Go Back   Team-BHP > Under the Hood > Technical Stuff


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 1st August 2017, 10:57   #31
Senior - BHPian
 
sumeethaldankar's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 2,628
Thanked: 973 Times
Default Re: Leaking Dampers (Shock Absorbers) : Can they be repaired?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fighterace View Post
... IF DONE JUDICIOUSLY.
?
It might be true. However the problem is finding this "a good workshop with the right tools, skilled hands and needed parts is all that is needed". Not every town/city/corner has one. While a repaired shock maybe better than a busted one my point is if the OE shocks are expensive and finding a good repair shop is hard the alternative is branded after market stuff which are just as good and have close to OE quality. In the end a repaired item will always have the back of the mind doubt "what if" it fails again.

"aftermarket ones, but even at 1.9 k apiece. it would cost about 10k to carry out the replacement, including labour"
A OE replacement would have cost around 5k with labor. ( I got my Civics front suspension overhauled with new ball joints, lower arms etc changed for 1500 bucks as labor). For additional 2k you get the peace of mind.

"IF DONE JUDICIOUSLY." I understand you are not trying to be aggressive but you do know sir that writing in caps means shouting.

Peace.

Last edited by sumeethaldankar : 1st August 2017 at 10:58.
sumeethaldankar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 7th August 2017, 20:31   #32
BHPian
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 223
Thanked: 120 Times
Default Re: Leaking Dampers (Shock Absorbers) : Can they be repaired?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sumeethaldankar View Post
It might be true. However the problem is finding this "a good workshop with the right tools, skilled hands and needed parts is all that is needed". Not every town/city/corner has one. While a repaired shock maybe better than a busted one my point is if the OE shocks are expensive and finding a good repair shop is hard the alternative is branded after market stuff which are just as good and have close to OE quality. In the end a repaired item will always have the back of the mind doubt "what if" it fails again.

"aftermarket ones, but even at 1.9 k apiece. it would cost about 10k to carry out the replacement, including labour"
A OE replacement would have cost around 5k with labor. ( I got my Civics front suspension overhauled with new ball joints, lower arms etc changed for 1500 bucks as labor). For additional 2k you get the peace of mind.

"IF DONE JUDICIOUSLY." I understand you are not trying to be aggressive but you do know sir that writing in caps means shouting.

Peace.
Agreed that caps should have been bold/italics, my bad.

As for the economics, what you are talking about is overhaul of either end, my estimate of 10k is for all 4 corners, which was done for 3k in the Figo.
fighterace is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th August 2017, 01:30   #33
BHPian
 
ringoism's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Himachal
Posts: 487
Thanked: 1,115 Times
Default Re: Leaking Dampers (Shock Absorbers) : Can they be repaired?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeroen View Post
You say you can drive safely on bad shocks. To the above, in many countries it would be considered unsafe and thus illegal. To put some context on that; In various European countries the local police forces have a habit of doing random safety checks. Especially during the summer holidays as people load up their cars, hitch up the caravan and drive off to the great beyond.
"The letter [of the Law] kills, but the Spirit gives life" (the Apostle Paul)

"This is not the EU" (Ringoism) :-)

What I suggested in my last response is that the word "safely" has to be qualified. What is "safe" for a "loaded-up caravan" on the European Autobahn by necessity has to be differently defined vs. what is "safe" for the guy tooling around Old Delhi at 25kmph in his venerable M800. We resident foreigners need to be ever-mindful of the fact that things are not always the same here - nor do they need to be - as in our lands of origin. Never mind defining what is "safe", but evaluating cost/benefit ratios on a 30-Euro shock for a Mercedes (nevermind the XJR) is not quite like calculating it for a Rs2,500 shock on an eight-year-old Figo. In SOME cases, the few thousand saved on rebuilts is going to mean the difference between running on totally spoiled shocks vs. running on a set that is fully functional. "Preference" doesn't even have to factor in here. Some might prefer to live on the moon, but that's not really feasible at present. Not everyone has a lot of extra cash flying around.

Concerning another contextual case in point, in most of the subcontinent, it is considered completely reasonable and legal to operate a farm tractor for long distances on national highways (or city streets). So damn the shocks/dampers, if you keep it below 45kmph, even springs / front brakes (seat belts, airbags, ABS, crumple zones, side impact barriers, etc) are apparently not necessary towards achieving acceptable levels of safety! Who/what decides what's "acceptable"? Well, the context does. Roadside spot-checks of shock performance in the EU, where average speeds/limits are relatively high (high-speed braking / directional changes are where a LOT of worn / otherwise compromised components become critical), make a lot of sense. Some places here MIGHT compare... but in most urban/rural setups here rigorous inspections of shocks would have virtually no positive net effect - it would be quite ridiculous and wasteful actually. The original poster had a particular context and motive in mind, and the various naysayers - none of whom seem to have personally used these services nor experienced any adverse effects - really ought not to be dismissing the option he chose, especially when their context is dissimilar, and when he made it very clear that he'd be taking careful note of their ongoing performance - i.e., he's going to know it if one or more becomes weakened prematurely, and if that happens (which I doubt), he can simply rectify it. His car's not going to suddenly fly off the edge of a cliff on account!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeroen View Post
You will not believe how many caravans and cars fail during those inspections on shocks alone and you won’t be allowed to continue your journey. Worn shocks is a pretty serious thing and the penalties for a bad shocks is similar as to that of a (too) bold [sic] tyre.
I just love regulation. But surprising how many people are driving on bad ones when the penalties are so high - This serves to bolster your earlier point that many drivers are fairly oblivious to their vehicles' mechanical condition. On the other hand, it also serves to suggest that such holiday-destroying regulation is ultimately not that effective as a deterrent to vehicular neglect. It also bolsters my earlier point: Since it's unlikely that roadside police spot-checkers possess sufficiently sophisticated test equipment to assess precise levels of deviance from OE damping characteristics for every single model produced in the past few decades, it would seem that whatever simple methods they're employing could also be utilized by any conscientious vehicle owner (which all t-bhpians must be!!!), who are fully capable of periodically checking the condition of their shocks (as outlined in my last post) and other components. It literally only takes a minute to check the effectiveness of all four shocks in a quick walk-around.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeroen View Post
To put that in some context [installing a full new set] is about a third of what I pay to fill up a full tank with petrol. It’s easy as I can just take the old ones off and put the new ones on and be done. I don’t have to send the old shocks away to be overhauled, wait for them to be returned, jack up the car again etc.

I know some of the big brands such as Bilstein offer re-built services in the UK and I’m sure there are various independent parties that could do a great job if they have the proper expertise and gear.

Whether you use a reconditioned shock or go for new, for whatever reason is a matter of personal choice... I just prefer new.
Again you speak of context, but the context you describe is not the one where this thread was started, and the original question asked. Nobody's tank of fuel here costs three times what a set of new shocks does. Nor are rebuilts such a hassle as they'd be in Europe, where almost everything is more centralized.

This is how it works here: Pull up in your vehicle to any one of a few shops on the back side of Karol Bagh, get the man started, and within a couple hours your work is done. You can sit and watch him and learn something / check on him (which you'd have to do at any workshop supposedly installing new ones, as well), or if your trust is high, you can go window-shopping for a couple hours in the nearby two-wheeler, or mobile, or leather, or (Mmm... jewelry) or whichever other local market. No shipping the units out, no waiting for their return. It probably isn't going to take any longer than going to the Jag showroom to have a spanking-new set put in.

But you've summed up well, and we're finally in agreement. It's a personal choice ultimately. Not everyone has good rebuilders locally available. Not everyone makes $600/hr as a corporate lawyer. Not everyone feels the need for additional peace of mind, and for that matter, some people will just replace the car when the shocks wear out (as many had to do with their Lincoln Mk7's). Component costs and availability can vary wildly depending on vehicle, and on top of that (I'd say): intended driving venues / performance requirements are not the same for everyone.

Sol I'll just rest my case here while we're on common ground...

But will confess I can be contentious on a lot of other regulatory "safety" matters also, so this is not unique:

1. Bald tyres in reality have a lot more contact area than treaded tyres (Formula 1 anyone?) thus on dry pavement would actually be much "safer" - in terms of traction performance anyway - than a brand-new low-grade "all season" tyre. We don't want steel belts showing through and in puncture-prone areas they're clearly inferior, but if police in Kuwait or West Texas (or during the dry season anywhere else in the world) are giving out fines only on account of lacking quite deep enough grooves, it is strictly revenue-generation.

2. If ABS is so universally wonderful and effective, why do all the high-end Adventure-Touring bikes and SUV's have switches that allow it to be switched off??? Hmmm...

3. Same for airbags, which can be great in combination, but statistically are less effective (and sometimes have themselves proved deadly) as compared with simple seatbelts, especially assuming one or the other (and so many still do refuse to buckle-up).

4. Heavy A-pillar structures which are STRONG and help in rollovers, but are extremely obstructive to forward vision, especially when turning... they most definitely cause more accidents... But at least the accidents will be "safer"!!!??? Excuse me, does that make any sense???

5. The development / enforcement of safe driving practices would go further than all of these regulatory measures combined - BUT...

That
would involve a degree of conscientious selflessness much more achievable via the Spirit than the Law.

-Eric

Last edited by ringoism : 29th August 2017 at 02:00.
ringoism is offline   (3) Thanks Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Tata Safari Storme: Leaking dampers issue? tsk1979 Technical Stuff 11 21st April 2016 19:19
Levant USA: Energy-generating dampers (shock absorbers) spoth001 Technical Stuff 3 23rd April 2015 14:40
Shock absorbers n suspensions gbpscars Modifications & Accessories 1 10th May 2006 14:22
Hyundai Santro Shock Absorbers aquavelva Modifications & Accessories 3 3rd May 2006 15:21
Gas Shock Absorbers for Swift aseem Technical Stuff 26 26th August 2005 09:47


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 05:51.

Copyright 2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks