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Old 29th June 2017, 17:53   #31
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Default Re: Solved: VW Polo GT TSI power drop after service! It was the air filter

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeroen View Post
A clogged air filter can have significant impact on a carís performance. I find it difficult to image to that a brand new filter, no matter how crappy, would have such an impact on the carís performance. There is no way that is caused by just a crappy filter that might have a bit more resistance compared to a new, proper, filter.
I have faced a similar situation with a brand new filter - on the 'other' forum where a gentleman was promoting his brand of 'arrowhead' stock replacement paper filters with enhanced air flow. Paid up and bought one, and within a week, my car's throttle response and top end were significantly dulled. Tried swapping in my old filter, and things went back to normal instantly!
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Old 29th June 2017, 18:21   #32
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Default Re: Solved: VW Polo GT TSI power drop after service! It was the air filter

While looking up on the air filters, I found that there are 2 separate filters for the TDI and TSI.

http://genuineparts.in/index.php?rou...ategory_id=199

I intend to get the one for the TSI and check it out this weekend.
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Old 29th June 2017, 19:42   #33
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Default Re: Solved: VW Polo GT TSI power drop after service! It was the air filter

Update:

Found some references from UFI site. Seems to be that the filter is the same as one used in polo 6R. (http://www.ufi.it/en/)

Solved: VW Polo GT TSI power drop after service! It was the air filter-ufi.png


Solved: VW Polo GT TSI power drop after service! It was the air filter-ufi_ref.png

Managed to order the filter from https://boodmo.com/catalog/part-air_filter-2309380/

I'm not really sure how good are these guys. Just wanted to try out. Lets see.

Meanwhile, some info on the Lumax filter:

Solved: VW Polo GT TSI power drop after service! It was the air filter-img_4258.jpg
Solved: VW Polo GT TSI power drop after service! It was the air filter-img_4257.jpg

And the following pieces of plastic are dangling inside the filter. I hope such plastic pieces don't get into the engine.

Solved: VW Polo GT TSI power drop after service! It was the air filter-img_4259.jpg

Last edited by avanishphatak : 29th June 2017 at 19:57. Reason: Additional Information
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Old 29th June 2017, 20:22   #34
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Default Re: Solved: VW Polo GT TSI power drop after service! It was the air filter

Quote:
Originally Posted by avanishphatak View Post
...

Managed to order the filter from https://boodmo.com/catalog/part-air_filter-2309380/

...

And the following pieces of plastic are dangling inside the filter. I hope such plastic pieces don't get into the engine.

...
That's great that you found it. From that page, I came across the filter costing a bit less and its OE too:

https://boodmo.com/catalog/part-air_filter-4427300/

Regarding the pieces of plastic you found, this is not surprising to me as I have previously experienced the substandard quality of VW India's localized parts.
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Old 1st July 2017, 20:27   #35
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Default Re: Solved: VW Polo GT TSI power drop after service! It was the air filter

Any change in fuel consumption figures between the two filters?

Some comparative performace figures (using something like Dynolicious) would be revealing.

Regards
Sutripta
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Old 19th July 2017, 15:32   #36
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Default Re: Solved: VW Polo GT TSI power drop after service! It was the air filter

Quote:
Originally Posted by swissknife View Post
While looking up on the air filters, I found that there are 2 separate filters for the TDI and TSI.

http://genuineparts.in/index.php?rou...ategory_id=199

I intend to get the one for the TSI and check it out this weekend.
Hey SwissKnife, did you try this?
I guess "C 15 008" is the right product code, you could check this in https://catalog.mann-filter.com/EU/e...r/C%2015%20008 or in https://boodmo.com/catalog/part-air_filter-1091803/
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Old 19th July 2017, 16:09   #37
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Post Re: Solved: VW Polo GT TSI power drop after service! It was the air filter

Quote:
Originally Posted by shetty_rohan View Post
Hey SwissKnife, did you try this?
I guess "C 15 008" is the right product code, you could check this in https://catalog.mann-filter.com/EU/e...r/C%2015%20008 or in https://boodmo.com/catalog/part-air_filter-1091803/
I did look this up earlier. For some reason, they seem to suggest the same filter for both diesel and petrol engines though the original filter that comes with the car for diesel and and petrol have different part numbers.

Here is the application details of those filters


Attached Thumbnails
Solved: VW Polo GT TSI power drop after service! It was the air filter-filter1.jpg  

Solved: VW Polo GT TSI power drop after service! It was the air filter-filter2.jpg  


Last edited by swissknife : 19th July 2017 at 16:11. Reason: Including images
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Old 20th July 2017, 03:20   #38
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Default Re: Solved: VW Polo GT TSI power drop after service! It was the air filter

Last week, I gave my Vento TSI for my first service, and VW service technicians have changed the UFI Air filter with that of Lumax. As per the Service Advisor, VW India, does not Supply the UFI air filters to the service centers, and has advised them to use the Lumax for all the petrol and diesel cars.

Per him, since the TSI is an imported engine, they come with the UFI air filter. All the diesel engines produced in India, have Lumax air filters as standard component and accessory.

On the box of the Lumax Air filter, its clearly mentioned thats its for 1.6 diesel engine, still the service centers (technicians), blindly follow VW instructions, and use the same for TSI engines.

I did check in boodmo.com, however, the UFI filters are not available.

Although, I did not feel any change in the performance, I am having my cousin pick up a couple of them from UK and he is getting it for me.

https://www.buycarparts.co.uk/ufi/7242571
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Old 20th July 2017, 08:31   #39
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Default Re: Solved: VW Polo GT TSI power drop after service! It was the air filter

Quote:
Originally Posted by avanishphatak View Post
Update:

Managed to order the filter from https://boodmo.com/catalog/part-air_filter-2309380/

I'm not really sure how good are these guys. Just wanted to try out. Lets see.
Have you received & tried out the filter that you had ordered? I am eager to know the feedback on this.
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Old 20th July 2017, 10:32   #40
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Default Re: Solved: VW Polo GT TSI power drop after service! It was the air filter

Quote:
Originally Posted by cormodore View Post
Per him, since the TSI is an imported engine, they come with the UFI air filter. All the diesel engines produced in India, have Lumax air filters as standard component and accessory..

I did check in boodmo.com, however, the UFI filters are not available.
UFI filter is available in boodmo. Please check https://boodmo.com/catalog/part-air_filter-2309380/

Last edited by shetty_rohan : 20th July 2017 at 10:34.
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Old 20th July 2017, 11:24   #41
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Default Re: Solved: VW Polo GT TSI power drop after service! It was the air filter

I had brought up this issue with the service manager at Palace Cross Rajaji Nagar. He mentioned to me that the previous day they had been in a long meeting about this very thread; and that they had tested two cars, one with the new filter and one with the original; and that they had found absolutely no difference in the performance or anything else.

He also said that the matter had been escalated to VW India and that they are awaiting their feedback.

Until now I have not heard back from them. However, I am not placing much hope on their agreeing with the opinions expressed in this thread because it is advantageous for them to not do so.

Cheers
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Old 28th July 2017, 00:18   #42
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Default Re: Solved: VW Polo GT TSI power drop after service! It was the air filter

Quote:
Originally Posted by swissknife View Post
Have you received & tried out the filter that you had ordered? I am eager to know the feedback on this.
Boodmo shipment is in process. Hoping to get it in a week or two.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tilt View Post
I had brought up this issue with the service manager at Palace Cross Rajaji Nagar. He mentioned to me that the previous day they had been in a long meeting about this very thread; and that they had tested two cars, one with the new filter and one with the original; and that they had found absolutely no difference in the performance or anything else.

He also said that the matter had been escalated to VW India and that they are awaiting their feedback.

Until now I have not heard back from them. However, I am not placing much hope on their agreeing with the opinions expressed in this thread because it is advantageous for them to not do so.

Cheers
After a couple of weeks I have some update to do on this topic.

With continued pestering and escalations with VW, they finally arranged a meeting with VW technical head (I don't know for which region) and the service manager of VW palace cross Rajajinagar.

After some initial discussions and me mentioning the whole history and story to them, me and 3 other people from VW set out to test the results with air filter.
The shop got in two other Lumax filter to ruleout the possibility of a faulty piece. Essentially we had now three filters:
  1. UFI (Original) airfilter
  2. Lumax 1 airfilter
  3. Lumax 2 airfilter

The workshop also brought in the OBD diagnostic tool (the rugged Panasonic laptop with proprietary VW SW and OBD connector)
The goal was to test each filter and measure the accelerator pedal depress percentage, RPM generated and airflow.
The method used by them was crude. Like taking screenshots and comparing, which I wasn't very happy with. But anyway, we started off.

Initially we started with a blind test. Wherein I drive, and they change the air filter, UFI or lumax which I will not know. And when I drive, the goal was to see if I could Identify. For all the 4 cases when filter was changed, I was successfully able to identify the UFI. It was very evident during driving.
After this, the OBD was connected, and readings were taken at different situations like:
  • Constantly depressed accel pedal
  • increasing accel pedal
  • accel pedal with full thrust

For each filter, the readings (accelerator depression percentage, rpm, airflow) were taken. So that amounted to about 3-5 readings per air filter.
Although I do not have detailed measurement values since they did not allow me to take it, I have a rough estimate of what transcribed. The average increased RPM values in UFI was about 10-18% for the exact same %age of accelerator depression value. When the vehicle was in motion and 4 passengers seated in the car. Please note that in all cases the same 4 ppl were in the car, same driver, same seating positions, only the air filter was changed and measurements are below.

UFI:
RPM @accel_depression_percent
2350 @40%
1741 @24%
991 @32%

Lumax:
2030 @42.7%
1500 @24.2%
900 @31%

Later we parked the car, and accelerator depression percentage, air inlet flow, air outlet flow, for RPMs 1000, 1500, 2800, 2000, 2500, 3000 were measured. This was about 6 readings X 3 air filters. (two lumax, one UFI)

When we did a measurement of airflows when the car was standing and only the engine was revved, there was very negligible difference in terms of accelerator depression percentage and RPM. So this brought me to believe that once the engine is loaded one can see the difference. Strange thing was there are different values when car is not moving, and when the car is running on the road with passengers. I don't know if it points to something but there is a suspicion that car knows if its moving or not.

The car OTR test was conducted for about 10-15 km on ring road Bangalore. We spent a good 3-4 hours testing the whole thing. It was quite an experience for me too. My doubts were reinforced with the metrics collected.

VW people have taken the readings and they are yet to get back to me on this. While now I've reinstated the UFI and am waiting for boodmo shipment to get the OEM UFI and checkout.

Like tilt said, I'm not expecting them to reveal much even if they find out. But the point was to 'make a point' which seems to have been done. If in the long run it helps any of us or even for VW to get back on the drawing board and see things in a different perspective, the efforts will be worth it.

Last edited by avanishphatak : 28th July 2017 at 00:26. Reason: Grammar corrections
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Old 28th July 2017, 05:17   #43
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Default Re: Solved: VW Polo GT TSI power drop after service! It was the air filter

Quote:
Originally Posted by avanishphatak View Post


UFI:
RPM @accel_depression_percent
2350 @40%
1741 @24%
991 @32%

Lumax:
2030 @42.7%
1500 @24.2%
900 @31%

Later we parked the car, and accelerator depression percentage, air inlet flow, air outlet flow, for RPMs 1000, 1500, 2800, 2000, 2500, 3000 were measured. This was about 6 readings X 3 air filters. (two lumax, one UFI)


VW people have taken the readings and they are yet to get back to me on this. While now I've reinstated the UFI and am waiting for boodmo shipment to get the OEM UFI and checkout.

Like tilt said, I'm not expecting them to reveal much even if they find out. But the point was to 'make a point' which seems to have been done. If in the long run it helps any of us or even for VW to get back on the drawing board and see things in a different perspective, the efforts will be worth it.
Thanks much for your detailed description of the test!. It does seem that there is a difference between the filters, even if ti does not show up when the car is not in motion. I am eager to hear what VW have to say in this regard. I sincerely hope they do not brush the issue under the carpet.
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Old 10th August 2017, 18:01   #44
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Default Re: Solved: VW Polo GT TSI power drop after service! It was the air filter

Quote:
Originally Posted by avanishphatak View Post
BWhile now I've reinstated the UFI and am waiting for boodmo shipment to get the OEM UFI and checkout.
Have you got the Boodmo shipment?
Do let us know about the part number(preferably link), and also the experience(with Boodmo).
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Old 11th August 2017, 16:28   #45
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Default Re: Solved: VW Polo GT TSI power drop after service! It was the air filter

Quote:
Originally Posted by tilt View Post
I had brought up this issue with the service manager at Palace Cross Rajaji Nagar. He mentioned to me that the previous day they had been in a long meeting about this very thread; and that they had tested two cars, one with the new filter and one with the original; and that they had found absolutely no difference in the performance or anything else.

He also said that the matter had been escalated to VW India and that they are awaiting their feedback.

Until now I have not heard back from them. However, I am not placing much hope on their agreeing with the opinions expressed in this thread because it is advantageous for them to not do so.

Cheers
I called him just now. He said VW got back to him a few days ago saying categorically that there was absolutely no difference at all on any measured parameter between the two filters. He also told me that the TBHP member who made them escalate this and tested it with them has been apprised of this information.

Well, this is precisely what I expected them to say.

Cheers
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