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Old 17th May 2008, 15:13   #91
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Originally Posted by khaadu75 View Post
Pulling handbrake is fine but I still advocate the foot brake ... I drive in the hills a lot and sometimes engage the hand brake only during parking . What you need to practise is finding the sweet spot with your car's clutch . I refer to it as the sweet spot as its very important when driving in the hills and if you know that point you will not need the handbrake to start from a standstill even in the steepest of slopes .

Sweet spot is the point where the clutch on being released engages into the gear but there is no forward or backward motion even when on a steep incline/decline .... once you find that spot , all you need to do is press the throttle and release the clutch slowly and you will move forward . If you can learn this then trust me you won't need to use the handbrakes .

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yes, the sweet spot, i have perfeced this art, but still handbrake is a necessity and should be used in hilly regions, i was returning from dharamshala and got stuck in a major traffic jam, it was a very stiff climb where i was stuck, cars ahead were moving at snails pace, it was irritating to change gears and apply brake or use handbrake, so insted of using brake/handbreak i kept may car in 1st gear and little acceleration and cluth lightly pressed, i.e. car wont move ahead or go down. resulted in clutch plate getting hot, there was a foul smell in car and i sensed that i had strained the cluch too much
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Old 17th May 2008, 15:25   #92
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Originally Posted by praveen_v View Post
Sticking religiously to our lane is not a very good idea,IMO when you are in a hairpin and you have the outerlane. If a bus/truck comes to the hairpin at the same time, it will be impossible for it to do the hairpin in the inner-lane(and in all probabilities, he will be in your lane).

Quite a likely scenario. It does happen somtimes.... but...you basically might have to come to a STOP. Then, and only after establishing visual contact with the bus driver, a strategy is decided upon. Invariably the bus manages to complete it's turn WITHOUT you having to switch lanes. And more often than not, you will be able to see/know that a heavy vehicle is coming. You would then be expected to pull over and allow it to pass, particularly if that is the one going uphill.

lane-switching has to be done here so that the car gets into the inner lane giving outer-lane for the heavy vehicle. Of course both the drivers must 'understand' this else will be a disaster!!


Lane changing is something I have never had to do in over three decades of mountain touring! But yes, IF, and only IF, clearly indicated and agreed upon with the bus/lorry driver, yes, do it.
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Old 17th May 2008, 15:51   #93
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Originally Posted by CR-V View Post
4. keep as close as to the mountain side as possible.

CR-V
buddy either you will kill someone or get yourself killed with this kind of driving. You should stick to your side while driving in the mountains.
If the mountainside is the right side of the road, and you stick to it, you are waiting for a head on collision at a blind corner.
So stick to your side always, without exception
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Old 17th May 2008, 16:26   #94
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Originally Posted by vnabhi View Post
Clutch may get affected too while downshifting, say if one shifts to 2nd from 4th at a speed of 50 kmph, and releases the clutch without slowing the vehicle to around 20 kmph.
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Originally Posted by sujaylahiri View Post
downshifting from a higher gear and using the engine brake, you might want to blip the throttle and do a little rev matching. It will also reduce the "jerk" you experience while downshifting and make the shifts a lot smoother and quicker. And that way you also save the synchros and hence the gearbox in the long run.
Yes exactly. Rev matching can be done to reduce the wear on the clutch while downshifting. One way is to blip while pressing the clutch and slot the gear simultaneously. The other way is double de-clutching: press the clutch and slot the gear in neutral and blip, and then again press the clutch to slot into the lower gear.

I am still slow with double de-clutching so I usually use the single de-clutching method to rev match. Besides, I don't think double de-clutching has any specific advantage in cars with synchros. Other gurus can clarify this point!
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Old 17th May 2008, 16:36   #95
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Arrow Signal Clearly.....

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Originally Posted by anupmathur View Post
Lane changing is something I have never had to do in over three decades of mountain touring! But yes, IF, and only IF, clearly indicated and agreed upon with the bus/lorry driver, yes, do it.
I agree with AM, only after being clear on mountain roads should one change lane. Usually what I have seen is that Lorry / Bus drivers indicate with their hand where they want you to go on a steep hill, Uturn.. if it's a out of town regn., they too are extra careful knowing the perils of a mis-understanding.

I've experienced this on the Mettupalayam Ooty, ooth -Mysore stretch, Palani -Kodai stretch where local buses ply regularly. This happened on the Uttranchal roads too.

If the oncoming driver is not signaling with his hand, you MUST wave with you hand indicating clearly your preference to switching lane. Most accidents are a result of communication gap.

--Ramky
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Last edited by ramkya1 : 17th May 2008 at 16:43.
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Old 17th May 2008, 17:28   #96
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Originally Posted by watashi75 View Post
Yes exactly. Rev matching can be done to reduce the wear on the clutch while downshifting. One way is to blip while pressing the clutch and slot the gear simultaneously. The other way is double de-clutching: press the clutch and slot the gear in neutral and blip, and then again press the clutch to slot into the lower gear.

I am still slow with double de-clutching so I usually use the single de-clutching method to rev match. Besides, I don't think double de-clutching has any specific advantage in cars with synchros. Other gurus can clarify this point!
When you say 'blip', I suppose you mean pressing the accelerator a bit so that there is no unusual increase in engine rpm when you release the clutch, am I right?
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Old 17th May 2008, 18:08   #97
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Originally Posted by vnabhi View Post
When you say 'blip', I suppose you mean pressing the accelerator a bit so that there is no unusual increase in engine rpm when you release the clutch, am I right?
Yes, that is right. Of course the rev match won't be exact always but the jerk will be very less.

OT: Off topic but I feel this info might be helpful to some of us. Rev matching can also make up-shifting smoother. Generally when we up-shift we remove the accelerator leg completely. So the engine RPM usually falls to idle speed by the time we engage the clutch. Instead of completely removing the leg from the accelerator if we keep it slightly pressed so that the RPM is a little above idle speed the clutch engages more smoothly.
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Old 17th May 2008, 20:18   #98
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I am not too sure how to reply to this. I feel after some years of driving, the right gear for the terrain, use of brake, clutch and accelerator, distance from the vehicle ahead, and above all, the speed, all become instinctive and one does not consciously analyze it until some emergency like the one mentioned takes place.
I have spoken to and observed quite a few people, and find that the drivers who were the smoothest invariably had the best passenger comfort, the best mileage and the longest brake life. They also used the engine braking a lot, used the engine throughout the rev-band, never slogged the engine, and were drivers with a lot of anticipation.
Just putting out my 2 bits....
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Old 17th May 2008, 20:28   #99
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Thanks You for replying
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Old 17th May 2008, 20:32   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CR-V View Post
4. keep as close as to the mountain side as possible.
CR-V
I hope you never driving in my part of the woods .. coz if the hill is on your right side and you sticking close to the mountain and i come from the front - Im sure to stop and give you a mouthful

Stick to your side irrespective of which side is the drop ... and if you scared of going over , then just don't go driving into the hills and be a hazard to others .

Cheers
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Old 18th May 2008, 09:58   #101
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Originally Posted by watashi75 View Post
Yes exactly. Rev matching can be done to reduce the wear on the clutch while downshifting. One way is to blip while pressing the clutch and slot the gear simultaneously. The other way is double de-clutching: press the clutch and slot the gear in neutral and blip, and then again press the clutch to slot into the lower gear.

I am still slow with double de-clutching so I usually use the single de-clutching method to rev match. Besides, I don't think double de-clutching has any specific advantage in cars with synchros. Other gurus can clarify this point!
I always thought that the best way was to slow down to a speed which matches the gear you are changing to, so if you were going downhill at 50kmph and need to slowdown because of a curve or something which you want to do at 20 kmph, slow down before reaching the curve, take your foot off the accelerator and dab the brakes...and when you are around 20kmph..change to 2nd gear and move on.

Why race the engine while pressing the clutch? and anyway I think if you press the clutch.. the engine braking and control is lost and could result in increased speed while going downhill ? Can you explain?
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Old 18th May 2008, 10:56   #102
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Originally Posted by Shankyz View Post
I always thought that the best way was to slow down to a speed which matches the gear you are changing to, so if you were going downhill at 50kmph and need to slowdown because of a curve or something which you want to do at 20 kmph, slow down before reaching the curve, take your foot off the accelerator and dab the brakes...and when you are around 20kmph..change to 2nd gear and move on.?
What you have said is true but we want to make use of the engine for braking to reduce our speed to 20kmph in the first place. Hence we need to engage the 2nd gear when the speed is still high. Another scenario when we need to engage a lower gear at a high speed is during overtaking.

Using heel and toe technique we can also press the brakes and simultaneously do rev matching to switch to a lower gear.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shankyz View Post
Why race the engine while pressing the clutch? and anyway I think if you press the clutch.. the engine braking and control is lost and could result in increased speed while going downhill ? Can you explain?
It does not result in increased speed, since the clutch is engaged when the transmission speed matches the engine RPM. The engine braking comes into effect once you remove your leg from the accelerator after engaging the clutch. This way the engine braking comes into effect probably a fraction of a second later but you won't feel the jerk.

Hope experts like khaadu75 can provide more details on the practical aspect!

There is a nice article in this forum itself on these driving techniques - http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/collec...e-driving.html
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Old 18th May 2008, 11:00   #103
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During Uphill, when you take the Hair pin bend, do you swap the normal traffic rule of driving on left to moving on right?

Last time when I was going to Kodaikannal, most vehicles and buses made move to right just before the hair pin bend so that the downhill vehicles get maximum radius to turn.

Sorry if this is !!
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Old 18th May 2008, 11:37   #104
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Originally Posted by mhafeez_13666 View Post
During Uphill, when you take the Hair pin bend, do you swap the normal traffic rule of driving on left to moving on right?

Last time when I was going to Kodaikannal, most vehicles and buses made move to right just before the hair pin bend so that the downhill vehicles get maximum radius to turn.

Sorry if this is !!
its not off topic, but this question has been answered in this thread itself.
best to stop both vehicles, wait for an explicit signal(usually from the bus or the truck) agree on it, then proceed slowly. it is not done on every hairpin. only if the turning radius of the bus cant handle that particular turn.

always stick to your lane. always
except when agreed clearly by the two drivers involved

Last edited by rippergeo : 18th May 2008 at 11:38.
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Old 18th May 2008, 11:56   #105
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Thank you Sir! You are on spot, last time during my trip, the Bus driver stoppped and asked me to come right and then move.
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