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Old 11th September 2010, 01:53   #1621
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Gurus ,

Need help & need it quick

Scorpio SLX 2006 crde (extended warranty finished in July 2006)

Issue : AC not working

Occurance : Drove to Agra, AC working fine. Parked in night, next morning AC not working.

Problem : AC compressor is fine as it works when we short (direct) the relay below the steering. Some issue with Earthing.

Troubleshooting (Done at a local mechanic in Agra & Today at MASS (Koncept Noida)) :

1. All relays, Fuse, wirings checked.
2. Switch Console changed with a working one.
3. ACM checked with Laptop & Software , no error codes with & with out AC on. Even after switching the AC with the help of a jumper wire, no error code.
4. Both AC Relays replaced.
5. Gas checked.

No one was able identify the issue & what is causing it, all they are able to say that it because an earth signal is not coming & as soon as they give an external earth AC works.

Even MASS was not able to resolve this & said that we need to leave the vehicle for 2-3 days for checking, that too not now as it is Eid time., but i am not sure they have any clue what is the actual issue.

I have not yet got it direct, need to understand what to do now & from where.

Please help.
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Old 11th September 2010, 10:06   #1622
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m_upreti View Post

The list goes as below:

1. Vehicle Wobbling & Shuddering at high speeds
2. Front right wheel squeaking intermittently
3. Brakes are locking and tires squeal on hard braking even at low speeds
8. The AC vent is struck on the demister setting
13. Gears are very heavy and require effort to engage
14. While changing gear from 1st to 2nd sometimes it is not slotted properly
15. Low fuel average
16. Unburnt diesel can be smelt and vehicle is emitting heavy smoke at times17Auto lock not working when the key is not in the ignition.


1. Replace the ORVM screw covers on the inside as they are falling off one by one (I have kept them but they are so loose they keep on falling out)
Mansi, what happened at the ASS? How were the problems I have highlighted above resolved?
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Old 11th September 2010, 17:38   #1623
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mooza View Post
Thanks Casper Rider, at least we are now relieved that the engine won't fall apart

Does your vehicle have this vibration in the same rpm band ?
Yes, but may be at an even smaller range. I can get past to that in less than 2 seconds.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rjstyles69 View Post
You sure its only the brake liners ? To me it looks like a brake master cylinder issue and this btw was after some drilling session at the ***. Apparently my self healing scorp' dint show the brake lock up issue while at the ***.
Well, the A.S.S guys told me was it was the break liners, and I've seen them replacing same. I'm not too sure if they have replaced the entire break assembly or the master cylinder. In case if it is an issue with master cylinder, then it should affect all the wheels, right? In my case it was only locking up the rear left wheel.
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Old 13th September 2010, 12:56   #1624
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Default Scorpio TPM

While I do not always trust the Tyre Pressure Monitor readings, I use it for leakage warning. I also find it useful, when the tyre is under pressure. It gives a red signal.

Now, I have a question, if you guys had even noticed. Is that giving the RED signal and alert while the Tyre is under over pressure?

Thanks,
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Old 13th September 2010, 16:04   #1625
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hvkumar View Post
Maneesh, what happened at the ASS? How were the problems I have highlighted above resolved?
Hi, got the car back on Thursday, 9th Sep (4 days at A.S.S.)

1. Vehicle Wobbling & Shuddering at high speeds - Replaced the Front RHS tyre bushing - No wobbling / shuddering apparent now.

2. Front right wheel squeaking intermittently - This got resolved after the tyre was removed to replace the bush and cleaning of the hub. Not squeaking now

3. Brakes are locking and tires squeal on hard braking even at low speeds - All brakes cleaned and reset, ABS resetting done using a laptop. No issues now.

8. The AC vent is struck on the demister setting - Initially I was old that nothing is wrong and the moment I moved out of the *** and drove less than 50 mts. and adjusted the knob the issue returned. I immediately went back and gave a piece of my mind to the service advisor who got a technician again and in the process a part was removed and reinserted. After that I was told that the entire dash would have to be removed and it would take another day.
At this I lost my usual cool and spoke to the service manager who called her GM Service, who checked personally but probably due to the part which was removed and reinserted, the issue got resolved automatically. The GM service was kind enough to take a test drive to see it was working. I have this under observation, last 3 days the AC is working fine.

13. Gears are very heavy and require effort to engage - Clutch has been bleeded and now the issue does not seem to be there.

14. While changing gear from 1st to 2nd sometimes it is not slotted properly - Same as above in point 13.

15. Low fuel average - Some setting has been done & ECU reset, I am monitoring the average now.

16. Unburnt diesel can be smelt and vehicle is emitting heavy smoke at times - Same as above in point 15.

17. Auto lock not working when the key is not in the ignition - The Nippon guy is supposed to come and do this at my place.

Apart from this the other issues / replacements of the door bushes and ORVM screw caps have also been taken care of, I was however charged a total of Rs. 20 (incl. taxes) towards duct tape .

Quote:
Originally Posted by CasperRider View Post
@m_upreti:
3-There is a known manufacturing defect with the break liners. I was in fact, one of the first victims of this and was finally taken care by replacing the break liners. A.S.S wont tell you this but they would have already replaced the liners free of cost.
5&6- Another manufacturing defect with the power window motor. Ask them to replace the motors, though A.S.S will try to convince you saying it was lose connection. One bad day, it will permanetly fail.
3- All I was told that the entire brake assembly was removed and cleaned, so they might have done the replacement which I was not told,

5&6 - This was attributed to the weather, so they claim to have cleaned the window housing , issue does not seem to be there. Let me keep my fingers crossed and if it happens again I will have them replace the motors.

After all this was taken care of, I decided to splurge a little bit more on the car and have ordered RTO approved embossed number plates costing Rs. 1500 for a pair (the rains and kids together have peeled off parts of the number and I have been writing the same with a permanent marker every alternate day) and LED ORVM covers (Body Coloured) for 1100 Rs. both of these are expected by this week end.

Utilising the long weekend I tried to calculate the running cost of the car, and despite all the niggles I have faced the Per / Km cost comes to a paltry 6.66 Rs a Km.

I have tried to put the details in an excel (not as exhaustive as HVK's), any feedback would be welcome to make it more relevant.
Attached Files
File Type: xls Scorpio.xls (25.0 KB, 315 views)

Last edited by m_upreti : 13th September 2010 at 16:12.
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Old 13th September 2010, 16:41   #1626
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Mansi, that is a great summary on repairs so far. In your case, the extended warranty costs have ballooned up costs, they are for a longer period of time, so your costs will come down.

I compile maintenance info on my 2005 Scorpio, but have not been including insurance/amortisation costs, just the repair costs. I am attaching the latest file on both maintenance and mileage here.
Attached Files
File Type: xls Copy of Scorpio-MaintenanceLog.xls (311.0 KB, 367 views)
File Type: xls Scorpio-LogBook.xls (265.0 KB, 341 views)
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Old 13th September 2010, 19:12   #1627
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We normally check the tyre pressures on four wheels and the stepney is left out as a rule in Scorpios.
It has to be unbolted for getting access to the valve. I get the stepney air pressure checked when the Scorpio goes to the MASS for servicing.
Is there any other way to get the stepney air pressure checked without dismantling it ?
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Old 14th September 2010, 10:59   #1628
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hvkumar View Post
Mansi, that is a great summary on repairs so far. In your case, the extended warranty costs have ballooned up costs, they are for a longer period of time, so your costs will come down.

I compile maintenance info on my 2005 Scorpio, but have not been including insurance/amortisation costs, just the repair costs. I am attaching the latest file on both maintenance and mileage here.
Thanks HVK, I have actually left out the repairs / replacements which were done 100% under warrenty i.e. Replacement of Gear Box, 4 tyres, Engine Mountings, IRVM, Front Bushes, etc.
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Old 14th September 2010, 13:09   #1629
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m_upreti View Post
Thanks HVK, I have actually left out the repairs / replacements which were done 100% under warrenty i.e. Replacement of Gear Box, 4 tyres, Engine Mountings, IRVM, Front Bushes, etc.
Which ASC did you go to? I'm also in mumbai and searching for a better ASC.
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Old 14th September 2010, 13:19   #1630
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfheart View Post
Which ASC did you go to? I'm also in mumbai and searching for a better ASC.
Is there a better ASC in Mumbai/Thane? I have been a loyal customer of Global Gallarie, Thane, but have stopped going there of late since their service standards have deteriorated significantly.
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Old 14th September 2010, 14:22   #1631
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfheart View Post
Which ASC did you go to? I'm also in mumbai and searching for a better ASC.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hvkumar View Post
Is there a better ASC in Mumbai/Thane? I have been a loyal customer of Global Gallarie, Thane, but have stopped going there of late since their service standards have deteriorated significantly.
I am in Navi Mumbai, and have been going to G3 Motors only, the people are good, but there are times when they themselves are at loss in finding the root cause since the vehicle behaves different when with me on the road &at the A.S.S.

Once the car was taken to NBS International in Mumbai by the M&M regional office to take care of the wobbling and squeaking issues, the tyres were supposed to be replaced and when the car was delivered back it had a huge scratches on the rear door and bumper, and the old tyres had been polished not replaced. I returned the car back promptly to the delivery person, after 2 days I got the car backwith the new tyres and scratches taken care of. During this time I was provided a Xylo top end model as a replacement vehicle.

And all this courtesy / replacements were due to the fact that I had escalated my issues to the topmost management of M&M.

Last edited by m_upreti : 14th September 2010 at 14:24.
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Old 14th September 2010, 14:24   #1632
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Originally Posted by hvkumar View Post
Is there a better ASC in Mumbai/Thane? I have been a loyal customer of Global Gallarie, Thane, but have stopped going there of late since their service standards have deteriorated significantly.
I've been using G3 at Malad. The staff is not very customer oriented. recently I have been dealing with the service manager directly.
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Old 15th September 2010, 13:33   #1633
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfheart View Post
I've been using G3 at Malad. The staff is not very customer oriented. recently I have been dealing with the service manager directly.
Same story at G3 Navi Mumbai, too much over worked staff it seems, I am also dealing with the Service Manager directly, this time round I had to escalate to the GM Service.
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Old 16th September 2010, 14:00   #1634
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SamtheLeo View Post
Gurus ,

Need help & need it quick

Scorpio SLX 2006 crde (extended warranty finished in July 2006)

Issue : AC not working

Occurance : Drove to Agra, AC working fine. Parked in night, next morning AC not working.

Problem : AC compressor is fine as it works when we short (direct) the relay below the steering. Some issue with Earthing.

Troubleshooting (Done at a local mechanic in Agra & Today at MASS (Koncept Noida)) :

1. All relays, Fuse, wirings checked.
2. Switch Console changed with a working one.
3. ACM checked with Laptop & Software , no error codes with & with out AC on. Even after switching the AC with the help of a jumper wire, no error code.
4. Both AC Relays replaced.
5. Gas checked.

No one was able identify the issue & what is causing it, all they are able to say that it because an earth signal is not coming & as soon as they give an external earth AC works.

Even MASS was not able to resolve this & said that we need to leave the vehicle for 2-3 days for checking, that too not now as it is Eid time., but i am not sure they have any clue what is the actual issue.

I have not yet got it direct, need to understand what to do now & from where.

Please help.
The latest update on this :

We got this checked from Sterling Gurgaon & finally they were able to tell this is an ECU issue . ECU is not sending a earth signal to AC relay.

My scorpio has moved out of extended warranty on 3rd Aug 2010. So the only option as per MASS is to replace ECU which is costing upwards of 45K.
I also got an advise that i can get it done from outside for around 5-7 K

Please advise on

1. Is repairing an option? If yes, what should be the charges
2. Can this be a ECU software issue?
3. Does ECU cost 45k + & is there any where else to source it except from MASS ( i was told probably Kashmiri Gate)
4. Once repaired would it be reilable enough or should i go for replacement.

please help
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Old 16th September 2010, 14:31   #1635
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Just dropped off my Scorp at G3 for the 25k Km paid service and resolving a few issues. The following are the issues I've mentioned:

1. Regular service

2. Engine oil and filter replacement - Though it's not routine for the 25k km service the advisor recommended that I get the oil and filter changed. the reason given was that it's been 9 months since the last oil change.

3. Speedometer and odometer have stooped working since last week. They'll try to fix it but they may even have to replace it. If they replace it then the reading will start from Zero. I've clocked in 26,000 kms so far.

4. Some voice prompts are not functioning since last week. The seatbelt, handbrake and door open warnings are not functioning. However the car is in reserve fuel and the welcome to your scorpio voice prompts are working.

5. Fuel mileage has decreased, I'm getting about 7.5 km per litre in the city. Could it be because of slow moving traffic due to all the roads that have been dug up on my regular route?

6.Clutch feels smooth sometimes and sometimes it gets rough.

7. Occasional water drops near the clutch pedal sometimes. Only he=appens whan A/c is on.

8. I've been advised that rear suspension is making some noise. The bushes may have to be replaced.

9. Moisture in rear tail lamp. Is this covered in the warranty?

10. Gears slip into neutral sometimes while moving out of parking. This happens with a big jerk as soon as the clutch is released.

11. Other general stuff like seat noise, a bit of vibrations etc.

I've also been given a quote to get extended warranty since my warranty expires on the 29th of this month. What do you guys think should I opt for it? It's Rs.13k for 2 years and Rs. 8k for 1 year.


Quote:
Originally Posted by m_upreti View Post
Thanks HVK, I have actually left out the repairs / replacements which were done 100% under warrenty i.e. Replacement of Gear Box, 4 tyres, Engine Mountings, IRVM, Front Bushes, etc.
The advisor told me that bushes and rubber parts are not covered under warranty and I'll have to pay for them. Is this correct?

Finally if you have read through this entire long post, a very big thank you guys!
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