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Old 13th July 2012, 03:35   #16
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Default Re: My Mercedes W124 E220 - Head Issue

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Originally Posted by Tejas Ingle View Post
Usually engine lying for such a long time will come out with a lot of issues. But, this one being a Mercedes-Benz, should fire up if you show some love and affection. You will have to change many parts though (Hoses, Mountings etc.).
If you give the same love to your engine, it will also run without problems. Get the work done by a good technician. I have a feeling that this is a blown gasket. At the max, you may have to change the valves. Check if you see oil in your coolant reservoir.
And she fires up! Wednesday 6:30 PM the "New" W124 engine comes to life! Albeit missing on CYl 2 & 3 coz the low tension input to the ignition coil got shorted. Issue now fixed. Thankfully the ECU survived. There is however a slght miss in the idling, but discernible. The mech says the wiring harness is not in a good shape and that the reason there is a slight shake in the engine at idle. can the wiring harness be repaired with all the insulation restored post removal from the car and then reinsstalled? I guess a new one is real expensive.

I took the 15 year "new" engine for a short drive. There were signs of reluctance at first but eventually I felt the more I drove, the better It got. The pickup is great. 20 minutes into the drive I saw the temp needle climb up to 110+. I had to shut off the engine ..waited 40 mins for it to cool to below 80 degrees then took it back. the Thermostat valve seems to be the culprit here as the lower radiator hose was warm and the upper hose was real hot. I hope I didnt stress the engine too much due to overheating. What should be the ideal temp while running? secondly I suspect the fan clutch to be bad as even at the over heated state (but turned off) i could freely turn the fan blade - with little resistance. Query - Isnt the fan clutch supposed to tighten up at hot temperatures..coz how else will it spin faster?

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Old 13th July 2012, 16:59   #17
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Default Re: My Mercedes W124 E220 - Head Issue

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And she fires up! Wednesday 6:30 PM the "New" W124 engine comes to life!
There is however a slght miss in the idling, but discernible. The mech says the wiring harness is not in a good shape and that the reason there is a slight shake in the engine at idle. can the wiring harness be repaired with all the insulation restored post removal from the car and then reinsstalled?

20 minutes into the drive I saw the temp needle climb up to 110+. I had to shut off the engine ..waited 40 mins for it to cool to below 80 degrees then took it back. the Thermostat valve seems to be the culprit here as the lower radiator hose was warm and the upper hose was real hot. I hope I didnt stress the engine too much due to overheating. What should be the ideal temp while running? secondly I suspect the fan clutch to be bad as even at the over heated state (but turned off) i could freely turn the fan blade - with little resistance. Query - Isnt the fan clutch supposed to tighten up at hot temperatures..coz how else will it spin faster?
Congratulations for the new engine. Do get the paper work cleared once it is in good shape.
For the engine vibes, get the engine mountings checked. Also get the engine serviced properly, change the fluids and do the necessary cleaning.
About the wiring, haven't seen it so cant really comment. What does he mean by bad shape?
Only a viscous fan (hydraulic clutch) tightens up when the temp increases. An electromagnetic fan is electrically operated and remains free when the engine is not running. The overheating problem needs to be diagnosed. I suggest you to get the servicing done at MB authorised service station. The electronic diagnostics there would bring to surface any faults if present.

Keep revving!
Tejas.
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Old 13th July 2012, 17:54   #18
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Default Re: My Mercedes W124 E220 - Head Issue

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Originally Posted by sportz_kruzer View Post
the Thermostat valve seems to be the culprit here as the lower radiator hose was warm and the upper hose was real hot.
if the upper hose was hot and lower hose was not, that may also indicate that the flow of coolant is not being completed which can be caused by either a busted water pump, or by a jammed expansion valve (could be a probability here since the engine was not in use for long).
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Old 13th July 2012, 17:57   #19
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Default Re: My Mercedes W124 E220 - Head Issue

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And she fires up! I guess a new one is real expensive.
I suspect the fan clutch to be bad as even at the over heated state (but turned off) i could freely turn the fan blade - with little resistance. Query - Isnt the fan clutch supposed to tighten up at hot temperatures..coz how else will it spin faster?
+1 to what Ingle sir has said. I am no expert in W124 but still will say this since i am myself looking for a W124 E250D for sometime now. You will feel no difference if its electric. But, first things first, get your electrical wiring fixed soon. You already have said it has slight mistimings during idle, better sooner than feeling sorry. Moreover, avoid long drives untill you get your cooling issue sorted out. My advice would be, even if its bit costly, its worth to get it done at the MB service centre or at your mechanics' place if he is a MB expert. What about your steering? Can you post some pictures of your steering assembly(worn out bearings and tie rod set-up?).
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Old 13th July 2012, 18:04   #20
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Default Re: My Mercedes W124 E220 - Head Issue

Congrats...

Check the following

Engine MOunting Bushes for the vibration

The radiator fan is a viscous fan; but even if it is not working on a running car you should not cross 110+; the fan helps more in bumper to bumper slow trafiic; mine is not working but i never cross 90 in any situation

You maybe right on the thermostat; either way as Tejas mentioned drain and replace all fluids; change spark plugs; wires etc; do a baseline servicing; post that you would be get a clear idea on any issues if any

Dont worry 110 wont fry anything..
Did this happen with AC on?? if yes also check your AUX fan
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Old 16th July 2012, 01:54   #21
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Default Re: My Mercedes W124 E220 - Head Issue

Mounts seem good. Its more a gentle rock at idle than a vibe... I put in an imported injector cleaner suggested by my mech with a full tank of petrol..let see if there is an improvement.

update - The car is running fine now - minus a bad front right wheel bearing. A jammed themostat was the culprit for the overheating issue - now fixed. The temp site comfy at the 85-90 mark. Have driven 60 KMs without an issue. guesstimate mileage its aroung 6kmpl. driven mostly thru jams and a little spirited driving on NH8 (Gosh I guess I am yet to get out of my Pulsar days )

The car will run on water as a coolant and engine oil being shell helix 20w50 for a few days to flush out all the bad stuff. differential oil topped up, gear oil checked. I have a few queries here:

1. Do you recommend putting synthetic oil say Mobil1 (engine is brand new , run only 6k but was W124 ever designed for one?)

2. The Ac aux fan (radiator) now keeps running the moment i flick the ignition key to ON. I dont see it being bypassed anywhere, The red switch sitting on the ac gas pipline and its connections look as they should be. This was not the case before the the car was diagnosed for the overheating issue.

3. I cant find the AC button but yes there is a "EC" button, and one with three circular arrows, and another one with a heater kind of look. will try to post a pic.

4. The compressor engages when i press the "EC" button or mayb the 3 circular arrow button (not sure) the ac radiator outside heats up but there is no cold air from the vents.

Background - There was almost no gas in the system. I put in a some R134a gas from the bottle. Hooked up a guage on the low side, There is a huge drop in pressure when the compressor turns which shows its working but no cold air...in the vents...the fan blower inside thrws a ton of air..so the possibility of a clogged condensor is very less - iam i missing anything ?

3. I cant find the "check engine light" anywhere on the cluster panel. Or does it look different in this case?

4. No Glove compartment in here? (W124 E220 owners i am right or i am I stupid enough not to be able to locate/open it? )

5. The rotary headlight switch on the right is busted. Please advise a way to remove it (yes I love DIY) I really need to fight with it to get the headlights up. Now only the left one turns on.

6. The fabric heat sheild under the bonnet is missing - I felt the bonnet heats up quite too much. Will this ruin the paint?


7. The power steering is quite tight especially during idle (not effortless like my Daewoo Cielo) PS Fluid was changed abd the steeribg turned left right a few times. Any special bleeding procedure here? I think the steering was OK pre engine swap. is te PW steering hard by default or mine needs some introspection?

8 There is a "light" thud from the back when I put reverse. is this normal?
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Old 16th July 2012, 02:06   #22
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Default Re: My Mercedes W124 E220 - Head Issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tejas Ingle View Post
Congratulations for the new engine. Do get the paper work cleared once it is in good shape.
For the engine vibes, get the engine mountings checked. Also get the engine serviced properly, change the fluids and do the necessary cleaning.
About the wiring, haven't seen it so cant really comment. What does he mean by bad shape?
Only a viscous fan (hydraulic clutch) tightens up when the temp increases. An electromagnetic fan is electrically operated and remains free when the engine is not running. The overheating problem needs to be diagnosed. I suggest you to get the servicing done at MB authorised service station. The electronic diagnostics there would bring to surface any faults if present.

Keep revving!
Tejas.
The wiring has cuts and bruises at many places...looks really sad. I plan to remove it and restore the insulation after sometime...when I get a batter hang of things in there. will post a pic soon

I aint hovering anywhere close to the MB dealership for now man..I remember a friend of mine had to get his two credit cards to pay off the bill for a service for his Audi A4 .

The pesky fan clutch still fails to impress me...all tough visually the fan seems to be spinning fine there is a lot of slip when its stationery (be it a hot engine or cold) I am not impressed fo far with this kind of a design
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Old 16th July 2012, 02:37   #23
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Default Re: My Mercedes W124 E220 - Head Issue

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Originally Posted by Tejas Ingle View Post
You should open up the engine for inspection without which you cannot decide anything. If the head is repairable you can give it a try. If not, you can replace the head provided that the cylinder block is in good shape. If you are replacing the head, you may have to replace the cams along with it. It may also be just a blown gasket. I didn't understand why water would spray out of spark-plug. Do you mean it sprays out after removing the spark plug and cranking the engine?
Some pics of my old busted engine head...the bore piston part is rock solid no play in the piston whatsoever...see the busted head no 4 with a point broken on circumference area... that was causing the coolant to mix with the oil. Apparently the head gasket was OK! the foolish idiot didnt even give her a marutis maintenance...the car had been running on water as coolant for many years...so guys this is what happens (even to the legendary W124) when you go for "sast wala coolant"..or worse plain tap water....
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Last edited by sportz_kruzer : 16th July 2012 at 02:41.
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Old 16th July 2012, 17:18   #24
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Default Re: My Mercedes W124 E220 - Head Issue

No Issues with Synthic Oil

The fan might be bypassed at the relay end? from my point of view leave it like that no issues

The moment you turn the blower the AC is on; the EC button in Economy Cool; which will take more of air from outside and reduce compressor usage to cool the cabin

Check and Top up the gas first before you do any kind of troubleshooting; will save you a lot of trouble.. check my post you will realize i ran chasing my tail on this issue

No Glove Compartment :(

The headlight switch is easy DYI; you just need to remove the trim around it and replace; Search DIY section in peachparts.com; BTW the switch if busted and needs to replaced is quite expensive

New Fabric sheets are available at parts shops; do not do stunts like HEat-lon and on.. worst case use Dyna material

Again there is a DIY in the peachparts.com on power steering oil


Lastly a thud when putting reverse; check the transmission DISC both front and back; replace if in doubt; else you may either end up in the middle of road with no way to move the car forward; or worse
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Old 16th July 2012, 19:48   #25
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Default Re: My Mercedes W124 E220 - Head Issue

The engine head is screwed. Looks like the car wasn't maintained.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sportz_kruzer View Post
The Ac aux fan (radiator) now keeps running the moment i flick the ignition key to ON.

No Glove compartment in here?

There is a "light" thud from the back when I put reverse. is this normal?
Your mech must have disconnected some sensor, possibly temperature sensor somewhere near the thermostat. Or there may be a fault in the wiring. So the fan keeps running because it does not know what is the temperature. It will drain the battery quickly.

I cant believe there's no glove compartment. Explore a bit, you should find it.

I assume yours is manual transmission (sorry, I am bad at relating model with specs). Is your clutch spongy? If yes, get the bleeding done. This might also be due to worn clutch plate or a bad release bearing. But that must have been checked during the engine swap. Another possibility is that there is play in the propeller shaft. If yours is an automatic, then I'll have to think about the issue.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sportz_kruzer View Post
The wiring has cuts and bruises at many places...looks really sad.
The pesky fan clutch still fails to impress me.
Wiring repairs can be a nightmare. Select your wireman carefully. This car has CAN network and one connection lost will create multiple issues.

If your car is not overheating in B to B traffic then the fan is fine.
P.S. You will need to solve the actuation issue first. It shouldn't be actuated all the time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeepakMenon View Post
check the transmission DISC both front and back; replace if in doubt;
What is transmission DISC?
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Old 16th July 2012, 20:56   #26
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Default Re: My Mercedes W124 E220 - Head Issue

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Originally Posted by sportz_kruzer View Post
1. Do you recommend putting synthetic oil say Mobil1 (engine is brand new , run only 6k but was W124 ever designed for one?)
Yes we use fully synthetic oil 0w-40 for this engine at the dealership.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sportz_kruzer View Post
3. I cant find the AC button but yes there is a "EC" button, and one with three circular arrows, and another one with a heater kind of look. will try to post a pic.

4. The compressor engages when i press the "EC" button or mayb the 3 circular arrow button (not sure) the ac radiator outside heats up but there is no cold air from the vents.

Background - There was almost no gas in the system. I put in a some R134a gas from the bottle. Hooked up a guage on the low side, There is a huge drop in pressure when the compressor turns which shows its working but no cold air...in the vents...the fan blower inside thrws a ton of air..so the possibility of a clogged condensor is very less - iam i missing anything ?
The EC button is economy button which when pressed turns OFF the AC.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sportz_kruzer View Post
6. The fabric heat sheild under the bonnet is missing - I felt the bonnet heats up quite too much. Will this ruin the paint
No it wont.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sportz_kruzer View Post
7. The power steering is quite tight especially during idle (not effortless like my Daewoo Cielo) PS Fluid was changed abd the steeribg turned left right a few times. Any special bleeding procedure here? I think the steering was OK pre engine swap. is te PW steering hard by default or mine needs some introspection?
If i remember correctly this car has a steering gearbox not a rack and pinion system. Let me see if there's a different procedure to bleed this one. Will let you know.

Last edited by Neil.Bhujbal : 16th July 2012 at 20:58.
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Old 16th July 2012, 22:08   #27
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Default Re: My Mercedes W124 E220 - Head Issue

Flex Disc used on the front and rear of the transmission; when it is worn out it can make clunking noises

Refer to part image below;

MERCEDES W124 W140 W202 W210 DRIVESHAFT FLEX DISC KIT | eBay




If it is a E220 W124 you have no glove compartment; only a central storage under you arm; if you find one tell me where becoz i have this car..lol
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Old 16th July 2012, 22:23   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeepakMenon

If it is a E220 W124 you have no glove compartment; only a central storage under you arm; if you find one tell me where becoz i have this car..lol
Airbags were added to the w124 much later. It was not planned in the design stage hence the glove box was sacrificed in the later models for the passenger airbag
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Old 17th July 2012, 01:48   #29
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Default Re: My Mercedes W124 E220 - Head Issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeepakMenon View Post
Flex Disc used on the front and rear of the transmission; when it is worn out it can make clunking noises

Refer to part image below;

MERCEDES W124 W140 W202 W210 DRIVESHAFT FLEX DISC KIT | eBay




If it is a E220 W124 you have no glove compartment; only a central storage under you arm; if you find one tell me where becoz i have this car..lol

Hi Deepak, is there a way i can check for play by turning/shaking the axle with hand probably?

And can you tell me where the OVP relay is located on this car. I have read in many cases the soldering cracks and things go awry and that kinda stuff so I thought I should investigate.
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Old 17th July 2012, 01:52   #30
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Default Re: My Mercedes W124 E220 - Head Issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tejas Ingle View Post
I cant believe there's no glove compartment. Explore a bit, you should find it.

I assume yours is manual transmission (sorry, I am bad at relating model with specs). Is your clutch spongy? If yes, get the bleeding done. This might also be due to worn clutch plate or a bad release bearing. But that must have been checked during the engine swap. Another possibility is that there is play in the propeller shaft. If yours is an automatic, then I'll have to think about the issue.


Wiring repairs can be a nightmare. Select your wireman carefully. This car has CAN network and one connection lost will create multiple issues.
Yup its a manual tranny. Replaceed the clutch and pressure plate with release bearing for 10K. The clutch was 95% fried. caught it JIT! Flywheel however was ok.

BTW whats a CAN network? Hope it doesnt open a CAN of worms

CAn you please throw some light on propeller shaft greasing? I read in forums that the Fortuner needs it quite regularly. It was in a thread where the wheels of the 4x4 locked up at 110 for no apparent reason I remember ...

Last edited by sportz_kruzer : 17th July 2012 at 01:55.
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