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Old 4th August 2016, 09:11   #1
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Default Things to do to an older engine to restore performance

Hi All,

As the car gets older, we start seeing slight performance issues even if car was well maintained with all periodic services/replacements done on time. These issues do not affect daily drives but for someone like me who likes to push them a wee bit its always at the back of my mind that we could extract that last bit which went missing over the years .

Can we document what all can be periodically changed/checked to keep the car running at near 100% performance?

Case in point is a 2009 Ford Fiesta 1.6 ran 60k I picked up recently. The car has been maintained at ASS with all maintenance done on time. Please note that car went through 1L km interval service(per age) soon after purchase and per two SAs who extensively TDed the car, its all OK.
However after driving it for some 6k kms in last three months I find below issues.

1. Engine: Though revvs reasonably freely I feel it could revv more freely. Also throttle response is a bit low in response to a Fiesta Classic 1.6(2013) I TDed. Now I have read about throttle body cleaning, spark plug cleaning/replacement etc. I am sure car has accumulated foreign objects over last 7 years. What all can I check and clean without overhauling the engine?

2. Steering system: There is some play at dead center and it does not weigh up sufficiently as the other Fiesta I TDed. Also when returning to center, it quickly returns till 11 or 13 o'clock and then I have to manually get it to 12 c'clock. I have checked tie rods and did basic checks on suspension and they seem good. I am guessing something is jammed/out of lub in steering system but per the SA the car is in perfect condition and they are not willing to troubleshoot.

Last edited by akshay380 : 4th August 2016 at 09:17.
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Old 4th August 2016, 10:11   #2
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Default re: Things to do to an older engine to restore performance

Get a new set of HT leads, new sparks, and clean the throttle body. Go to an FNG for this. Ford will completely mess you over. Its a used car, its best to do this, apart from general checkups and repairs on the suspension, steering etc.

I am surprised you are still struggling with the steering. Have the hydraulics checked up, and the rack as well.


I had a semi fix-up done on the Tucson just yesterday. New shocks, new clutch, and a full service. Sweet, she is now. Next up is a paintjob, and cosmetic fixups because of being a bully in noida traffic. All in , maybe 60k for everything, and believe me, its money well spent.
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Old 4th August 2016, 10:22   #3
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Default re: Things to do to an older engine to restore performance

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Get a new set of HT leads, new sparks, and clean the throttle body. Go to an FNG for this. Ford will completely mess you over. Its a used car, its best to do this, apart from general checkups and repairs on the suspension, steering etc.

I am surprised you are still struggling with the steering. Have the hydraulics checked up, and the rack as well.
Yes not many good FNGs here in Goa for Fords. Still planning to visit a guy who is a FIAT specialist this saturday.
Here is the thing about steering, I have already shown it to two Maruti mechanics and they dont see any issues. Its all about the feel thats lacking when I compare it to another Fiesta and even my Figo. The handling is still razor sharp. Lets hope the FIAT guy feels what I am feeling
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Old 4th August 2016, 10:49   #4
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Default re: Things to do to an older engine to restore performance

A related video, which coincidentally, I was watching last night.

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Old 4th August 2016, 11:44   #5
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Default re: Things to do to an older engine to restore performance

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Originally Posted by akshay380 View Post

2. Steering system: There is some play at dead center and it does not weigh up sufficiently as the other Fiesta I TDed. Also when returning to center, it quickly returns till 11 or 13 o'clock and then I have to manually get it to 12 c'clock. I have checked tie rods and did basic checks on suspension and they seem good. I am guessing something is jammed/out of lub in steering system but per the SA the car is in perfect condition and they are not willing to troubleshoot.
An overly excessive toe out can cause this kind of feeling of the steering being not heavy enough at speeds. Get a wheel alignment done from a competent guy and post the alignment sheet here please.
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Old 4th August 2016, 15:02   #6
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Default Re: Things to do to an older engine to restore performance

Quote:
Originally Posted by akshay380 View Post
As the car gets older, we start seeing slight performance issues even if car was well maintained with all periodic services/replacements done on time.
- First & foremost, use good engine oil and change it on time. My Honda City Vtec galloped like a horse even with 70,000+ km of high-revving. I saw absolutely no loss of horsepower. Used Mobil 1 since getting the car.

Related Thread (All about Dynamometers + DYNO visit with GTO's Vtec!)



- Change all lubes & filters (including choked air filters). Be sure to clean open filters like the K&Ns.

- The jury is still out on engine flush treatments, but I've used Bardahl and would do so to rejuvenate an old engine.

- Clean up all fuel lines (using petrol / diesel system cleaners) and the filter too.

- Check clutch. A bad clutch will sap power.

- Check turbo health, exhaust system, catalytic converter gone bad etc.

- Clean / check manifold, sensors etc.

- Get a performance intake & exhaust . If turbo-diesel, nothing like a powerbox for that added pep.

- Check engine compression. If worn, consider 'top' work (e.g. Maruti offers half-engine work which is superbly priced).

- In some cases (not all), engine decarb could work - related thread (Engine Decarbonising - Demystified).

An Italian tune-up (i.e. redlining) ever so often definitely results in an engine that revvs more freely. I've compared my cars to examples that never went above 3,000 rpm and the difference was obvious.

These are all I can think of, will add more if I remember.
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Old 4th August 2016, 15:23   #7
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Default Re: Things to do to an older engine to restore performance

Quote:
Originally Posted by akshay380 View Post
1. Engine: Though revvs reasonably freely I feel it could revv more freely. Also throttle response is a bit low in response to a Fiesta Classic 1.6(2013) I TDed. Now I have read about throttle body cleaning, spark plug cleaning/replacement etc. I am sure car has accumulated foreign objects over last 7 years. What all can I check and clean without overhauling the engine?
If you want to check the condition of the engine, best test to do is a compression check.

Having said that if you want to rejuvenate, this is what i would do.

1- Do an engine oil flush using one of the reputed brands like 3M etc

2- Get flushing oil and do one idle run with it to flush off residual muck off the system. At the end use compress air in through filler hole to get the last bit off bad oil out.

3- Refill with your favorite engine oil with suitable grades. Mobil 1 is a good option.

4- Clean or ideally replace the air filter, and replace fuel filter.

5- Check clean / replace spark plugs, also do check of the ignition system.

6- You can see try some injector clean up liquids also for couple of tank fills.

Above steps should give you back your engine health. You can confirm by doing another compression check at the end to see how much all this has helped.

Quote:
I have checked tie rods and did basic checks on suspension and they seem good. I am guessing something is jammed/out of lub in steering system but per the SA the car is in perfect condition and they are not willing to troubleshoot.
If rest of the components are in good condition.

How are the tyres? Worn out tyres can play havoc with steering feel.

If tyres are in good condition and not very old, you can do a complete oil replacement and bleeding of the hydrolic unit. Also check if the strut bearings (ones on top mount) also are in good condition and is adequately lubricated.

Last edited by Jaggu : 4th August 2016 at 15:25.
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Old 5th August 2016, 17:36   #8
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Default Re: Things to do to an older engine to restore performance

Quote:
Originally Posted by humyum View Post
An overly excessive toe out can cause this kind of feeling of the steering being not heavy enough at speeds. Get a wheel alignment done from a competent guy and post the alignment sheet here please.
Thanks for the guidance. Please find alignment details. This was done at a reputed shop in my town about 5k kms before. The car had MRFs before which I changed to Yoko's after purchase. I had same issues even during MRf use which makes me believe it's something other than tires.
Things to do to an older engine to restore performance-picsart_080505.32.50.jpg
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Old 5th August 2016, 20:42   #9
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Default Re: Things to do to an older engine to restore performance

Akshay thanks for putting this thread, I was looking for something like this.

I own a Swift VDI - 2011 Model. Last month it clocked 1 Lac kms. Now just before she attained her 1 Lac km on the odometer, I took her for a 3 day drive to Himachal in rains. So yes, she did get worked out their in up hills and unpaved roads. Before going to Himachal in rains, I got her serviced and also a general check up was done.

Now things which I have started observing in her:

1. White smoke in cold start. This smoke goes away as soon as the temperature of the engine increases.
2. Some squeaky noise which i think is caused due to the recent trip.
3. My disc plate have worn out, so need to replace it. I heard they can re-do it as well, can you throw some light on it.
4. The gears are a bit hard now. in the last 60K kms the clutch plates are not changed. I bought the car when it was 40K kms.
5. I got the EGR cleaned at 80K kms the throttle response improved, but again it feels a bit sluggish.

Now the advice/opinion I would like from the experts:

1. What are the things which needs to be done to fix the above said issues ?
2. Is it advisable to get it done at MASS or the garage which I go usually ?
3. I know white smoke is somewhat related to engine, what possible could be the reason, and what am I looking at for change and expenses?
4. Hows the Disc Plate redone, are they safe and reliable?

My driving includes occasional office commute (approx 70 kms both ways)
Long Drive once in 3 months, whether it is going to my hometown (600kms) or planning a trip in hills.

Service Interval - 7000 to 8000 kms
Engine Oil - Agip Synthetic 5w40
Oil Filter - Changed in last service
Air Filter - Changed in last service

Kindly advice. Thank you
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Old 5th August 2016, 22:54   #10
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Default Re: Things to do to an older engine to restore performance

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shivanshu View Post
Akshay thanks for putting this thread, I was looking for something like this.

I own a Swift VDI - 2011 Model. Last month it clocked 1 Lac kms. Now just before she attained her 1 Lac km on the odometer, I took her for a 3 day drive to Himachal in rains. So yes, she did get worked out their in up hills and unpaved roads. Before going to Himachal in rains, I got her serviced and also a general check up was done.

Now things which I have started observing in her:

1. White smoke in cold start. This smoke goes away as soon as the temperature of the engine increases.
2. Some squeaky noise which i think is caused due to the recent trip.
3. My disc plate have worn out, so need to replace it. I heard they can re-do it as well, can you throw some light on it.
4. The gears are a bit hard now. in the last 60K kms the clutch plates are not changed. I bought the car when it was 40K kms.
5. I got the EGR cleaned at 80K kms the throttle response improved, but again it feels a bit sluggish.

Now the advice/opinion I would like from the experts:

1. What are the things which needs to be done to fix the above said issues ?
2. Is it advisable to get it done at MASS or the garage which I go usually ?
3. I know white smoke is somewhat related to engine, what possible could be the reason, and what am I looking at for change and expenses?
4. Hows the Disc Plate redone, are they safe and reliable?

My driving includes occasional office commute (approx 70 kms both ways)
Long Drive once in 3 months, whether it is going to my hometown (600kms) or planning a trip in hills.

Service Interval - 7000 to 8000 kms
Engine Oil - Agip Synthetic 5w40
Oil Filter - Changed in last service
Air Filter - Changed in last service

Kindly advice. Thank you
Would attempt answering a few brother, although not a complete expert:
1) Not really sure about this one. But how many KMs has the car done since the last oil change?
2) Suspension Bush or Wheel bearings most likely.
3) I think you mean Disc Skimming. You should get it checked by and if skimming is possible. Although they are not very expensive so replacing will not a put a big hole.

I know you go to World of service. My recommendation would be to go to them, get stuff checked, take quotes and evaluate.
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Old 5th August 2016, 23:24   #11
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Default Re: Things to do to an older engine to restore performance

Your car is under a Lakh kms. Regular oil and filter changes should keep your engine good for 10 times the kms you have done. Of course you need the change the spark plugs, timing belts etc.
Steering issue can't be due to alignment or tyres. As Jaggu has suggested, try the hydraulic bleeding and oil change.
Anyway we can have a look tomorrow morning.
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Old 6th August 2016, 00:47   #12
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Default Re: Things to do to an older engine to restore performance

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rachit.K.Dogra View Post
Would attempt answering a few brother, although not a complete expert:
1) Not really sure about this one. But how many KMs has the car done since the last oil change?
2) Suspension Bush or Wheel bearings most likely.
3) I think you mean Disc Skimming. You should get it checked by and if skimming is possible. Although they are not very expensive so replacing will not a put a big hole.

I know you go to World of service. My recommendation would be to go to them, get stuff checked, take quotes and evaluate.
1. After the Last Oil Change the car has done around 4000kms only.

2. Suspension seems to be fine, but yes I will get it checked.

3. Disc Skimming - are they safe and reliable. You know where all I drive brother..

thanks for the advice brother, will do the needful. And update
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Old 6th August 2016, 09:04   #13
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Default Re: Things to do to an older engine to restore performance

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Originally Posted by akshay380 View Post
Hi All,



Case in point is a 2009 Ford Fiesta 1.6 ran 60k I picked up recently. The car has been maintained at ASS with all maintenance done on time.

Hi a 60k regularly serviced engine is like new. In my view, if basic checks are in place,as discussed above, you might consider a full cooling system flush, refill and a definite check of the thermostat. Often, a car under-performs if the thermostat is always open, (stuck) not being able to reach optimal operating temperature. You might expect to see a lot of sludge in there, and an inspection and clean can be good. and please dont mix coolant types.

Again, you don't know what quality of fuel it was subject to; an injector cleaning treatment and spark plug replacement would be a good spend.

The power steering : again, a full drain and refill and oil seal checks, would be good. Suspension and others: treat as and when symptoms start. IMHO, a pre-owned car is best observed for several weeks before the money spending spree starts , if critical bits like brake, engine and steering are OK.

Last edited by lapis_lazuli : 6th August 2016 at 09:12.
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Old 12th January 2017, 10:37   #14
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Default Re: Things to do to an older engine to restore performance

I'm getting knock sensor error during scanning. No visible symptoms except slightly less mileage. Already tried wiping them but they reappear. No engine check light or anything like that. Ford guys say we can leave it as it is but I'm not sure if it's because they really think it's not needed or just lazy. TIA!
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Old 5th March 2017, 17:40   #15
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Guys. I have this strange problem. Once in few days, Car refuses to start on 1-2 tries though starter kicks in. Next try the car starts but it takes time to hold on to the revs, hovers at 600-700rpm for couple of seconds and then it becomes normal. I'm suspecting faulty ignition coil or leads since spark plugs and battery looks good. As always Ford guys say it can be diagnosed only when it happens S everytime and this thing is entirely random.
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