just a fricken road y'know.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shakensoul View Post
I don't have a choice as I don't have another car

Yes, I am definitely preparing for the worst. Lot of spares, raise the body by shocker spacers and installing skid plates under the body.
Oh well. chill maadi.
Pulsar and wagonR's ground clearance is almost the same ~170mm (give or take 5mm here or there). also depends on loading, but all said, I had no issues on a fully loaded p180. GC wasnt the issue ever. Only place you may have issues would be a rabid water crossing - pulsar's upswept exhaust rules there.

no spacers - I would do it myself in jun 09 in swift (hoping) and manoj biswas ji advised me to stay stock lest it get the handling all out. no idea of my own tho. skid plates is just fine. no problems you'd have. pm me if you wnat contacts - all courtesy manoj ji.

Spares are futile. You need a diagnostic laptop for MPFI engines, and are like most of us not qualified to open the car up - what will you ever do with the spares? My left saddle bag was all spares last year - only for the hope that somoene else may open my clutch if needed, etc - in cars, please dont even dream that!! tow ropes, tubes, tyres etyadi - now that makes sense.

feel free to prove me wrong. just my biker experience there.
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Old 6th October 2008, 01:15   #32
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I'm in from Mumbai, always wanted to do this leg. Just let me know how I can contribue,
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Old 7th October 2008, 16:43   #33
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The other day i was planning a roadtrip to Leh with my friend. this is the perfect time this thread has popped up. Am gonna be keeping a watch on this thread very closely.
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Old 7th October 2008, 18:59   #34
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I am from mumbai and would like to be a part of the trip. I have a ford Ikon 1.3 , could bring the car if ikon is advisable for such road trips to leh. Would definitely keep a watch on this thread for further details.
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Old 8th October 2008, 16:37   #35
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Great to see everyoneís enthusiasm for the road trip. It would be incredible if everyone is able to make it to the great TBHP convoy to Leh.

Even though my participation is certain, you never know if something unexpected crops up to mess up the plans. However Iím preparing myself for the trip and would like to note down my observations.
  • Since this will not be a usual leisure trip, but an adventurous journey with certain risk elements involved, every member should ensure that they are in good health and does not suffer from any altitude sickness.
  • Every member travelling should be physically fit to endure any kind of physical labor, incase of any breakdown or something unforeseen happens.
  • Every member planning for this trip should start arranging his/her own transportation to Leh.
  • The vehicle for this trip should be in pristine condition or at least road worthy. If one vehicle breaks down, it will hold up the entire convoy.
  • The vehicle should be geared up for some ďoff-roadingĒ and also as a precautionary measure to avoid any damage/breakdown to the vehicle. Installing skid plates is recommended to avoid damage to the underbody as itís the most vulnerable part. Please consult more experienced/professional members on how to prepare your vehicle for the journey. It is imperative that you prepare your vehicle for the journey, the condition of your vehicle depends whether you make it or break it, you wouldnít want yourself to be left stranded in the middle of nowhere.
  • Every member should familiarize oneself with routine maintenance work on the car, particularly with the most basic repair work on any car such as using a jack, changing a wheel, repairing a tubeless tire incase of a puncture, checking oil levels and topping up as necessary, changing fuse and bulbs, etc.
  • Start collecting basic survival stuff necessary for the journey to be prepared for any unforeseen circumstances, eg.
    • Tow rope with clamps
    • Spare Tire and tube
    • 12 volt tire inflator/foot pump
    • Correct size spanner for wheels
    • Tubeless Tire repair kit
    • Jack
    • Wrenches, spanners of different sizes
    • Jerry cans to carry fuel
    • Rechargeable/battery torchlight
    • Emergency light
    • Battery Jumper cable
    • Tarpaulin sheet/canvas
    • Engine oil, Gear oil, brake oil, coolant, spare fuses, fan belt, etc.
Please feel free to add to the list.

Since this is not any organized trip, we would all have to act responsible and be responsible for our own actions. I am sure many members would be unwilling to participate for the fear of this journey going haywire, bigger the group, difficult it becomes to coordinate. Letís all get together and make this journey a great success and set an example for others to follow.
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Old 8th October 2008, 18:31   #36
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@ shakensoul,
yes, everyone is looking forword to this trip.
great information from your side.
lets make it.
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Old 11th October 2008, 18:36   #37
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Did some shopping today . Thanks to sudev for providing info where to get the jerry cans.

2 Jerrycans - 250 each
Ammunition box - 150
Assorted spanners - 200
Bullets - 50 rounds ....j/k

The jerrycans, even though they donot look in good shape, are sturdy and do not leak, and should look good after a fresh coat of paint.
Attached Images
  
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Old 11th October 2008, 21:01   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phamilyman View Post
and saar, sorry to be rude, but m800 is the BEST car by far for the leh circuit unless 4up - it has ok torque and is ultimate lightweight. For all the brouhaha, its just a fricken road y'know.

no spacers

Spares are futile.
Any car which is well maintained (irrespective of badge) can do the trip provided the driver knows his as well as the vehicle's limits well. I did it in a bone stock Wagon R and that was when I was participating in the 2006 Raid. I nursed the car well enough to ensure survival through the entire 2,200 gruelling kms.

Agree with phamilyman, NO spacers, especially for a tall boy design Wagon R. The handling goes for a toss, that is if the Wagon R handles in the first place. Basic spares are a necessity like phamilyman said.

Under body protection is a must. My car still has a lot of scars from the 2006 experience. I was lucky not to blow it especially the sump, although I did come very close. I am now wiser to know it was a stupid mistake to go without it in the first place.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shakensoul View Post
Great to see everyone’s enthusiasm for the road trip. It would be incredible if everyone is able to make it to the great TBHP convoy to Leh.

Even though my participation is certain, you never know if something unexpected crops up to mess up the plans. However I’m preparing myself for the trip and would like to note down my observations.
  • Since this will not be a usual leisure trip, but an adventurous journey with certain risk elements involved, every member should ensure that they are in good health and does not suffer from any altitude sickness.
  • Every member travelling should be physically fit to endure any kind of physical labor, incase of any breakdown or something unforeseen happens.
  • Every member planning for this trip should start arranging his/her own transportation to Leh.
  • The vehicle for this trip should be in pristine condition or at least road worthy. If one vehicle breaks down, it will hold up the entire convoy.
  • The vehicle should be geared up for some “off-roading” and also as a precautionary measure to avoid any damage/breakdown to the vehicle. Installing skid plates is recommended to avoid damage to the underbody as it’s the most vulnerable part. Please consult more experienced/professional members on how to prepare your vehicle for the journey. It is imperative that you prepare your vehicle for the journey, the condition of your vehicle depends whether you make it or break it, you wouldn’t want yourself to be left stranded in the middle of nowhere.
  • Every member should familiarize oneself with routine maintenance work on the car, particularly with the most basic repair work on any car such as using a jack, changing a wheel, repairing a tubeless tire incase of a puncture, checking oil levels and topping up as necessary, changing fuse and bulbs, etc.
  • Start collecting basic survival stuff necessary for the journey to be prepared for any unforeseen circumstances, eg.
    • Tow rope with clamps
    • Spare Tire and tube
    • 12 volt tire inflator/foot pump
    • Correct size spanner for wheels
    • Tubeless Tire repair kit
    • Jack
    • Wrenches, spanners of different sizes
    • Jerry cans to carry fuel
    • Rechargeable/battery torchlight
    • Emergency light
    • Battery Jumper cable
    • Tarpaulin sheet/canvas
    • Engine oil, Gear oil, brake oil, coolant, spare fuses, fan belt, etc.
Please feel free to add to the list.

Since this is not any organized trip, we would all have to act responsible and be responsible for our own actions. I am sure many members would be unwilling to participate for the fear of this journey going haywire, bigger the group, difficult it becomes to coordinate. Let’s all get together and make this journey a great success and set an example for others to follow.
That's a great list Shakensoul. I will definitely not be there just like ashthedivx. May be 2010 Ashish. Best of luck guys!
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Old 11th October 2008, 23:28   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phamilyman View Post
and saar, sorry to be rude, but m800 is the BEST car by far for the leh circuit unless 4up - it has ok torque and is ultimate lightweight. For all the brouhaha, its just a fricken road y'know.
It’s a blanket statement if I may dare to say. Let’s get one fact clear here and that is nobody is bigger than the nature. You’ve seen something in the past in that region and that has no guarantee that everything will be the same in future. That road changes between morning to afternoon. That’s why BRO needs to be so active in that hostile condition. A relatively smooth tarmac can change to something like this..

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At Sarchu stretch. We were stuck for two nights.

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Too smart a driver who thought he can make it. Ended up with two busted tyres.

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Perfect for a M800?

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After Zinzing bar and before Sarchu. Perfect for a city car?

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Sinking road on More plane. We had to do 4-wheel low for almost a quarter km.
This is/was that 40 odd km of metaled road. Perfect for a city car?

Quote:
Oh well. chill maadi. Pulsar and wagonR's ground clearance is almost the same ~170mm (give or take 5mm here or there). also depends on loading, but all said, I had no issues on a fully loaded p180. GC wasnt the issue ever. Only place you may have issues would be a rabid water crossing - pulsar's upswept exhaust rules there.
We had to help four bikes just before Pang. Two of them were Pulsar.
Quote:
Spares are futile. You need a diagnostic laptop for MPFI engines, and are like most of us not qualified to open the car up - what will you ever do with the spares? My left saddle bag was all spares last year - only for the hope that somoene else may open my clutch if needed, etc - in cars, please dont even dream that!! tow ropes, tubes, tyres etyadi - now that makes sense.
Agreed fully.
Quote:
feel free to prove me wrong. just my biker experience there.
Nothing there to prove you wrong. It’s a game we try to play with nature. We need to be prepared to do so with best possible way.

Off topic: On our way back we did an average speed of 15 km. We were driving a Gypsy.

Last edited by Rudra Sen : 11th October 2008 at 23:31.
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Old 12th October 2008, 00:36   #40
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Rudra ji,

Some things:
a. my experience does not compare to yours for sheer size of trouble so firstly, the direct comparison isnt quite relevant - its just completely different data points really. I'm talking of the regular good scenario - bad roads but drive on types!
b. Was this from Aug 06 when more plains road was swept away?
c. Let me sum up both views as follows:
You - The terrain is unpredictable and can be merciless/unmanageable. (and what I surmise) when the going gets tough, only the appropriate vehicles make it through. The bestest preparation is needed.
Me - Among most cars (NOT 4x4 SUVs), m800 need not be pitied/looked down upon - it is an extremely capable car by its weight. Which is the same reason Omni is a very capable hill taxi.

And another factor I've seen personally - m800s can literally be hauled out by a bunch of guys - just as easily towed. It was something I was reminded by the pangong Panauti. Would m800 not have pulled through as decently as any other car, even thrice its price? (save the fusion)

And to sum up, let me ask you a question as a SwiftD owner (and given the economy, whose not owning a 4WD anytime soon) - how should one do it, short of taking a Gypsy there? In which case, I'm quite happy on the bike!!

PS: How have "car" guys had it while crossing water crossings that are exhaust level/above?
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Old 12th October 2008, 08:02   #41
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I interesting start for a long and beautiful journey.

I would look at meeting point at Chandigarh so that all who are driving, coming by train or flying in can gather in one place. The tourism run hotel in Sector 24(?) is good place to be the jump off point? Or it could be next door at Panchkula the Haryana Tourism hotel (also near the station) But then Chandigarh can offer a large variety of places.

BUT before start going in to specific details. First is the time slot and second is day by day plan. I would vote for second half of June. First half is uncertain due to passes not fully open etc. Best is September when the roads are reasonably repaired but not many people would be ale to adjust their holidays then.

So can we start a poll on the time slots?


Second question is number of days. 10~14 would be the range. I guess another poll for this is needed.

Vehicle - My take is any car on Indian roads should be able to make this trip although I would not recommend D/E/higher category cars. SUV/MUV et. el. will be okay. Motorcycles are also okay. I have seen this stretch being done on a scooter too!! Also a auto mag did M800+Mercedes from Kashmir to Kanyakumari few years back.

Night halts - Should be locales that have rooms / tents in adequate numbers and all should be pre-booked. Too much rush in the season to take chance of finding acco for a large group.
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Old 12th October 2008, 09:05   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phamilyman View Post
a. my experience does not compare to yours for sheer size of trouble so firstly, the direct comparison isnt quite relevant - its just completely different data points really.
Thatís why I keep saying itís extremely unpredictable beautiful mountain road.
Quote:
I'm talking of the regular good scenario - bad roads but drive on types!
Absolutely true. Iíve seen army Ambassador there without any sump guard or such.
Quote:
b. Was this from Aug 06 when more plains road was swept away?
Yes, it was 9th of August, 2006. Road was in perfect condition on our way to Leh. This was while coming back.
Quote:
c. Let me sum up both views as follows:
You - The terrain is unpredictable and can be merciless/unmanageable. (and what I surmise) when the going gets tough, only the appropriate vehicles make it through. The bestest preparation is needed.
Even thatís not enough at times. Your example of pangong Panauti shows that.
Quote:
Me - Among most cars (NOT 4x4 SUVs), m800 need not be pitied/looked down upon - it is an extremely capable car by its weight. Which is the same reason Omni is a very capable hill taxi.
Quote:
And another factor I've seen personally - m800s can literally be hauled out by a bunch of guys - just as easily towed.
According to me M800 is one the best thing happened to this country. No question about its capabilities. I had the first model and I know its strength and weakness.
Quote:
And to sum up, let me ask you a question as a SwiftD owner (and given the economy, whose not owning a 4WD anytime soon) - how should one do it, short of taking a Gypsy there? In which case, I'm quite happy on the bike!!
Bike is better. You have better chance to pass through. Cars generally get held up with any small mishaps. Point in case: Large boulders rolled down little after Pandoh dam on the way to Manali. Four-wheelers had to wait for road clearing but all the two-wheelers went through happily. Waiting was for more than two hours and on mountain roads two hours can make a lot of difference. Again you can take example from pangong Panauti.
Quote:
PS: How have "car" guys had it while crossing water crossings that are exhaust level/above?
We had it. Crossed without much issues. Kept throttle on. But rear scraped regularly. khan_sultanís Gypsy back chopping idea is great.

@sudev. Your plan is just right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sudev
BUT before start going in to specific details. First is the time slot and second is day by day plan. I would vote for second half of June. First half is uncertain due to passes not fully open etc. Best is September when the roads are reasonably repaired but not many people would be ale to adjust their holidays then.
Agreed.
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Old 12th October 2008, 09:12   #43
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Hi Team,

I am interested in the trip, count me in from Mumbai. Let me know if I can be of any help Ashish.

By the way a nice thought out trip will make wonder to Leh trip and yes I know a friend of mine who has been there who only recommends jeeps or gypsys for the job up there.

Also for all those joining from Mumbai, do they plan to take up the entire trip by road right from Mumbai. If yes then we all need to go from Mumbai as a convey.

Regards,
Kailash
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Old 12th October 2008, 12:03   #44
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Wow, lot of discussion last few hours.
This thread about manali-leh drive is still in discussion stage.
Those who had done this drive in past, please post your guidance. It will be very useful during planning.
After through discussion, it will move to planning stage.
During planning stage, poll about exact timing of this drive will be taken.
Those who are supposed to take drive and posted their interest can take initial steps like physical fitness, car modification such as skid plate etc, leave planning etc.
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Old 12th October 2008, 13:00   #45
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This is the address where Delhi folks can source Jerrycans and misc hardware.

Bhagat Ishar Dass & Sons

W-106, Mayapuri,
Phase - II,
New Delhi - 110064
011-28112841
9811068774
9811132277
9871717182

The place is also called 'Loha Mandi'
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