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Old 24th July 2013, 14:57   #46
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Default Re: Horrible BMW 520d ownership experience. Many issues, including brake failure!

It seems like you received a lemon. You should have demanded that they replace the car with a brand new one instead of settling for replacement of these components. You should have refused to take the car back and only accepted a new one. While you would be frustrated, you could have taken better steps when they said the engine needed replacement. I guess now you are stuck with your particular car. As Akshay rightly said, you must use your car more. It is not good for these cars to just let them stand still and various issues relating to suspension, moisture, etc come up. I also feel the dealer should themselves accept it as a lemon and get a new car since such major issues do not come up in such short a time, even for german cars. And for those drawing up comparisons with Skoda, . I'm not supporting the brand in any way. This is a one-off incident and not what most Skoda's are like. It is very easy to point fingers and criticize, but how many people actually come up with some constructive solutions?
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Old 24th July 2013, 15:16   #47
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Default Re: Horrible BMW 520d ownership experience. Many issues, including brake failure!

thanks vats, but how can I sue the car when its not with me most of the time. n 6 months f woownership, it has spend more than 2.5 months collectively in the BMW garage
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Old 24th July 2013, 15:41   #48
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Default Re: Horrible BMW 520d ownership experience. Many issues, including brake failure!

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Originally Posted by Bharat Acharya View Post
Thanks guys... I have posted this on several consumer forums! Hoping to make everyone aware of the treatment BMW gives to its customers! I wont let them wash their hand off this case so easily.



I did that, but Mr Sameer Jain (BMW INDIA WESTERN AFTER SALES HEAD) categorically denied it! As I said, i was left with no other option but to take back the car!

Bharat I understand your plight. I have a loosely related experience recently not in a car but a watch. I had bought myself a Tag Heuer Carrera nearly 2L) from Ethos and within a month the movement of a swiss watch went bust. I contacted the dealer and the service station, and they kept telling me it may be the battery (since it was a quartz), then after I took the watch to the dealer, he realized that they do not have the proper tools even to open this model. So they sent it to the service station (which thankfully is in Delhi and quite near, which meant that I could get quick turnarounds). Well they realized that the movement had broken, and after keeping the watch for 3 days and replacing the movement sent it back to me. I was at this point also agonizing and complaining how can it go wrong on a swizz world renowned watch maker, but had to accept the replaced movement in my old watch.

Then another 3 weeks the watch breaks down again, this time I had understood my past mistakes and I knew the decision maker id the head of LVMH here or the LVMH customer care head in Switzerland. I by then had done some research and located both these gentlemen on Linkedin. And this is when I wrote to them and also pasted the links of the complaints I had put on the public forums like FB, twitter, etc. But, they offered me an extended warranty of the watch of one more year again with a 2nd time replaced new movement, and in the process they had also managed to mark the saphire glass. On my complaint about the glass they also replaced one, but refused to replace the watch as like cars these are serial numbered and imported by paying duties, which cant be reversed. And a new replacement will mean duties once again. Also since I had already registered the serial no. on their website, they will not be able to sell this again. So it will become a dead inventory.

But this time I refused to take the delivery. They tried several times at my home and my office, but I just refused. In the midst I even had a very heated conversation with one of their french colleagues sitting in the HO, where he categorically told me that they will not replace it, as it is against policy. He was quite rude (as french can be) and I gave him a proper bashing and told him off to not think of Indian customers as a door mat.
After a week, the India head wrote to me and called me personally to apologize and asked me to chose another watch from their line-up within the same price range. As I really didnt like any other in the same price bracket, I refused the offer and asked for a complete refund, to be sent to my home. They took additional 3 days, but had to comply and give me a cash refund.

I know this is much more complicated with a car and easier said than done. But, as I have seen from other experiences as well, you have to refuse their offer (in your case the returned car) and reach the right man who has the authority to take such decisions. Since there are huge cost implications and paperwork requirement they will try to avoid it at all levels.

And as someone here have pointed out, I had no way to know if they have repaired or replaced the movement (in your case the engine), but you must have the proper paperwork included the changed engine no. on your RC to accommodate the change in the engine. Along with the start of the warranty for the said engine from that day!

It is an ordeal that I went through, which can be very stressful. And true there are lemons that find their way to the consumer even from the best OEMs. There is no way to avoid them, but by way of communication and handling these scenarios you can develop a relationship in these companies so that from now on you get the attention that you deserve from them.

All the best!
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Old 24th July 2013, 16:25   #49
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Default Re: Horrible BMW 520d ownership experience. Many issues, including brake failure!

Pretty disgusting experience to have to pay 50 lacs for a car, then be afraid to drive the bloody thing, since the brakes might fail, or the engine might conk off, or the car might not start at all.

And then, fight with the company for a replacement, then fight in the courts, pay the lawyers and waste your hard earned time, when you could have been doing much more enjoyable stuff instead, like driving your 50 lac car.

Hmmm, what a shame! Only in India.
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Old 24th July 2013, 18:00   #50
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Default Re: Horrible BMW 520d ownership experience. Many issues, including brake failure!

This was the reply from BMW Director After Sales (India)

BMW Reply .pdf
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Old 24th July 2013, 18:27   #51
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Default Re: Horrible BMW 520d ownership experience. Many issues, including brake failure!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bharat Acharya View Post
This was the reply from BMW Director After Sales (India)

Attachment 1116038
A standard reply. Please do stick to your stand of a 5 year BSI package, and if nothing else an extended warranty on the car. I think you should write back to them that something like the brakes failing is not something you can take lightly, and unless they are willing to give you warranty or BSI that you will not have any confidence in the brand.
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Old 24th July 2013, 18:44   #52
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Default Re: Horrible BMW 520d ownership experience. Many issues, including brake failure!

A disgusting experience followed by an equally disgusting response :

Quote:
Further, we would like to assure you that your vehicle shall be returned to you only when it is completely restored to service standard.
If thats the case, then BMW India should take liability and refund you the EMI amount that you are paying (if any) for this car as long as it is in their possession.

Quote:
Please note that a replacement or refund cannot be considered , as your BMW vehicle is six months old and has run over a thousand kilometers
If thats the case, you should ask them whats their clause / condition on a replacement / refund. Do they have a set rule for the number of months / kms covered to consider a replacement / refund. In 6 months a car would easily cover in more than 3-4000 kms - 1500 kms is just run-in.

Quote:
and has been registered under your name.
Does BMW India expect that a person buys a car without registering it under his name to consider a replacement / refund ??

You deserve a replacement or a refund - nothing less.
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Old 24th July 2013, 20:50   #53
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Default Re: Horrible BMW 520d ownership experience. Many issues, including brake failure!

I would like to personally see this car.
Where are you situated in Mumbai ?

I have an idea but it will be better to speak in person.

It is good that you have written about this incident as I was thinking about buying a BMW. I am not sure now about my decision. The Sales Team is also horrible so the After Sales can be imagined well.
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Old 24th July 2013, 21:05   #54
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You have a solid case on hand to pull them to consumer court. Catch hold of a good lawyer, and I'm sure justice will be done. I still believe in our judicial system.
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Old 24th July 2013, 21:06   #55
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Can't BMW India go out of their way and settle the matter to the customers satisfaction? A customer buying a premium car and being treated like this is not unacceptable.

@BMW manager who has replied above to the owner, if you are reading this let me tell you that this is not how you run business here. You may make profit but Will definitely lose the goodwill factor. Which in turn Will hurt your sales. How much would it cost you to offer a comprehensive 5 year package and restore the customers peace? Its peanuts compared to what you Will be getting back. People Will value you more and Will get more confidence in you. Which in turn Will increase your sales. I am sure you must have learnt about all this in b schools but you don't seem to be doing it. Wake up before its late and give the customer the comprehensive bsi package. It Will atleast show that you have confidence in the products and are willing to support the customer who has put 50 big ones into your bank account. This thread alone is enough to drive away many prospective customers resulting in crores of losses to you. Unless you realise it and take corrective actions soon .

PS. If we go by your terms of car replacement then there is no way you Will give a car replacement! How can a customer drive a non registered car?don't you know its illegal? Argue logically. Not like some crappy uneducated retard.just For the sake of argument
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Old 24th July 2013, 21:13   #56
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Bharat
Make the India head personally liable in a law suit, things will start moving!
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Old 24th July 2013, 22:43   #57
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Default Re: Horrible BMW 520d ownership experience. Many issues, including brake failure!

Quote:
Please note that a replacement or refund cannot be considered , as your BMW vehicle is: Six months old
So cars that are below 6 months would be replaced or considered if the other below points are matched. Guys a BMW are crazy for such a statement.

Quote:
Has run over a thousand kilometres and
1500 kms in 6 months that why NO replacement. I guess BMW officials feel that the customer buys a BMW for a show and to be preserved in the parking lot rather drive around.

If I had been having this car by the end of 6th month it would be around:

116*30 = 3480 kms
3480*6 = 20880 kms

By this the guys at BMW would not have looked into my car saying it has been driven too much.

Quote:
Has been registered under your name
Drive the car with a 'TEMP' plate or an F/R for 6 months expecting the car would be a lemon. After 6 months get the car registered. If caught what should the owner state to the police?

A conversation in police station

Owner: I'm expecting there could be a problem in the car that I have bought and it will not be replaced upon diagnosis of a fault by BMW as it has been registered.

Police Official:

These are utter foolish reasons to be stated by a premium car manufacturer for such a serious issue.

I mean how hard can it be for BMW to accept their fault and give the owner the replacement and close the matter and retain the satisfaction as it would be a good word of mouth to other people who aspire to buy one.

BMW AG is also silent on this issue which is pretty surprising and sad.

One thing beats me is for a brake failure why was the engine replaced? Isn't the ECU to be blamed? I know the engine has a role to play in brake functioning but still.

Mr. Bharat, Get a good lawyer and file a case and scale this issue up including all the guys that you contacted during all this trouble.

Cheers,
Anurag.
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Old 24th July 2013, 22:50   #58
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Bharath,
I agree with cpbopanna on the point. Pull up the India head.
Your case should be on BMW India alone. That way all parties to case will be liable to the courts decision. Go for consumer court. They are quicker in closing cases.
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Old 24th July 2013, 22:58   #59
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Default Re: Horrible BMW 520d ownership experience. Many issues, including brake failure!

What a lemon. BMW has to replace this car with a brand new one and write this off as their incompetent QC fee. BMW has to put itself in the customer shoe and do something right.

I am not sure about others, i personally feel you deserve a replacement car from BMW. But thanks to our dirty politicians you can do nothing about your status unless BMW realize their need to put customer on top and help you here.

Let me post this thread in their BMW fb page and see if that helps.
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Old 24th July 2013, 23:20   #60
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Default Re: Horrible BMW 520d ownership experience. Many issues, including brake failure!

Why is Skoda any worse? Nope really speaking BMW here seems to be going the Skoda way. If this kind of car does not warrant a replacement what does? BMW if it cannot replace the vehicle should have in my view offered a 7 year warranty to the customer for the hardship caused and a 5 year comprehensive maintenance pack should have been part of that.

Am sure the customer would get refund + damages if he sued BMW for this. The clauses mentioned by a company are not the only ones applicable by law.

1500 kms in 6 months being considered used or that it is registered is absurd. The defects are such that one could also sue the company for it being a threat to life.

I do know of examples where companies have managed a full refund for their customers (after a bit of haggling as always) but for much issues that seem to be much more minor.

BMW seems to be loosing the plot. This is a segment where customer experience and word of mouth will matter a lot and they surely can do without this thread going down this path.

Last edited by ACM : 24th July 2013 at 23:26.
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