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Old 20th November 2012, 16:11   #31
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Default Re: Snap vs heavy steering

Quote:
Originally Posted by ascertain View Post
Just to clarify @rajshenoy's point - I am sure it was a steering lock and not just a heaviness in handling the steering - reason being that if I tried to turn the steering in any direction, it would encounter a 'snap resistance' with even a 10-15 degree turn of the steering wheel on either side. I mean it just wouldn't go anywhere beyond that point. So that is a 'locked' steering right?
Agree with you. This sounds different from heavy steering when power assist goes(in that case we can still operate the steering since vehicle is not stationary)

Do keep us updated on how the problem gets resolved
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Old 20th November 2012, 16:41   #32
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Default Re: Ford Figo's dangerous behaviour : Steering locks on the move!

If true this can be the most dreaded situation one can imagine being in the driver's seat. Approaching a curve with a locked steering..! Something similar discussed in Accidents thread, an Ertiga losing control.
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Old 20th November 2012, 17:38   #33
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Default Re: Ford Figo's dangerous behaviour : Steering locks on the move!

The same engine used in Fiesta classic does not have this issues(observed in 3 such cars).

So is the software different for fiesta classic and the figo?
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Old 21st November 2012, 21:11   #34
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Arrow Update -3

I got a call from the service engineer from Cauvery Ford Mysore.

I was told that he had gone through my mail to Ford, and wanted the exact details of the problem. I explained the entire incident, and was asked to bring in my car for a check-up so that the issue could be 'closed'. The appointment is scheduled for Friday.

I had earlier asked Cauvery Ford to specifically not mark my complaint as 'closed' or 'resolved' because I want answers and assurance.

What do all the members of Team-BHP think?. Is it enough to go in for the check up and get the case closed and hope the issue wont creep up again?. Or should I ask for a reply from Ford India, detailing the exact problem, and assurance that the problem won't recur?.

If we are to get the thing clarified - that is- is there something wrong with the Figo you just bought using your hard earned money - needs to be followed through, and explanations have to be sought.

Please provide a show of support, and that includes posts on this topic, as I have already sent the link for this post to Ford India. They need to see how many of us feel strongly about this.
Also do communicate with your engine numbers( all those who have had this problem) so that we can all help Ford India figure out whether it is indeed something wrong with a particular batch of Figos.
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Old 21st November 2012, 22:10   #35
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Default Re: Ford Figo's dangerous behaviour : Steering locks on the move!

I had a similar experience twice during my early ownership. My Figo Titanium TDCi is Jan 2011 model and I am not new to diesels. My other car is a Scorpio 2.6 CRDe. The incident for me occurred during slowing down and down shifting to second gear, once for traffic and the other time for a speed breaker. Luckily it was a straight road and the heavy steering and wooden brake pedal was scary but not dangerous. I think I have unconsciously adapted to keeping revs high during downshifting and using half clutch to avoid this. I have not had the problem again.
The heavy drag of diesel, the lighter weight of Figo and the safety feature to prevent double starter makes it a bit difficult to get the vehicle going on the roll. Also, since the problem occurs at low speed, the vehicle does not have the momentum to keep the engine rotating.

I am not aware of the ECU Update currently on the car and have not made any explicit request for an update.
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Old 21st November 2012, 22:36   #36
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Default Re: Ford Figo's dangerous behaviour : Steering locks on the move!

The steering getting locked or even stiff while on the move is a really serious issue which Ford has to get to the bottom of it, at the earliest, than closing the issue.

Some of us have pointed out that the ECU may not be recognizing the key is in its place. If that was the case, won't the steering be locked altogether? Here, the steering is continually able to be moved with power assistance (?) for 10-15 degree but no more. But, if it is a purely mechanical or rust issue, as found by Cauvery Ford, why does it not happen frequently? And why should the engine light come up when this happens? I'm confused. The dealer or the manufacturer is bound to give a satisfactory explanation to the owner's apprehension on such a serious issue.
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Old 22nd November 2012, 00:05   #37
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Default Re: Ford Figo's dangerous behaviour : Steering locks on the move!

This is indeed a scary situation, and as you might have read in the other thread that I had initiated long back, I too faced this problem and was luckily saved from a potential accident situation because it happened when I was taking a sharp turn.

But the difference in this case, compared to mine, and several others, is that here the engine is still running when this happened while in our cases, the engine would just die leaving us without a steering or brake assistance. It was/is a common issue with TDCi Figo and Ford had released a TSB long back to update the firmware on the affected vehicles. My car is running fine after that, actually even before that, since they replaced 2 injectors and my car has not stalled since then.

Do keep updating the thread with your communication with Ford.
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Old 22nd November 2012, 00:21   #38
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Default Re: Ford Figo's dangerous behaviour : Steering locks on the move!

Aren't these power steerings speed sensitive? I mean, isn't the "power" in power steering supposed to increase as speed decreases? It just seems to me that the ECU is not able to handle the transition when decelarating.
Of course, above is just pure hypothesis.
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Old 22nd November 2012, 00:31   #39
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Default Re: Update -3

Quote:
Originally Posted by ascertain View Post
I got a call from the service engineer from Cauvery Ford Mysore.

I was told that he had gone through my mail to Ford, and wanted the exact details of the problem. I explained the entire incident, and was asked to bring in my car for a check-up so that the issue could be 'closed'. The appointment is scheduled for Friday.

I had earlier asked Cauvery Ford to specifically not mark my complaint as 'closed' or 'resolved' because I want answers and assurance.

What do all the members of Team-BHP think?. Is it enough to go in for the check up and get the case closed and hope the issue wont creep up again?. Or should I ask for a reply from Ford India, detailing the exact problem, and assurance that the problem won't recur?.

If we are to get the thing clarified - that is- is there something wrong with the Figo you just bought using your hard earned money - needs to be followed through, and explanations have to be sought.

Please provide a show of support, and that includes posts on this topic, as I have already sent the link for this post to Ford India. They need to see how many of us feel strongly about this.
Also do communicate with your engine numbers( all those who have had this problem) so that we can all help Ford India figure out whether it is indeed something wrong with a particular batch of Figos.

Please go ahead. This is not an issue to be "closed". If Figo diesel has a problem, Ford will solve it. They ought to.

Figo is such a beautiful car and we need to be assured about this. I am sure Ford will do it.
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Old 22nd November 2012, 00:59   #40
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Default Re: Ford Figo's dangerous behaviour : Steering locks on the move!

A note: The ECM does not make the steering lock. The steering lock in the Ford Figo is purely mechanical. It also has nothing to with the engine.
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Old 22nd November 2012, 10:31   #41
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Default Re: Update -3

Do take your car to the service center & let them analyze it. Don't let them make your car a guinea pig, but make sure you give them some time to find the root cause of the problem.

Also, I would urge you to get all the communication with Ford & the workshops in writing. Send them emails & demand answers on emails. Even in case of a verbal conversation, draft it all into an email & send an update to Ford's official customer care address (while keeping the dealer/workshop marked in cc) where you must be having a complaint/case number. If not, get a case number from Ford India.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ascertain View Post
I got a call from the service engineer from Cauvery Ford Mysore.

I was told that he had gone through my mail to Ford, and wanted the exact details of the problem. I explained the entire incident, and was asked to bring in my car for a check-up so that the issue could be 'closed'. The appointment is scheduled for Friday.

I had earlier asked Cauvery Ford to specifically not mark my complaint as 'closed' or 'resolved' because I want answers and assurance.

What do all the members of Team-BHP think?. Is it enough to go in for the check up and get the case closed and hope the issue wont creep up again?. Or should I ask for a reply from Ford India, detailing the exact problem, and assurance that the problem won't recur?.

If we are to get the thing clarified - that is- is there something wrong with the Figo you just bought using your hard earned money - needs to be followed through, and explanations have to be sought.

Please provide a show of support, and that includes posts on this topic, as I have already sent the link for this post to Ford India. They need to see how many of us feel strongly about this.
Also do communicate with your engine numbers( all those who have had this problem) so that we can all help Ford India figure out whether it is indeed something wrong with a particular batch of Figos.
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Old 22nd November 2012, 10:36   #42
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Default Re: Ford Figo's dangerous behaviour : Steering locks on the move!

This issue should not be "closed" or "resolved". Ford India should get to the root cause of it. Just imagine, with the number of Figo's being sold here, and the very small number of those are members here, how great would the impact be even if just 5% of the cars have this defect (if it is indeed a defect). Ford should investigate and give an explanation.
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Old 22nd November 2012, 14:50   #43
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Default Re: Ford Figo's dangerous behaviour : Steering locks on the move!

For GODS SAKE. Did they check the ignition Key switch / steering lock mechanism before going further into steering column and ECU and rust and fluids and what ever.

For a steering lock the first thing to check is the lock mechanism!
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Old 23rd November 2012, 10:29   #44
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Default Update-4

Todays appointment with Cauvery ford was postponed to tomorrow upon request of the service engineer.
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Old 27th November 2012, 19:17   #45
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Arrow Re: Ford Figo's dangerous behaviour : Steering locks on the move!

As per the scheduled appointment with Cauvery Ford- went to the service center at 11 AM on Saturday. Met the Service engineer Mr.Raghavendra- who was a pleasant gentleman.

I was yet again asked about the 'exact' nature of my problem, and after listening to the issue, the Engineer suggested the car records be inspected and the IDS (Diagnostic Software) run again.

The engineer was of the opinion that the steering would be 'heavy' rather than 'locked' which I again corrected (As I already described in this post)- saying it was indeed locked - but either way it was dangerous. I also described the warning lights coming on during the incidents.

The car was taken into the workshop, where another technical expert ran the IDS. I again described the problem to him, and also told him about the similar issues faced by Figo users elsewhere. He agreed that it was indeed a serious problem- and that he would check the software to see if there was any problem.

I asked him about the version of the ECU software that was presently in the car- and he said it was v81.05, which was the latest released by Ford for the Figo.

He ran the diagnostics- and told me what I already knew - that there was no issue! (This was already told to me by the executives after I had taken the car there previously ). So I asked him if the issue was 'mechanical' rather than with the software, and was told that it could be a possibility, and that I should bring in the vehicle next time it happened.

I again asked him about the ECU software - whether it would be possible to check what version of the software had been installed in my car when it was manufactured- and was told it wasn't possible from his end, but probably Ford India would have those details. I also asked him about the history of my car's ECU updates carried out during the servicing sessions- and again was told that it wasn't possible. I wonder- shouldn't there be a log/history file in the car's computer?

The technician then proceeded to erase the ECU software off, and re-installed the same version (v81.05). I was told that sometimes the ECU would not 'take' up the update if it was not newer- but here again I told him that I understood that he had merely erased and re-installed the software, and no 'update' was applied- to which he agreed. I told him not to 'close' the complaint file, and make sure that the issue was intimated to Ford India. He said that was under the service engineer's purview.

The Service engineer then came and suggested we take a test drive- now that all problems would have be solved. I asked him two questions regarding the ECU software
1) Was he aware of any problems with the ECU software (previous versions)
2) Was my car ECU 'updated' during the last service.
The answers to both these queries were emphatic 'No's.

So I had some points clear

1)The Ford service in Mysore had no intimation from Ford India nor any clue about the nature of the problem.
2)The Faults in my car had occurred with the Same version of ECU software (v81.05)- since no 'updation' was ever done (as per the service engineer's statement).
3) The steering locking was 'inexplicable';, and had recurred thrice in a span of one month with the vehicle completely normal in-between. in spite of so many customers having similar issues, Ford India was not at all aware of this issue??
4)No one was willing to classify the nature of the problem as either 'mechanical' or 'software related'. If it was mechanical- why was my car normal in between the incidents?.

As I took the test drive with the service engineer- I asked him about his expert opinion, and all I got were 'probable' reasons - i.e software problem/ key problem/ cluster problem.
A drive of 13 Kms did not yield any recurrences, and I again pointed out the period of 'normalcy' between the incidents.
At this point I requested him to give me a document regarding the nature of the works done on my car (with dates) and information about the diagnosis made by the service center. My request was politely declined because those were for 'internal' circulation only, and plus if these faults were due to faulty mechanical parts- then it was upto Ford India to issue such a letter since they were involved in the purchase and manufacturing process (Kind of a catch-22 isn't it?).
I told him that I had nothing against the ford dealership in mysore nor anything against him- and that I was not looking for a legal option till now. I was merely a concerned customer who wanted to know what had been done to his vehicle, and what was wrong with the car. In case some accident happens during my trips due to the same problem - to whom would I tell my problems? - If I don't intimate Ford India about this, they might very well say -" You never told us!" - So I wanted a proper channel in place, and hence had asked for a qualified service engineer to inspect the vehicle first.

It was at this point that I sensed a hint of wariness on the engineer's part. My questions were specific, and he was more careful in answering. I asked him what was the next plan of action- and he told me that he would raise a GCR (Global concern request?) with Ford India and then it would be upto them to solve the problem. I again requested a record of the servicing done to my car (Key barrel replacement and software re-installation), and was told that it would be issued as per the dealership's 'job' file.
The 'job' would be 'closed' but the GCR and the complaint would be kept open until Ford India directed the dealership to close it. I was satisfied with this arrangement- as long as Ford India got an official channel opened on this issue.

Then came the part where the GCR was actually filed. I specifically requested that the facts viz.
1) ECU 're-calibration' and NOT 'updation' was entered.
2) The interval between the incidents (1 month) wherein the vehicle was 'normally functioning' was mentioned.
I was told that Ford India would contact me on Monday and talk to me about the specifics.

Then came the funny part wherein the 'chain of responsibility' was twisted and jangled all the time. The service engineer made the executive sign on the 'authorized signatory' column, and she in turn ran after him to get his signature. He had a wry smile and the statement 'Now everyone is responsible!' came when he signed the document.

I left the service center- amused but not amused.

now waiting for Ford India's communication.
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