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Old 12th March 2009, 08:39   #46
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Originally Posted by anupmathur View Post
Mohnish, I haven't checked so far.
The next time I drive my Scorpio, I'll certainly concentrate on this and post a report here.
Mohnish, I've tried to discern that vibration at 1200 to 1400 rpm range. I did not find any.
What this means is that I am not sensitive enough to notice it, something that I would hate to believe about myself!
Or, it means that there is actually no noticeable change in vibrations in my car.
This could be a possibility, considering the slightly different layout geometry in my car, being a 4WD.
Maybe what you are experiencing is a kind of 'resonance' or harmonic getting induced in some assembly.? You have mentioned that it could be the exhaust system or even the turbocharger.

However, what is most important for me is that I can never drive at those rpms. I feel the engine has not 'woken up' at all. I carefully noted my gear shifts and found that I hardly ever let the rpm drop below 1600.

It is, in any case, good to keep an engine operating in a healthy, happy, responsive (call it what you will) zone. For me this 1200 to 1400 range is not in that band.

Many engines will go through a 'vibration band' below their normal operating range. Sometimes, this can also be a 'critical' kind of range, not permitted for continuous operation, though this is usually not found on car engines.

Does this mild vibration really worry you? What exactly do you suspect or fear might happen?
Or is it that you are just surprised how such an engine could be considered production ready?
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Old 12th March 2009, 22:27   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anupmathur View Post
...I did not find any... I am not sensitive enough to notice it...
Highly unlikely.

Quote:
Originally Posted by anupmathur View Post
...Or, it means that there is actually no noticeable change in vibrations in my car...This could be a possibility, considering the slightly different layout geometry in my car, being a 4WD.
Yep that is likely.

Quote:
Originally Posted by anupmathur View Post
...Does this mild vibration really worry you? What exactly do you suspect or fear might happen?
Or is it that you are just surprised how such an engine could be considered production ready?
No, there isn't anything to worry about...its very mild, but present all the same in an otherwise very refined motor. Nothing is going to break or wear out on account of this. Its an irritant and yep, it does surprise me that they would push an engine into production that is not running as smooth as it has the potential to.

You know Anup, the more I think about this, I should detach the crash guard (courtesy pervious owner), as well as un hook the exhaust system (both individually) and see if this changes anything. Will do this next free time...will post. Meanwhile looking forward to any theories on this.

Thanks Anup for taking the trouble...

Last edited by Mohnish : 12th March 2009 at 22:29.
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Old 13th March 2009, 10:11   #48
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Mohnish,

I had the opportunity in last couple of days to test my Scorpio in the rev bands 1200-1400 rpm.

I did this first in my normal driving fashion, did not notice any vibrations. Then I starting pushing the car in low gears to higher rpm's but no undue vibrations. I tested this out during my regular office drives(so say 140 km+) in normal city driving conditions. Did not notice any 'extra' vibrations.

Sometimes, the smallest of the parts can give you some irritants. Like I was complaining to ASC during my second(12000km) service that I hear some strange noise/vibrations at the same RPM you have mentioned during gear shifts or accelerating up. We did a thorough check on the engine and everything else in the engine compartment(as I was feeling that the noise is from the front) but did not find any issues.
Ultimately it turned out to be the noise coming from foot boards and ski racks which were slightly loose!!Once they were tightened with, Lo there was no noise/vibration.

So, would recommed you to have the same checked once if that is the problem with your ride.

Guys, this I think should be a part of the regular service check for all our our scorpios. Please get this done!
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Old 13th March 2009, 12:41   #49
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Originally Posted by getsurya View Post
...did not notice any vibrations....Did not notice any 'extra' vibrations.
So this seems to be either affecting only a few vehicles or maybe the vibration is so mild that you'll don't see it as a "vibration". May be I am being a bit finicky !!!

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Originally Posted by getsurya View Post
Sometimes, the smallest of the parts can give you some irritants...Ultimately it turned out to be the noise coming from foot boards and ski racks which were slightly loose...
Yep Getsurya, will now start a systematic negation process...Let see where I end up.

Again, thanks for you response.

@Raj : Hows it going buddy?

Last edited by Mohnish : 13th March 2009 at 12:43.
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Old 13th March 2009, 13:55   #50
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Yep Getsurya, will now start a systematic negation process...Let see where I end up.
Good luck and am sure there will not be anything major with a Scorpio!!
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Old 13th March 2009, 13:58   #51
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I would suggest having the engine mounts checked. 2 mounts in my Jeep were replaced at 25,000 km. the rubber had totally disintegrated.

Last edited by Sideways : 13th March 2009 at 14:10.
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Old 13th March 2009, 14:03   #52
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Good luck and am sure there will not be anything major with a Scorpio!!
Getsurya, he did not even say it was major.
On the contrary, it is so minor that maybe a lot of us might not even find it upon trying to!
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Old 13th March 2009, 14:21   #53
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Originally Posted by Sideways View Post
I would suggest having the engine mounts checked...
Thanks Sideways, have done as you said already, refere my post below:
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Originally Posted by Mohnish View Post
...So chasing that got me new engine / gear mounts, fuel delivery tweaks etc...
Quote:
Originally Posted by anupmathur View Post
Getsurya, he did not even say it was major.
On the contrary, it is so minor that maybe a lot of us might not even find it upon trying to!
Thanks Anup for the response to Getsurya...As said before, maybe I am a bit too finicky, but then again, I sincerely believe this engine (given how smooth it is) can run without that vibration...Its the major things that are really easy to diagnose...the small niggles tend to camouflage themselves!!!

@getsurya: thanks for the encouraging words!

Last edited by Mohnish : 13th March 2009 at 14:23.
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Old 13th March 2009, 16:49   #54
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Hi Mohnish, hope things are well with your Scorp.

I personally feel that it pays be a bit finicks specially if the vehicle is close to your heart and after you have paid so much.

I have had a lot of niggles with my Scorpio, some were originally brushed off by the A.S.S. guys as minor but ultimately turned out to be major after a few days (gear box change, front bush change, replacement of the AC switch cluster, replacement of jack tommy etc. etc...).

The next in line is the Ignition key assembly, today morning I was unable to turn the key in the ignition, I had complained regarding this earlier but the A.S.S. guys did some cleaning (or said thay did) of the assembly and it worked ok for a couple of days, for the last 15 days or so I was struggling with the key every time I wanted to start the car. Today proved to be a D Day when unable to start and had to take an auto to the office.

I will be getting a replacement next week (I hope I am able to start the car in the evening today when I will have more time to struggle with the key)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mohnish View Post
Thanks Sideways, have done as you said already, refere my post below:
Thanks Anup for the response to Getsurya...As said before, maybe I am a bit too finicky, but then again, I sincerely believe this engine (given how smooth it is) can run without that vibration...Its the major things that are really easy to diagnose...the small niggles tend to camouflage themselves!!!
@getsurya: thanks for the encouraging words!
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Old 13th March 2009, 19:33   #55
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hi mohnish, yes, i do love my car a lot. but somehow i feel that the mHawk is a bit weaker when compared to the CRDe & good old non-Crde. the other two could withstand abuse pretty well.
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Old 14th March 2009, 11:55   #56
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Fully agreed with you Raj. My cousin has a CRDE Scorpio for the last 5 yrs..it has travelled from Ladakh to Kanyakumari ..still runs beautifully without any issues.
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Originally Posted by raj_5004 View Post
hi mohnish, yes, i do love my car a lot. but somehow i feel that the mHawk is a bit weaker when compared to the CRDe & good old non-Crde. the other two could withstand abuse pretty well.
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Old 15th March 2009, 21:53   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m_upreti View Post
...I have had a lot of niggles with my Scorpio, ...gear box change, front bush change, replacement of the AC switch cluster, replacement of jack tommy etc. etc...next in line is the Ignition key assembly...
Hi m_upreti, that list in your post above is quite something...Seems the M-Hawks are 'delicate'. All the more reason to be gentle!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by raj_5004 View Post
hi mohnish, yes, i do love my car a lot. but somehow i feel that the mHawk is a bit weaker when compared to the CRDe & good old non-Crde. the other two could withstand abuse pretty well.
Yep Raj, going through m_upreti's post reflects your sentiments exactly and hence all the more reason to be gentle!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by m_upreti View Post
Fully agreed with you Raj. My cousin has a CRDE Scorpio for the last 5 yrs..it has travelled from Ladakh to Kanyakumari ..still runs beautifully without any issues.
I understand the non Crde & the Crde have the same engine block etc except for the fuel delivery system. I figure the agrarian roots of the engine design account for its tough build quality.

I recently drove a M-Hawk VLX AT and it was extremely refined compared to the non M-Hawks. The AT gearbox in particular was extremely soft on shifting. Really liked it, but then the AT, thats getting away from the Scorpio 'feel'. And yes. it did seem more delicate than my non Crde, but I attributed that to the 'feel' of the vehicle with all the on board electronics gizmos which gives you an impression of a luxury vehicle and not of Scorp.

Any how, to recap...since the M-Hawks seem more deilcate, they need more care.
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Old 16th March 2009, 11:49   #58
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Originally Posted by badboyscad View Post
... scorpio's(non-crde) idle rpm.
badboyscad, aplogies for the really late response, but thought I should let you know that my non Crde had a factory set rpm at idle of about 550, which I found a bit slow...I increased increased it to 950 for a smoother idle. Everythings fine. I find a slight increase in the idle rpm, whenever possible, is always better in the long run in terms of driving pleasure as well as engine & mounts etc. Ofcourse there would be a drop in the FE when driven in heavy stop start long idle kinda traffic, but its a trade off thats acceptable to me.
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Old 16th March 2009, 11:54   #59
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Hi,

Fidgeting around in the glove box, I found this set o switches. Have attaced a picture and apologies for the bad quality (its taken by my trusted Nokia 9500 with 1.2 mp !!!). Can some one please elaborate on these. Thanks in advance.

@ mods: feel free to delete this post if you find the pic quality unworthy!!!
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Old 16th March 2009, 12:40   #60
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Gosh, Mohnish, that pic is bad! Between Nokia and you, I'm sure a better one is possible, LOL!
What do the tags say? Never seen such switches in my friend's non-CRDe Scorpio.
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