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Old 10th September 2011, 22:43   #61
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Default Re: Emergency driving - Without brakes

Life threatening situations for you and others on the road call for any extreme measure, without doubt IMO. While the manual has other options, there is virtually none in the auto, hence pray, engage reverse, rev hard and save yourself and others on the road. Take one thing at a time, and the transmission damage can be dealt with later. I wouldn't mind paying the repair bill over countless hospital bills or a bereaved family.
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Old 10th September 2011, 23:05   #62
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Default Re: Emergency driving - Without brakes

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tejas Ingle View Post
Engaging reverse gear while the car is in motion is very much possible. True, it will ruin your gear box, but thats preferable to going down in a valley. I too didn't beleive this earlier but I have seen a demonstration on Discovery Turbo where the stunt driver reversed an average looking estate out of a steep slope without using any brakes. After managing to shift, he flored the pedal and managed to get out of the ditch. Ofcourse, the car was scrapped after the demo. But you can definately give it the LAST try in life threatening situations.

What do you mean it will ruin the gearbox? It isnt elle18 face pack for pretty face,it is a gearbox,its going to breakdown for good .if the broken **** gets into wrong places,you are lookin at even bad scene. And even if ramji answers your SOS,and you manage to slot it in and still manage to keep the gearbox within the engine bay and working,how do you plan to become a stunt driver in those desperate moments,
Putting the vehicle in 1st gear will lock the wheels within no time giving you time to jump off.
He is a stunt driver,thats why he is on DT.
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Old 11th September 2011, 07:29   #63
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Default Re: Emergency driving - Without brakes

Regarding the Discovery : Remember the most of the cars in USA - where probably the video was made - are automatics.

If slotting in to reverse can save my life - I am all for it car be damned. But can you practice this? Or wait for that emergency situation and then leave it to luck?

I'd rather live with a solution that is know to work.

Are we only talking of stopping? Once? Or are we talking of emergency driving without brakes? Scenarios and solutions are varied. I started the thread to deal with driving under emergency without availability of brakes. Intelligent use (along with other things) of gear box can allow us to drive even when there are no brakes.

As to qualification - till idling RPM's by some : One the idling RPM's in first gear are low enough to avoid serious damage and two you can at that point of time switch off the ignition and let the engine stalling bring you to a stop.
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Old 11th September 2011, 10:44   #64
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Default Re: Emergency driving - Without brakes

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tejas Ingle View Post
Engaging reverse gear while the car is in motion is very much possible. True, it will ruin your gear box, but thats preferable to going down in a valley. I too didn't beleive this earlier but I have seen a demonstration on Discovery Turbo where the stunt driver reversed an average looking estate out of a steep slope without using any brakes. After managing to shift, he flored the pedal and managed to get out of the ditch. Ofcourse, the car was scrapped after the demo. But you can definately give it the LAST try in life threatening situations.
These maneuvers should only be tried in a life threatening situation, where ruining your car is the only option the other is loosing your life.

Still as a soft option, where life or limb is not threatened, I would desist from putting the vehicle in reverse while it is moving above 10 km/h.
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Old 11th September 2011, 11:03   #65
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Default Re: Emergency driving - Without brakes

I remember driving in evening traffic from CBD Beapur to Kalyan only on handbreak with 5 in car. Happened first time and only the clutch and lower gears helps. Handbreak is pretty much useless but comes handy only if the speed is in control.

My experience came from my RD. As far as I remember riding RD350 back from Mahabaleshwar to Vashi with no clutch and no rear break (with my knee ligament broken)
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Old 11th September 2011, 12:28   #66
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Default Re: Emergency driving - Without brakes

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tejas Ingle View Post
Engaging reverse gear while the car is in motion is very much possible. True, it will ruin your gear box, but thats preferable to going down in a valley. I too didn't beleive this earlier but I have seen a demonstration on Discovery Turbo where the stunt driver reversed an average looking estate out of a steep slope without using any brakes. After managing to shift, he flored the pedal and managed to get out of the ditch. Ofcourse, the car was scrapped after the demo. But you can definately give it the LAST try in life threatening situations.
Sir, Please try - as others have mentioned before - Reverse is not Synchromesh and you cannot even slot it into the gear!! You WILL HEAR a GRRRRR noise and if you force it, your GB is in for some physical changes!

Forget watching stunts on TV which mislead a lot of people!!

Reversing without using brakes is different from stopping the car using the reverse gear while in forward motion
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Old 11th September 2011, 13:46   #67
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Default Re: Emergency driving - Without brakes

Quote:
Originally Posted by sudev View Post
Regarding the Discovery : Remember the most of the cars in USA - where probably the video was made - are automatics.

If slotting in to reverse can save my life - I am all for it car be damned. But can you practice this? Or wait for that emergency situation and then leave it to luck?

I'd rather live with a solution that is know to work.
The car was a manual transmission.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aroy View Post
These maneuvers should only be tried in a life threatening situation, where ruining your car is the only option the other is loosing your life.

Still as a soft option, where life or limb is not threatened, I would desist from putting the vehicle in reverse while it is moving above 10 km/h.


Quote:
Originally Posted by headers View Post
Sir, Please try - as others have mentioned before - Reverse is not Synchromesh and you cannot even slot it into the gear!! You WILL HEAR a GRRRRR noise and if you force it, your GB is in for some physical changes!

Forget watching stunts on TV which mislead a lot of people!!

Reversing without using brakes is different from stopping the car using the reverse gear while in forward motion
I am not trying to create a debate. I did not say that the moment you realise that brakes are off, engage reverse. If you are on a highway, or some flat road and you realise that you lost your brakes dont use reverse to stop, use other options available. But in a (very rare) scenario where the car is going to negotiate a sharp turn on a ghat and the driver realises that the brakes have failed, he keeps his presence of mind and tries every possible thing to control the speed but doesn't manage to keep the car on road. The car is now going down a steep slope on gravel. The moment the driver gets into a situation like this, he is a 'stunt driver'. His stunt is unchoreographed, unplanned, and unexpected which would be more difficult than pro's to negotiate. The driver has to now do something immediately to save his life. Gravity and momentum may take over the grip. Other than pray, what are the options left? There may be better options than what I suggest. Please give in your inputs.

Option 1: Engage reverse, full throttle, wheels spinning in opposite direction would dig a hole, and there is a chance that the car will get stuck.
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Old 11th September 2011, 15:25   #68
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Default Re: Emergency driving - Without brakes

Reverse is not even an option.

Surely, on an unfamiliar car, you've accidentally tried to put the car in reverse? I can't be the only one. It either feels as if the lever just won't move, or you get a crunching noise. If you do manage to force it, what about the risk of just breaking all the teeth? Either the gearbox will jam --- or you now have a car freewheeling with no control.

Even the synchromesh on 1st may not allow you to engage it unless already moving very slowly. 3rd/2nd is a better bet.

Posted previously: a friend of mine put an auto gear box in reverse, accidentally, at over 70MPH. He was lucky in that the box continued to work in forward gears, but he had no reverse at all until the very expensive repair got done. Apparently, it didn't slow him down at all!

All this talk about gears is important, but let us also remember ... the handbrake.
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Old 11th September 2011, 15:50   #69
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Default Re: Emergency driving - Without brakes

I have come accross an Indicab which was being driven by a tempo driver who managed to slot it into reverse because of different gear positions in tempo. He did this at a pretty decent speed. Result: damaged gearbox, damaged differential, bent propeller shafts and locked front wheels.

Thad, what would you suggest in the 'above mentioned' situation?
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Old 11th September 2011, 16:11   #70
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Default Re: Emergency driving - Without brakes

If you find yourself in with no chance of using the wheel,handbrake or downshifting. Its best to look for something to hit delebrately.
If you are in hills,generally people scratching the hilside come out alive,because puttin it in there,makes frn suspension collasp,and you loose speed damn fast.
All these things would only help if vehicle was traveling at sane speeds.
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Old 11th September 2011, 21:29   #71
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Default Re: Emergency driving - Without brakes

Quote:
Originally Posted by headers View Post
Forget watching stunts on TV which mislead a lot of people!!
I still curse those old Indian movies who used to show the actor/actress running car on winding roads in break fail situation. (being child I really believed that )

Well guys I can try putting reverse gear to verify if you can sponsor your drives for test.
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Old 12th September 2011, 08:32   #72
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Default Re: Emergency driving - Without brakes

@Tejas Ingle : Why not try what you are advocating on your car and report back the result? The techniques I have been advocating can be tried and practiced beforehand.

If I were in really life threatening situation I would rather use the car body as a option and drive in to the hill side and slow the car. Let the body damage occur but you would come to a stop. I would try and use all those options that still leave me with a chance of using the car - even body with work damage - later to make it to a place of safety.
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Old 13th September 2011, 20:45   #73
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Default Re: Emergency driving - Without brakes

Quote:
Originally Posted by nomadabhi View Post
Well guys I can try putting reverse gear to verify if you can sponsor your drives for test.
So you admit the fact that the said maneuvour will ruin the vehicle.

Downshifting constantly is still the safest and least damaging method. Next is veering to the hill side. Who knows you may even be able to drive the vehicle after all that body damage! If in open plains veer to the shoulder/mud bank side. Avoid going down hill slopes, even on smaller slopes (< 3m), as the vehicle can topple and roll.

Stunts like putting the vehicle in reverse should be limited to those scenarios which the movies delight in - Earthquake opening up a chasm in front of you, or you are hurling towards a cliff with no brakes (In this situation I would try to steer away from the cliff edge!)
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Old 14th September 2011, 03:02   #74
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Default Re: Emergency driving - Without brakes

In those situations, I'd jump out of the car. Not much to loose!

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Old 14th September 2011, 03:10   #75
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Default Re: Emergency driving - Without brakes

Jump out like a frog I damn you! How dare you can LOL at such serious issues! Cant you all learn to die quietly or what?

hmmm ok I do not know the policies of NRI frogs, but damn dont frogs go croak or somthin like that all over the world? No?

Last edited by YaeJay : 14th September 2011 at 03:16.
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