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Old 18th January 2010, 10:55   #916
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Originally Posted by gd1418 View Post
I like the word bobbing. Yes, it is very much in the older scorpios with the leaf springs. To be honest the newer ones too have it.

My FNG suggested something to me that made a lot of sense. Ever since the bobbing and the side-by-side roll has considerably reduced, plus the ride feels better.

Originally, the leaf spring set of the Scorpio consists of 5 leaves. While the support gap between 1 & 2, 3 & 4 and 4 & 5 leaves is ok and load bearing, the distance between the 2 & 3 leaves is more, thus exerting extra strain on leaf No. 2. And mostly it is the leaf #:2 that snaps.

FNG suggested me to add one more leaf between 2 & 3 to increase support. I did that and after that undertook a 3000 Km trip to Leh & back. My scorp held steady on hairpin bends, jumped over boulders without bobbing and the rear seat passengers didn't bang their head on the roof. The attached picture will explain this better.

Leaf #:6 is the added leaf:

Attachment 263899

Hi,
Can you give me some more details.

Dimensions of the leaf,etc......

tnx
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Old 18th January 2010, 11:58   #917
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Guys, I know this is a simple and stupid question.This might be answered by now,but I couldn't go through all the pages. I was shortlisting one of the scorpio's CRDe/DX version(obviously it is a 2nd hand-shortage of vitamin M), suddenly one of my brother's friend told me that scorpios are not stable on highways and it tends to roll/topple over(I know it rolls at hgh speed) at speeds of 120/140kmph(I never drive at that speed) and the braking is also not good(I know thefact that at 120/130kmph none of the SUV's stop in 1 sec due to its weight).So can anyone confirm this to me.
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Old 18th January 2010, 12:06   #918
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Its high speed instability does not mean it rolls over and acts dead as soon as you cross 120. I have driven my Scorp at 140-145 kmph.
Only sharp turn will result in the Scorp toppling over.

In any case, I usually never go above 100 anymore.

If you do not have a problem with not going above 120 kmph, you can go ahead with the purchase.

The older Scorps did come with lousy brakes. Make vigilance your best friend when in a Scorp.
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Old 18th January 2010, 13:52   #919
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One more question adding to my previous one. How many kms does an suv like scorpio can run in terms of engine life before it comes for bore work
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Old 18th January 2010, 14:15   #920
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@Shishir, reg stability : highers speeds in turnings is a limitation for any tall vehicle. Check the owners's manual for recommended turning speeds, and stick to that. In a straight line, you should not have problems.

And as you start driving, you will know the limits of your vehicle for your driving style. If you go for the Scorp, or any SUV, then remember to re-learn your driving for that particular vehicle.
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Old 18th January 2010, 14:27   #921
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Thanks @essyewee and @condor. Any inputs for the diesel engine life in terms of kms.
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Old 18th January 2010, 14:40   #922
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Quote:
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One more question adding to my previous one. How many kms does an suv like scorpio can run in terms of engine life before it comes for bore work
I think HVK has inched towards the 200,000 KM mark now with no engine work.
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Old 18th January 2010, 18:31   #923
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Yes Condor, the ride is bouncier when not on full load.

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@GD : You were told that on full load, the ride would be smoother. 4 people + luggage is quite close to full load, and the Scorp has behaved as predicted.

Leaf springs will behave better on more load. The question is - how is the ride on lighter load ? Not about getting used to, but about more bounciness / more stiff / .. ?
Standard M&M leaf for Scorpio but of shorter length.

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Originally Posted by PRADEEP KUMAR View Post
Hi,
Can you give me some more details.

Dimensions of the leaf,etc......

tnx
SUVs are not meant for cornering or doing drag. Buya 300 BHP low slung sedan with ABS ventillated discs on all wheels with broad low-profile tyres if you want to do all this.

I've done 130 kmph on my scorpio and have not toppled till now as I've not cornered at that speed.

After reaching a speed of 100 kmph the brakes of any 2 ton behemoth are a litle suspect.

Quote:
Originally Posted by shishir_bn View Post
Guys, I know this is a simple and stupid question.This might be answered by now,but I couldn't go through all the pages. I was shortlisting one of the scorpio's CRDe/DX version(obviously it is a 2nd hand-shortage of vitamin M), suddenly one of my brother's friend told me that scorpios are not stable on highways and it tends to roll/topple over(I know it rolls at hgh speed) at speeds of 120/140kmph(I never drive at that speed) and the braking is also not good(I know thefact that at 120/130kmph none of the SUV's stop in 1 sec due to its weight).So can anyone confirm this to me.
The current Scorps also have the same brakes. That design remains untouched..

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Originally Posted by EssYouWe View Post
The older Scorps did come with lousy brakes. Make vigilance your best friend when in a Scorp.
Current diesel plants, if properly maintained with regular service and timely oil change etc., would last nearly 3 L Kms.

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Originally Posted by shishir_bn View Post
One more question adding to my previous one. How many kms does an suv like scorpio can run in terms of engine life before it comes for bore work
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Old 19th January 2010, 11:08   #924
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gd1418 View Post
The current Scorps also have the same brakes. That design remains untouched..
Are you sure? I remember driving an older Scorp right about when i bought my mHawk, and I was certain that the braking was not as good as the mHawk. Maybe it was a one off case.


@Shishir

Driving it properly and running it in will easily see you across the 2 lac kms point.
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Old 19th January 2010, 12:39   #925
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@gd1418 and @ESSYouWe

The VLX and refreshed SLE has ABS and this will definitely improve safety when braking.
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Old 19th January 2010, 14:03   #926
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Thanks for solving my stupid question
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Old 19th January 2010, 16:58   #927
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Originally Posted by 4x4addict View Post
@gd1418 and @ESSYouWe

The VLX and refreshed SLE has ABS and this will definitely improve safety when braking.

Definitely! But I also felt that the brakes in themselves were more potent than before.
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Old 20th January 2010, 14:34   #928
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Thanks 4x4addict. But what I basically meant was that the design remains untouched.. While the VLX has ABS the non-vlxs have the same braking design and system minus the ABS.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 4x4addict View Post
@gd1418 and @ESSYouWe

The VLX and refreshed SLE has ABS and this will definitely improve safety when braking.
Quote:
Originally Posted by EssYouWe View Post
Definitely! But I also felt that the brakes in themselves were more potent than before.
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Old 20th January 2010, 14:37   #929
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I recently got Hella foglamps installed on my bull guard. GD Sir its in the same fashion as your Scorpio. I got holes drilled in the bull guard pipe.

The problem is that the lights vibrate and the light throw is shaky during idle. Any solution?
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Old 20th January 2010, 14:42   #930
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Default MICO-BOSCH Alternator cut-out blues

I've been experiencing some alternator related problem that is puzzling. Let me explain. The Bull, which is a Scorpio 2004 GLx came fitted with a MICO Lic Bosch Alternator of the following rating:

F 002 G10 422
K1 - 14V 28/90A

Ever since the truck came into my stable in 2006, including the happening on this Monday, I've replaced the cut-out 4 times. Till Monday I actually had not paid much attention to this recurring issue. On Monday, while returning home at around 7 pm, nearing IIT crossing (Delhi/NCR guys would relate to the place), I suddenly noticed that the RPM meter had fallen back to zero and the battery icon glowing faintly. My heart sank and I thought - oh no, not an another fan belt breakage. Immediately I applied the brake to test and it responded normally. Some relief..! I parked the truck on the left and with the engine running, opened the bonnet and inspected with a torch that I always carry. The fan belt was intact and visually no damage was visible. Relieved that the fan belt was ok, surmised that it was the alternator that had gone kaput and somehow I suspected the cut-out again.

It was chilly, fog was settling down and hoping against hope I called up the electrician. Now this electrician was earlier with my FNG and has recently left and opened his own setup nearby. He knew the electrical system of my vehicle thoroughly. Glad, he picked up the phone, and after I explained him the problem said that he would wait for me and would do the needful. Now I started driving towards him with the most minimum required lights as the battery was not charging. Just a few months back I had installed a new 90Ah battery, so was not worrying much too. Then I placed a call to Roshun to ask the reason for this frequent cut-out problem because I couldn't think of any. After a detailed talk with him the only conclusion was either the field coil was earthing inside or the armature had some problem. What Roshun also told me that from 2005 onwards, M&M started installing Zennor alternators instead of MICO. Well, I've never heard of Zennor.

I reached the electrician and what he told me was quite shocking. He said that this MICO-BOSCH alternators have a history of problem and 9 out of 10 times it is the cut-out that goes kaput. He said that this particular alternator is a standard on Taveras also and they also keep coming to him regularly for this problem. He suggested me to go in for the Lucas alternator that come in Safari as they are trouble free, better performance and the mounting bracket is the same as that of a Scorpio. It shall not be out of context to mention that the Lucas alternator in my Safari of '98 has not yet been serviced till date.

The electrician also told me that I could get a decent second hand unit for
around 2.5K (new one is for 8.5K). Consulted Roshun again, explained all to him and he also concurred that it is a good thing to do. So, I'll get the Lucas alternator and keep it ready. Next time whenever the MICO alternator is removed for whatever reason, shall install the Lucas.

Now, as far as carrying out simple repairs in my car is concerned, I'm jinxed. I had reached the electrician by 8 pm and he had by that time had got a new MICO cut-out. Everything was ready and he said in about an hour I should be on my way back home. The fog had got a little more thick, the wind chill increased and since it was in the open, I took out my wollen cap. The airfilter to turbo hose was removed, two bolts loosened and the alternator was out. The old cut-out was removed and like the earlier two cutouts the thin wire embedded in the carbon brushes was damaged. The new cut-out installed, alternator assembled and it was time to fit it back in. Time: 8:55 pm. I thought that by 9:15 I should be on my way back. But that was not to be. The jinx struck.

In the current diesels, the alternator plays a very important role. The power brakes get their air pressure from it, the RPM meter functions through it etc. I've been informed that the newer 2005+ Scorpios take the RPM input from the flywheel. Now to create pressure for the brake system a rubber oil pipe from the engine feeds oil into the alternator. So every time the alternator is removed, that oil pipe also has to be removed from the alternator elbow and refitted. I was informed that in my case it was tricky job as the pipe had become hard & brittle over the years and if care is not taken, then it would develop a crack. Since the pipe is a tight fit on the elbow it takes a lot of effort and strength.

The elbow was heated, grease applied and the pipe was tried to slip over it. It did not fit. In all this exercise, the pipe crumbled. It was decided that the pipe be replaced. A frustrating thing with the manufacturers is that they sometime design certain things assuming it shall never fail or need replacement and hence that item is not made available as a spare.

Time: 9:20 pm. A expedition was launched to get the original pipe. Sagar Motors was about to close, but he said that this particular pipe doesn't come as spare. Sagar's contact in the store at Sterling repeated the same story. The alternative was to get a similar rubber pipe and fix it with clips at both end as the original had clip for the elbow at the alternator end. The engine side elbow had the pipe permanently punched like in the fuel pipe. A threaded rubber pipe of the same diameter with dual insulation was found, the engine side elbow was freed from the punched pipe and the installation process started.

Job finished at 10:15. Engine started for 5 minutes to check for oil leakage; none found, bill settled and left for home satisfied and tired. RPM meter functioning, battery charging properly - happy man.

The details:

MICO cut-out: Rs.560.00
Rubber pipe: Rs. 60.00
Clips: Rs. 30.00
Labour: Rs.250.00
-----------------------
TOTAL Rs.900.00
-----------------------

Question: Has anybody else here having a MICO alternator experienced a similar or any other kind of problem??

Last edited by gd1418 : 20th January 2010 at 14:44.
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