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Old 12th April 2015, 23:09   #61
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Default Re: Air-con: Center vents throwing out warmer air than side vents?

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Originally Posted by 90Horses View Post
Sorry for the missing text, the difference of 2 C was recorded between left and right central vents, where with the OEM filter the difference was 4 C and increases to 7 C.
So the flow rates for the two filters must be quite different.
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Old 12th April 2015, 23:39   #62
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So the flow rates for the two filters must be quite different.
Yes VCheng, with the new filter, temp difference decreased between central vents & side vents perform better in airflow and temp.

I want to buy a filter from Bosch and see if it could give a better proposition to the OEM filter. This part is very tough to obtain.
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Old 13th April 2015, 03:34   #63
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Default Re: Air-con: Center vents throwing out warmer air than side vents?

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Originally Posted by 90Horses View Post
Yes VCheng, with the new filter, temp difference decreased between central vents & side vents perform better in airflow and temp.

I want to buy a filter from Bosch and see if it could give a better proposition to the OEM filter. This part is very tough to obtain.
Given that the temperature fluctuation between the vents is now known to be due to poor flow rate of the filter, it seems to me that the design of the plenum inside the HVAC box could use a proper baffle or two to ensure proper mixing of the air, but that is too much to expect in this day of cost-cutting to the bare minimum.
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Old 13th April 2015, 07:40   #64
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Default Re: Air-con: Center vents throwing out warmer air than side vents?

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Originally Posted by dhanushs View Post
IMO, your diagnosis is correct.

I have a friend who's Thar has had the exact same issue, and it still has. Whenever you come back from from hot setting to cold setting, the driver side vents starts acting up. However, in the Thar, turning the knob few times back anf forth, does the trick, and he hasn't visited the service center (Well, there's no point ).

Please ask the A.S.S guys to sort out the diverter valve issue.
In Thar Crde theres a valve which opens and closes the coolant flow to the cabin which runs thru the heater coil to give hot air in winter.Normally people don't uses it for years or v rarely.

So coolant with pressure is always near the valve and get saturated there forms powder and sludge in due course.So when ever it get opens the valve doesnt close back 100% allowing some amount of hot coolant to run thru the system allways. Which in turn make central vents hots.

Option 1.

Seal the coolant pipe, so hot air never works. Cheap and simple.

Option - 2.

Change the valve and use this atleast ones in every week for 10min.

Last edited by Rajith : 13th April 2015 at 07:41.
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Old 13th April 2015, 11:19   #65
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Default Re: Air-con: Center vents throwing out warmer air than side vents?

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In Thar Crde theres a valve which opens and closes the coolant flow to the cabin which runs thru the heater coil to give hot air in winter.Normally people don't uses it for years or v rarely.

So coolant with pressure is always near the valve and get saturated there forms powder and sludge in due course.So when ever it get opens the valve doesnt close back 100% allowing some amount of hot coolant to run thru the system allways. Which in turn make central vents hots.

Option 1.

Seal the coolant pipe, so hot air never works. Cheap and simple.

Option - 2.

Change the valve and use this atleast ones in every week for 10min.
In my car, the HVAC unit has the heating core, evaporator, plumbing etc... that's related to IN-CAR-AC/INDOOR-UNIT comes in as a big huge single piece unit. As part of the diagnosis this unit was replaced under warranty.

After a lot of goose chase, found that issue was with the type of Pollen Filter/Cabin AC filter that FIAT used in my car. I have replaced this filter with other brand filter and results were better than the OEM filter.

FIAT did not inform the customer or dealer about the AC performance dip due to the Pollen Filter change, I will shoot out a mail to the FIAT for the inconvenience and mess that they caused to me.
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Old 13th April 2015, 16:46   #66
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Default Re: Air-con: Center vents throwing out warmer air than side vents?

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Originally Posted by 90Horses View Post
My repeated experiments prove that the quality of air filter used by FIAT is not acceptable by any standards, air filter is supposed to improve quality of air not to change the temperature of the air.
While you have proof and it is proven, I still find it hard to believe the cabin air filter is causing temperature variance between two ducts. If there was one complaint I have, it is the side vents that don't have anywhere the same amount of air flow or volume as the central vents and this is a known issue on pre facelift Fiat's. We are talking of a Delphi filter here so this ain't no cheap cabin air filter. In fact, a lot of them look identical to what Fiat use.

I do not know how many cases there are but this is the first time a fault like this has been reported on Fiat cars.
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Old 13th April 2015, 17:26   #67
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Default Re: Air-con: Center vents throwing out warmer air than side vents?

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While you have proof and it is proven, I still find it hard to believe the cabin air filter is causing temperature variance between two ducts. If there was one complaint I have, it is the side vents that don't have anywhere the same amount of air flow or volume as the central vents and this is a known issue on pre facelift Fiat's. We are talking of a Delphi filter here so this ain't no cheap cabin air filter. In fact, a lot of them look identical to what Fiat use.

I do not know how many cases there are but this is the first time a fault like this has been reported on Fiat cars.
Sandeep, when I replaced the OEM filter with the ZIP filter, I have noticed a 50% improvement in the side vents, before that, the performance of side vents was pathetic.

The airflow is divided into 4 quadrants for 4 vents (see the quadrants in the attached image of my previous post), air from the blower passes through the pollen filter and goes into the corresponding quadrants. Until an year before, FIAT used wire-mesh pollen filter, which had guided quadrants on the filter itself, so the air flow was uniform in all vents. The current pollen filter does not have that setup and air flow can vary from one filter brand to other, depending on several parameters like the materials used, woven pattern etc...

As I already said, ZIP filter was better than DENSO filter (Not Delphi) that FIAT supplied, I am going to procure a BOSCH filter, later that I will let you know the result. All the filters look and feel alike, but how the filter is made and air flow performance of the filter matters here.

I am 100% percent sure, the fault is with filter. Any FIAT Punto/Linea owner can do a quick check, remove the battery terminal, open the glove box, you will find 2 screws that hold Blue&Me, unscrew them and B&M will come down, right behind that there will be a black cover, Pull that cover you will find the Pollen Filter, Remove the Pollen Filter, Reconnect the Battery terminal, Start the car & AC without Pollen Filter. You will feel the car's AC was never better and will never want to put back the Pollen Filter .

I am sure other people might have this issue, but everyone could be in impression that car is not cooling the cabin that well as before!! One more thing, if you are having any unwanted strong smells in your FIAT (Outside smoke etc.. ) which were not there before, then you are on DENSO filter and sure you will have vent temperature difference between central vents and side vents will not be efficient.
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Old 20th April 2015, 15:00   #68
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Default Re: Air-con: Center vents throwing out warmer air than side vents?

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Originally Posted by 90Horses View Post
Sandeep, when I replaced the OEM filter with the ZIP filter, I have noticed a 50% improvement in the side vents, before that, the performance of side vents was pathetic.

The airflow is divided into 4 quadrants for 4 vents (see the quadrants in the attached image of my previous post), air from the blower passes through the pollen filter and goes into the corresponding quadrants. Until an year before, FIAT used wire-mesh pollen filter, which had guided quadrants on the filter itself, so the air flow was uniform in all vents. The current pollen filter does not have that setup and air flow can vary from one filter brand to other, depending on several parameters like the materials used, woven pattern etc...

As I already said, ZIP filter was better than DENSO filter (Not Delphi) that FIAT supplied, I am going to procure a BOSCH filter, later that I will let you know the result. All the filters look and feel alike, but how the filter is made and air flow performance of the filter matters here.

I am 100% percent sure, the fault is with filter. Any FIAT Punto/Linea owner can do a quick check, remove the battery terminal, open the glove box, you will find 2 screws that hold Blue&Me, unscrew them and B&M will come down, right behind that there will be a black cover, Pull that cover you will find the Pollen Filter, Remove the Pollen Filter, Reconnect the Battery terminal, Start the car & AC without Pollen Filter. You will feel the car's AC was never better and will never want to put back the Pollen Filter .

I am sure other people might have this issue, but everyone could be in impression that car is not cooling the cabin that well as before!! One more thing, if you are having any unwanted strong smells in your FIAT (Outside smoke etc.. ) which were not there before, then you are on DENSO filter and sure you will have vent temperature difference between central vents and side vents will not be efficient.
I am facing the similar issue after changing the pollen filter, the passenger side central vent gives hot air when I set the temperature to 23 - 24 deg C. This was not happening earlier.

However, I am not sure what is the solution. It so happened in my case that the AC stopped cooling after the service (after replacing the pollen filter) and I had to shell out around 8K to get my evaporator coil fixed .

Yes, I am also getting the odd smell in the cabin when the AC is switched on. So pathetic of FIAT to supply this filter even before testing it out.

Could you please tell me how can I get the original ZIP filter. I will try on 99rpm too.

Last edited by pk_del : 20th April 2015 at 15:19.
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Old 20th April 2015, 18:59   #69
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Originally Posted by pk_del View Post
I am facing the similar issue after changing the pollen filter, the passenger side central vent gives hot air when I set the temperature to 23 - 24 deg C. This was not happening earlier.

However, I am not sure what is the solution. It so happened in my case that the AC stopped cooling after the service (after replacing the pollen filter) and I had to shell out around 8K to get my evaporator coil fixed .

Yes, I am also getting the odd smell in the cabin when the AC is switched on. So pathetic of FIAT to supply this filter even before testing it out.

Could you please tell me how can I get the original ZIP filter. I will try on 99rpm too.
Sorry to hear that you are also facing this issue, I will take it up to fiat along with my case. Did the evaporator coil replacement had fixed the issue? I assume you would also have observed that side vents are weak in cooling and air throw.

Due to various reasons I could not update the thread, I have some significant news. Fiat tech is going to visit showroom in this week and observe the car, they aren't quite sure why oem pollen filter affects cooling, if that is the root cause we can expect a recall.

I have also procured a Bosch filter and fitted in my car, I noticed a big leap in ac performance and quality compared to oem filter. I suggest, instead of Zip filter go for a bosch one, if you live in Bangalore, you can get it in Sri Raghavendra motors Whitefield(contact Ashok 08028543797) or United motors Rajaji Nagar (contact Dhiren Mehta +919448487037). I have found a bosch filter for punto in 99rpm.com, have a look. It costs 420/- and easy to install. From past 2 days I am using the car with bosch filter and without ac recirculation, I did not get a single odour in my car. I am sure it will give you a relief.

Last edited by 90Horses : 20th April 2015 at 19:18.
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Old 22nd April 2015, 18:20   #70
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From last 5 days i am using my car with bosch cabin filter, with recirculation off, acc temp was set to 23 or 24, car was chilling, problems were fixed, no odours or no dip in cooling performance.

Tomorrow a guy from fiat is going to visit Vecto Fiat, i will drop my car with oem filter and let him diagnose the issue, I will keep the thread posted on the updates.
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Old 28th April 2015, 16:57   #71
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Default Re: Air-con: Center vents throwing out warmer air than side vents?

I have gone through a devastating, disappointing and bitter experience with FIAT service. A FIAT technician from PUNE Plant certified the car as NORMAL even with the huge temperature difference. When asked for why the temperature difference does not exist without pollen filter, he told that, the temperature from vents is in permissible range . I went and took the delivery of the car, as it is useless to hope for a detailed investigation from FIAT.

If there was nothing wrong with the car, why from 3 months the extensive part swap/replace happened on my 1 year old car? . Please have a look at below parts that were changed. Irritating part is that, no one has a register of the parts swapped from other car! Nothing was documented.
  1. Dashboard was removed.
  2. HVAC unit (Replaced Under warranty).
  3. Low and High Pressure pipes (Replaced Under warranty).
  4. Expansion valve (Replaced Under warranty).
  5. Compressor (Swapped from another car).
  6. Condenser (Swapped from another car).
  7. Pipes from compressor and condenser (Swapped from another car).
  8. Ambient temperature sensor (Swapped from another car).
  9. Compressor relay (Swapped from another car).

As a customer, I have spent hours visiting their workshop and guiding them, at the end FIAT treated me like this. I was frustrated and thought to sell my car, god bless my wife, she got me back to normal. Technicians at Vecto Fiat know how to knock down a car and put it back, rest assured they will miss few nuts here and there. I will pen down a detailed thread on my gruesome experience.

Today also I had to visit the workshop as the freon was leaking from the system, when I asked about their service quality, they say "Sorry for the inconvenience sir!". I said to myself, there is no use to beat a dead cow, take the car and get out of here.

Now the car is running with a BOSCH cabin filter and I must say, car cools a lot better. If you guys are facing similar experience with your Punto/Linea, PM me, I will be ready to help you.

Do any of you guys know how is Aadya Fiat Service? The BOSCH car care whitefield people told me, Aadya Service is the best in Bangalore and suggested me not to go to Vecto Fiat again.

Last edited by 90Horses : 28th April 2015 at 17:27.
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Old 28th April 2015, 17:34   #72
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Default Re: Air-con: Center vents throwing out warmer air than side vents?

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Originally Posted by 90Horses View Post

Now the car is running on BOSCH cabin filter and I must say, car cools a lot better.
Hi 90Horses,

I have a Linea emotion 2011 model. The car is equipped with Automatic Climate control. I always drive the car with AC on, and lately I noticed that even if the ACC is set to recirculate some ( considerable) amount of outside air thrown in to the cabin, especially when you drive behind oil-burners like RTC buses and trucks. I feel the smell of smoke inside the car to a slight extend which means the cabin has a leak and/or the filter isn't doing its job. I don't understand why this does not happen in my esteem or even the 800. And recently I noticed that the cool air leaks out through the door handles, though to a very less extent. but the car has no loss in cooling power.

Can you please throw some light on this and can anyother Linea owners check this leak from door. I thought the car's doors were damped.
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Old 28th April 2015, 17:48   #73
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Hi 90Horses,

I have a Linea emotion 2011 model. The car is equipped with Automatic Climate control. I always drive the car with AC on, and lately I noticed that even if the ACC is set to recirculate some ( considerable) amount of outside air thrown in to the cabin, especially when you drive behind oil-burners like RTC buses and trucks. I feel the smell of smoke inside the car to a slight extend which means the cabin has a leak and/or the filter isn't doing its job. I don't understand why this does not happen in my esteem or even the 800. And recently I noticed that the cool air leaks out through the door handles, though to a very less extent. but the car has no loss in cooling power.

Can you please throw some light on this and can anyother Linea owners check this leak from door. I thought the car's doors were damped.
Umesh, sorry to hear that. Outside odours coming into cabin could be due to cabin air filter. Try to replace the filter from a different brand and see if there is any difference. From my experience, Bosch filter controls most of the odours.
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Old 29th April 2015, 09:01   #74
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Default Re: Air-con: Center vents throwing out warmer air than side vents?

Some ordeal you went through with Vecto and Fiat India. You must find some way to escalate this matter. A kind word on facebook maybe. Someone at Fiat India needs to wake up to this. They can't be sending a field engineer who knows nothing.

I don't face any cooling issues at all which makes me wonder if yours is an isolated case, however, if you say the Bosch filter offers superior cabin air quality, I want to install that in my car. While outside smell does filter into the car, it is not so much a bother. My only concern is the much reduced air volume from the side vents, noticed from the day I bought the car. As cooling is satisfactory, I have left it at that knowing Fiat are incapable of doing anything about it. In fact; I have had a slight dashboard rattle from day one but am too terrified to ask them to strip down the dashboard in fear that it might add more rattles than solve the actual problem. Once again, the dash rattle is heard only on a certain kind of road surface so isn't a major irritant.

In my 3.5 years of owning a Fiat Linea, I have faced no issues. Not a single warranty claim. Maybe because the car is excessively cared for and is sparingly used. Only 28k on the odometer.

I have never tried Vecto as it is a logistical nightmare for me. KHT has been my support for the last two services and I am satisfied. Less than a km from my work spot (I work at ITPL) . They seem to have every part in stock. I can't comment on their technical expertise as I have never faced an issue. I managed to get a windscreen washer nozzle and bonnet damping material, when I was in need of these parts. I was expecting the usual part not in stock answer. You might want to try them, if it works out for you logistically. Do explain your ordeal with Vecto and what all has been done cause there might be no point in doing anything at all. With almost every part in the hvac system replaced, it seems more of a design defect.

You mentioned a wfd (whitefield) source for the Bosch cabin air filter. Where is this person located in whitefield?

Last edited by sandeepmohan : 29th April 2015 at 09:03.
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Old 8th June 2015, 10:40   #75
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Default Re: Air-con: Center vents throwing out warmer air than side vents?

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Originally Posted by 90Horses View Post
I have also procured a Bosch filter and fitted in my car
Bosch have listed two cabin filters. Oxy - fit and Oxy - Pure, which is a carbon cabin filters. Which one do you have and what are your comments on performance?
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