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Old 4th June 2017, 20:00   #46
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Default Re: Water leakage in my new Innova Crysta - where has Toyota's famed quality control gone?

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Originally Posted by speedgun View Post
It's high time for government to articulate a recall policy with respect to automobile industry. Till then the public is going to be guinea pig for manufacturers for testing.
Yes, they should introduce anti lemon laws in India or a person would spend his whole life in a consumer court to get a 5 lakh rupee compensation.

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Originally Posted by cpbopanna View Post
It needs nothing short of a replacement (of vehicle)!
The customer is not part of Toyota's R&D, if Toyota has blundered, they need to pay for it!
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Originally Posted by Kestrel5915 View Post
That's a bit too much, don't you think?

Manufacturing defects are the main reason of providing a warranty.
Even I agree on that part. If they decide to replace the car then I would get into a lot of trouble. They won't pay for depreciation and I would have to go to my financer to change the car on which loan was provided because they're going to replace the car and not refund the money.

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Originally Posted by feluda86 View Post
It is really sad to see flag bearers of modern day quality in cars (Toyota and Honda) failing in QC for their Indian cars. With mandatory crash tests and progress to BS VI adding additional investments for these companies, I can only foresee more of such cost cutting measures by compromising on QC. This is where the consumer protection laws in India need to be stronger - hefty fines need to be imposed on companies which compromise safety or take consumers for a ride by cutting costs on quality.
It is sad indeed. I don't know when these laws will be made but until then we have to suffer.

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Originally Posted by drpullockaran View Post
I made a similar statement about a year ago regarding two Innova that our college owned. One was the old one, the first generation, which had run a lot with zero trouble and the new innova which had traveled a few thousand kilometers with rust developing at the bottom portion of the doors.

Toyota quality is a thing of the past. Finally we sold of the new innova and kept the old one which has covered more than 2,25,000 km without any issue of rust build up. Only normal routine service done.
Are you talking about crysta or the last generation of old innova. You should've got the doors replaced under warranty because having owned the old innova (2009 model) I don't think this issue should occur unless the vehicle was driven in harsh conditions with the doors under water but looking at the Quality in the crysta anything could happen.
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Old 4th June 2017, 20:53   #47
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Default Re: Water leakage in my new Innova Crysta - where has Toyota's famed quality control gone?

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Originally Posted by drpullockaran View Post
I made a similar statement about a year ago regarding two Innova that our college owned. One was the old one, the first generation, which had run a lot with zero trouble and the new innova which had traveled a few thousand kilometers with rust developing at the bottom portion of the doors.
But that portion is under paint so unless the paint is scraped and bare metal is exposed there's no question of rust.
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Old 4th June 2017, 22:36   #48
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Default Re: Water leakage in my new Innova Crysta - where has Toyota's famed quality control gone?

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rust developing at the bottom portion of the doors.
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Originally Posted by Kestrel5915 View Post
But that portion is under paint so unless the paint is scraped and bare metal is exposed there's no question of rust.
Rusting of lower part of door is usually a problem coming from the inside. Elderly cars I have driven... you can practically see the lower part of the door flapping because little or nothing is holding it to the inside part!

Once it starts, it can develop quickly, but this is not a problem usually seen in a vehicle that is anything like "new."
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Old 5th June 2017, 07:23   #49
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Default Re: Water leakage in my new Innova Crysta - where has Toyota's famed quality control gone?

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Originally Posted by Shreyas Agarwal View Post
Related Thread - Link


See the water filled ambient lighning panel in the picture below:
Attachment 1645067
I had the same problem in my swift in 2010. Had a big fight with Dealer and Maruti. If I remember well, I went till Maruti Gurgaon Customer Service Head. Problem was that although it was a very obvious and easy leak to regenerate, Service centre could not. Then finally a technical team visited my home and I showed them the leak after spraying water with my hose

Link to my thread -
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...ng-messup.html (New Swift Diesel - Water Leak through front Windscreen and the following messup!!!)

SOLUTION: Under warranty they changed the windshield sealant (refixed windshield). Ever since I did not have leak. No doubt, this is a manufacturing defect.
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Old 5th June 2017, 07:30   #50
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Default Re: Water leakage in my new Innova Crysta - where has Toyota's famed quality control gone?

I think this is due to damage happened to the car post shower test in the factory. Generally, the shower test will be done at moderate pressure water spray and a person sitting in the vehicle looking for any water leakage. A leakage like this one can not be left unnoticed.

The other probability could be, the leakage would have been minor during shower test and later got increased after running for few kilometres.

The welding, sealing application, glass fitment operations are done by robots. So there is less chance of variations.

What is really appalling is the attitude of the dealer.
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Old 5th June 2017, 09:26   #51
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Default Re: Water leakage in my new Innova Crysta - where has Toyota's famed quality control gone?

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Originally Posted by MaxTorque View Post
What is really appalling is the attitude of the dealer.
From the start to the finish, they've never admitted that there is a problem, nor shared any hint of an issue with the customer, they took the car in and gave it back after pouring water on the shield to prove that there is no leakage.

This is tremendous strategy I should say, without an admission there is no problem to speak of. Innova when new costed 9 lakhs ex-showroom, today it is a little over 20, granted that costs have gone up tremendously over a decade but complete model transitions to updated ones by other companies have gone up a mere 30-35% over the same space of time.. not the stupendous increase of over 200% like the Innova and well over 60% for the Honda City, both cars which fell down considerably quality wise since their previous generations. I agree they have thrown in gadgets, screens (flawed ones), and a lot of superfluous stuff in them, but nothing quite matters as much as a proper chassis, tight build and superbly screwed together interiors.. features will not help a rattling sound after the first 200 kms of driving the car.

This problem of leakage.. perhaps its a first of its kind, but the service center and the company should've coordinated to find the cause, explain the same to the customer and deliver it back home with apologies.. in the end truth should come forth.
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Old 5th June 2017, 09:35   #52
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Default Re: Water leakage in my new Innova Crysta - where has Toyota's famed quality control gone?

After going through this thread, the other Crysta niggles thread, despite realizing that Toyotas are overpriced, despite knowing they are not exceptionally cheap to maintain, will people actually start considering alternatives?

Consumer resistance is something our market shows to those brands that are really trying hard to make a comeback (Ex: Ford, Tata) and no to those brands that are laughing their way to the bank with hefty margins and not so reliable products (Toyota).
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Old 5th June 2017, 09:52   #53
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Default Re: Water leakage in my new Innova Crysta - where has Toyota's famed quality control gone?

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Originally Posted by Kishen.padiyar View Post
After going through this thread, the other Crysta niggles thread, despite realizing that Toyotas are overpriced, despite knowing they are not exceptionally cheap to maintain, will people actually start considering alternatives?

Consumer resistance is something our market shows to those brands that are really trying hard to make a comeback (Ex: Ford, Tata) and no to those brands that are laughing their way to the bank with hefty margins and not so reliable products (Toyota).
Two years back, similar questions were asked about Honda. Now we see how Maruti and Hyundai are giving them a total run for their money, even in segments that have been their traditional strong folds. The Indian market is loyal to good brands, but can be quite unforgiving once they falter as well.

It might take a while, but unless Toyota acts fast, you can be sure others would dethrone them soon. Mahindra is taking a fresh aim at the Innova, and Maruti has announced their plan for a big SUV as well. Without the reliability advantage, Toyota will in a position requesting for trouble.
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Old 5th June 2017, 10:06   #54
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Default Re: Water leakage in my new Innova Crysta - where has Toyota's famed quality control gone?

I think you should bring this to the notice of Toyota in a strong manner, social media can help in that regard.

I recently had a breakdown in my almost new Scorpio after some adjustment was done by the dealer to stop the noise coming from clutch.
I made a big issue out of it and understandably so because the clutch pedal bolt sheared off while on a highway at a pretty good speed and we were lucky to go unscathed since I was able to maneuver and stop the car safely.

Got the complete clutch pedal and box assembly replaced under warranty and a written apology from the dealer service head.
I had involved the regional managers of Mahindra as well in this case.
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Old 5th June 2017, 10:59   #55
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Default Re: Water leakage in my new Innova Crysta - where has Toyota's famed quality control gone?

Extremely sorry to hear about your issue and people like us who have not spent that Big 25 feel the pain so can understand what you are going through.

Do not loose heart - our 30 year old Maruti 800, the transformer of Indian automobile industry came home with a water leakage from the boot lid nut and leaking radiator. I am comparing apples and oranges but back then, it was an herculean task, following up with Maruti and the dealer after which the radiator was wielded (as they did not have a new one) and water leak stayed un-corrected for years upon when I put some M-Seal around the nut and it vanished.
Why I told this was, apart from that issue, we never had any issue with car and its still with us so please don't loose hope with the car .

In today's time, when social medial and digital communication is at the click of the mouse, ensure the right authorities are aware of the problem and you get every thing done to have the car in the state what you expected it to be.
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Old 5th June 2017, 11:18   #56
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Default Re: Water leakage in my new Innova Crysta - where has Toyota's famed quality control gone?

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Originally Posted by Shreyas Agarwal View Post
Even I agree on that part. If they decide to replace the car then I would get into a lot of trouble. They won't pay for depreciation and I would have to go to my financer to change the car on which loan was provided because they're going to replace the car and not refund the money.
Shreyas, TKM will never replace the car for a water leakage problem. That is, unless you resort to legal action and somehow manage to convince the Court to pass a replacement order.

I know you are disappointed as anybody would be with such an experience from a new vehicle. But don't get taken in by some of the amusing (to me) hyperventilated reactions. I've owned 2 Toyota products for well over 11 years now and TKM has never let me down. They (and the dealer) will ensure this problem is resolved to your satisfaction.

Last edited by R2D2 : 5th June 2017 at 11:20.
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Old 5th June 2017, 11:28   #57
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Default Re: Water leakage in my new Innova Crysta - where has Toyota's famed quality control gone?

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Originally Posted by Kestrel5915 View Post
But that portion is under paint so unless the paint is scraped and bare metal is exposed there's no question of rust.
There was bubbling of paint at the bottom of all the doors which happens when rust starts from the innards of the door near the bottom folded weld area. Paint on the outside was intact. Both Innova were used similarly, bought from the same dealer and serviced there too. The new one about 2 years old rusted up in about 30,000 km was sold off but the old one which is about 8 years old and 2,25,000 km has no rust issues and is still used as the work horse of the college. Our sister concern has a very old Qualis which has run 4 lakh km, is perfect with mild paint fade only and negligible oil consumption.
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Old 5th June 2017, 12:21   #58
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Default Re: Water leakage in my new Innova Crysta - where has Toyota's famed quality control gone?

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Originally Posted by drpullockaran View Post
There was bubbling of paint at the bottom of all the doors which happens when rust starts from the innards of the door near the bottom folded weld area.
From my experience this generally happens when the drain holes at the bottom of the door frame assembly are blocked. Water is retained inside the door assembly and the slow rusting process begins. Assuming you are in Kochi/Ernakulam (from your profile) this process can accelerate in coastal areas with heavy rainfall and high humidity.

Water accumulation inside any panel/frame assembly is unhealthy for any vehicle. You may want to check drain channels and holes in all your vehicles.

Last edited by R2D2 : 5th June 2017 at 12:23. Reason: typo
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Old 5th June 2017, 13:20   #59
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Default Re: Water leakage in my new Innova Crysta - where has Toyota's famed quality control gone?

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Originally Posted by R2D2 View Post
Shreyas, TKM will never replace the car for a water leakage problem. That is, unless you resort to legal action and somehow manage to convince the Court to pass a replacement order.

I know you are disappointed as anybody would be with such an experience from a new vehicle. But don't get taken in by some of the amusing (to me) hyperventilated reactions. I've owned 2 Toyota products for well over 11 years now and TKM has never let me down. They (and the dealer) will ensure this problem is resolved to your satisfaction.
Sir, I meant the same that they will not replace the car, and even if they decide to replace it(which they won't) I would get stuck between my financer and TKM.

With regards,
Shreyas Kumar Agarwal

Last edited by Shreyas Agarwal : 5th June 2017 at 13:21. Reason: Grammatical error
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Old 5th June 2017, 15:59   #60
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Default Re: Water leakage in my new Innova Crysta - where has Toyota's famed quality control gone?

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Originally Posted by Vid6639 View Post

Are we supposed to accept this from Toyota? Are Toyota ok with this? Do they think they can charge a premium just because they are better than the competition in reliability and Quality.

What has basically happened over the last few years with the new wave of Toyota's is that Toyota reliability and quality have gone down but the other manufacturers especially the euros and koreans have upped their game. The gap is there but is narrower than what it used to be.
There seems to be a genuine reason for concern here. The worrying part is this trend is not limited to India! A friend of mine had bought a fleet of ten 2015 model Corollas in the UAE for his business. 4 of them have already had to undergo AC evaporator changes! He also reported some rusting issues in a couple of cars; but he was turned down by the dealership for having done oil changes outside. He did try raising the issue with Toyota Middle East; but they referred him to resolve with the dealer itself.

Toyota has built its brand solely on their QDR (Quality, Dependability, Reliability) principles, but there seems to be lapses nowadays and it can hurt them badly. Was just wondering; with such reliability and low maintenance costs, why does Toyota not fare highly in JD Power etc.?
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