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Old 8th July 2012, 15:12   #1
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Default Scoop! Race Dynamics is preparing a dual channel Diesel tuning box

Background:
I have a Skoda Rapid TDI with a RD Dieseltronic box powering it. My ownership thread is here: http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/test-d...ml#post2595142, and this link serves as an Index for you to navigate through my thread… Feel free to browse through it.

Intro:
I happened to swing by the RD garage/office this week to tweak my P1/P2 maps slightly, and got a chance to sit down with Karthik & Pavan and talk about what they're coming out with next. If you recall my first experience/report of the RD box in my ownership thread, they'd already hinted at the fact that they will launch a newer box within a year which will also control turbo boost (in addition to fuelling). So, I was talking to them about it and they said it’s almost ready! The box from the outside will look exactly the same. But as the title explains, one connection from the box goes into your fuel rail, and other connection goes into your turbo, while your original fuel rail & turbo connectors from your car's ECU feeds into the box. Another thing to note is that the new box will not need a seperate connection to your car's battery, as it will draw power from the power rail that the OE fuel rail connector already has itself! So, fuel control is a given, turbo boost is optional if your car can support it. More on this later...

The hardware inside the box is a little different from the original Dieseltronic box, as it has to now process/compute more, and now has to control both fuelling and turbo boost. The software that powers the box has been rewritten from scratch, and is even more intelligent. This time, since there are 2 parameters to play with, they're going to ensure that the fuelling maps and the turbo boost maps feed data into each other, and decisions are made on the fly with the help of their existing Adaptive Self Learning algorithms.

Going into a little bit of detail:
The easiest call for them would have been to keep the fuel maps the same as the old box, and just control boost separately, so this way they won't have to re-write/re-invent too much. But instead of taking this easy way out, they're going to ensure that fuelling and turbo boost settings are controlled in a way that they complement each other, and co-exist together. Depending on engine rpm, engine load and what your car's original ECU demands from the fuel rail and the turbo, the new box will analyze all this and make decisions on what should go to the fuel rail and turbo instead. This means, if you’re light on the throttle, the fuelling and boost will compliment that; if you push the pedal to the metal, the box will react accordingly & proportionately as well…

Marketing:
They're still deciding if this box will be called something new, or if it will carry on with the Dieseltronic family name. This one's obviously more expensive to produce, and they've invested a lot of work into re-architecting their software, so they're still not sure how much more they should price it at. They might even consider discontinuing the old box when this new one is ready for mass production, and this might just become the new Dieseltronic box -2 channel this time, but at the same price so they can be aggressive about pushing this to a larger audience. Only time will tell, I’m just speculating from what little info they’re willing to give me at this juncture about pricing.

The good news:
They're already testing it in a few cars, and this box will maximum benefit all vehicles that have an electronically controlled turbo (i.e. your ECU should be controlling the turbo). All Variable Geometry Turbo equipped cars have electronically controlled turbochargers, so they will all benefit. Some of the Fixed Geometry Turbo equipped cars can benefit from the box too as they're electronically controlled, but some of the other FGT equipped cars don't have an electronically driven turbo, so such cars will not benefit from the turbo boost (they won't even connect it), but will still benefit from the fuel maps. And to top it all off, you'll still have your Economy, Stock, P1 and P2 modes working with the new box as well through the remote, except this time, P1 will have a setting for both fuel + turbo (and will likely to be as powerful as a fuel only P2 from the existing Dieseltronic box), while the new P2 with aggressive fuelling and turbo boost control will take the gains from a simple tuning box to another level!

Net gain:
From what they explained, any ECU remap comprises on re-calibrating fuel delivery, turbo boost and injector timings. With this new tuning box, they're controlling fuel delivery and turbo boost, while retaining your stock injector timings. Meaning, you're going to get very close to the absolute power gains of a remap. In some cars, they believe they can achieve what a remap can, in others, as close to 90~95%. This is while retaining the benefits of this being an external plug'n'play solution, that you can remove yourself (just 2 connectors) before dropping your car off for service; they will never know you had connected a tuning box and so you get to keep your warranty. Contrast this to a remap which can be detected by your car's service station if they plug in and do a diagnostic on your ECU, and your warranty is immediately void. For my car, they estimate I can go upto 125~130 BHP with the new box (right now, my P2 is @ 116 BHP)

So, if you're looking to pick up a RD Dieseltronic box for your diesel car, I'd suggest you wait for a little while longer as a newer box is on the way ;-), though I don’t know exactly how soon they will launch. This is as much as I could gather, hope this helps!

Last edited by kryptonite : 8th July 2012 at 15:31.
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Old 8th July 2012, 15:48   #2
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I hope the VGT used in Grande Punto 90 is electronically controlled.

Will be definitely looking for performance upgrades after the initial few services are done with!

As I understand from your posts, this seems to offer all benefits of remapping, but in a piggy back package. Right?
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Old 8th July 2012, 17:08   #3
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Default Re: Scoop! Race Dynamics is preparing a dual channel Diesel tuning box

If this box can fully control the air delivery then this is the only piggy back box one should ever contemplate on owning. Either a remap or this box nothing else will do.
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Old 9th July 2012, 02:33   #4
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Default Re: Scoop! Race Dynamics is preparing a dual channel Diesel tuning box

Thanks for this thread ! I will now wait for this to be launched. I am sure, getting the turbo controlled by the box will definitely make more sense than the fuel only box !
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Old 9th July 2012, 10:35   #5
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Default Re: Scoop! Race Dynamics is preparing a dual channel Diesel tuning box

What offers does he have for the existing customers to upgrade to this set up? I bet you would have asked about it :-)
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Old 9th July 2012, 19:58   #6
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Default Re: Scoop! Race Dynamics is preparing a dual channel Diesel tuning box

Somewhat does Race Dynamics have a box for Figo? If yes how much is it?
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Old 10th July 2012, 23:21   #7
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Default Re: Scoop! Race Dynamics is preparing a dual channel Diesel tuning box

Quote:
Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR View Post
I hope the VGT used in Grande Punto 90 is electronically controlled.

As I understand from your posts, this seems to offer all benefits of remapping, but in a piggy back package. Right?
Yes, and yes

Quote:
Originally Posted by drpullockaran View Post
If this box can fully control the air delivery then this is the only piggy back box one should ever contemplate on owning. Either a remap or this box nothing else will do.
Definitely. Couldn't agree more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ahmed View Post
Thanks for this thread ! I will now wait for this to be launched. I am sure, getting the turbo controlled by the box will definitely make more sense than the fuel only box !
You're welcome buddy! Glad I was able to consolidate this info when I met them recently

Quote:
Originally Posted by scofield View Post
What offers does he have for the existing customers to upgrade to this set up? I bet you would have asked about it :-)
I did, but they said its too early to decide about this as yet. Will speak to them in more detail again the next time for sure...

Quote:
Originally Posted by itsgeox View Post
Somewhat does Race Dynamics have a box for Figo? If yes how much is it?
Of course, they have boxes for all CDRI engines. The hardware processor in the box is the same for all, but the wiring harness is detailed for every car model/engine differently, and the fuel maps are tuned differently as well for every car model/engine, after analyzing the engine's weaknesses and areas of torque/power improvement. Their Dieseltronic box is sold at Rs.20,000 for all cars.

Last edited by kryptonite : 10th July 2012 at 23:23.
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Old 25th July 2012, 15:16   #8
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Default Re: Scoop! Race Dynamics is preparing a dual channel Diesel tuning box

I'm the only Polo TDi owner contemplating a tuning box on this forum i guess, does it work on the Polo diesel given its only a 3cyl unit ?
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Old 26th July 2012, 11:05   #9
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Default Re: Scoop! Race Dynamics is preparing a dual channel Diesel tuning box

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Originally Posted by shashank.nk View Post
I'm the only Polo TDi owner contemplating a tuning box on this forum i guess, does it work on the Polo diesel given its only a 3cyl unit ?
Yup, I just checked with them and they confirmed the same box works. Feel free to call their office and contact Karthik or Pavan
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Old 26th July 2012, 12:26   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kryptonite

Yup, I just checked with them and they confirmed the same box works. Feel free to call their office and contact Karthik or Pavan
Thanks for the info ! I spoke to pavan and he said one can expect 30% improvement over stock in P2 mode, which is more than what I want.

Have you noticed any change in the driveability and has the engine noise increased with the box ?
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Old 26th July 2012, 14:20   #11
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Default Re: Scoop! Race Dynamics is preparing a dual channel Diesel tuning box

Quote:
Originally Posted by shashank.nk View Post
Thanks for the info ! I spoke to pavan and he said one can expect 30% improvement over stock in P2 mode, which is more than what I want.

Have you noticed any change in the driveability and has the engine noise increased with the box ?
In P1, no increase in noise. In p2, there might be a slight increase in noise due to the higher combustion pressures in the engine. My current P1 is as high as I could go without any extra engine noise (its something between P1 and P2)

Drivability will improve. If your car doesn't have turbo lag, then it will feel punchier and sportier through the entire range. If you do have turbo lag, it will go away to a large extent with the box, and will feel more responsive and drivable

Last edited by kryptonite : 26th July 2012 at 14:22.
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Old 26th July 2012, 16:44   #12
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My car has lots of lag,will be very happy if the box gets rid of most of it.

I've a lot of questions on the box, I'll come over to your thread and post there
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Old 4th October 2012, 17:46   #13
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Default Re: Scoop! Race Dynamics is preparing a dual channel Diesel tuning box

Whats the status of this Dual Channel box?
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Old 13th October 2012, 12:56   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amit_mechengg
Whats the status of this Dual Channel box?
Called them today, the box is under testing in multiple cars, and could go production in few months from now.
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Old 31st October 2012, 10:23   #15
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Default Re: Scoop! Race Dynamics is preparing a dual channel Diesel tuning box

Quote:
Originally Posted by amit_mechengg View Post
Whats the status of this Dual Channel box?
Quote:
Originally Posted by drpullockaran View Post
If this box can fully control the air delivery then this is the only piggy back box one should ever contemplate on owning. Either a remap or this box nothing else will do.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kryptonite View Post
Called them today, the box is under testing in multiple cars, and could go production in few months from now.
I guess this thread missed an important update (which came in the Cruze thread). The box for Cruze is ready and RD team had asked our BHP'ian drpullockaran to try it out.

Here is the post.
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/modifi...ml#post2931349 (More power from the Cruze: 466Nm torque.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by drpullockaran View Post
Finally Race Dynamics have developed the only piggy back box in the world that controls boost pressure in VGT equipped crdi engines like the Cruze. Its either this box or a remap and nothing else. FGT equipped vehicles can continue with the old box with waste gate tweaks. Here I copy paste the communications I had with Race Dynamics via email. The last post has come first.
""""

Dear Dr. Sunil,

With regards to your enquiry regarding DieselTRONIC with boost control for your Cruze, Our Dual Channel ECU with On-board Boost control is ready and we are keen to give you a unit to try out.

As clarified earlier, the Dual Channel Version of DieselTRONIC is fully compatible with your VGT equipped Cruze and will take control over boost pressure as an addition to the 4 Maps switchable via remote. Do let us know if you are interested and we shall send across a unit to you.

Regards,

RaceDynamics Support Team


On Aug 15, 2012, at 6:02 PM, Pullockaran C Sunil wrote:

Dear RDTEAM,
Unfortunately the Cruze only has a Variable Geometry Trubo and does not have a waste gate. I will have to give this one a miss then. Bye for now and hope you do develop a unit compatible with VGT turbo.
Regards.
P.C.Sunil.

On Tue, Aug 14, 2012 at 6:28 PM, sales@racedynamics.in <sales@racedynamics.in> wrote:
Dear Dr. Sunil,

The latest version of our DieselTRONIC Range of Tuning Boxes will have on-board boost control for CRDI Engines equipped with an Electronic Wastegate. The unit is ready and will be available very shortly. The pricing is yet to be finalised though it should cost around Rs. 25,000. It will have all previous features including our patented Adaptive Self Learning Technology as well as four wirelessly switchable maps on the fly.
We will keep you posted and let you know when it will be available for you to try if you are interested.

Regards,

RD Team


"On one of the auto enthusiast website I came across an article which mentioned that you are developing an ECU that takes control of turbo pressure of crdi engines. Flooding the Cruze engine with more fuel without increased oxygen is asking for trouble in an already over fueled Cruze engine. If its true how long would we have to wait before the unit sees light of day. Please do mention the approximate price plus or minus 3000 rupees if that unit is being actively developed by you. Please do send a reply to my email address too."""
Doc, did they sent it across? Eagerly waiting for this product to come out.

Last edited by CrAzY dRiVeR : 31st October 2012 at 10:24.
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