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Old 12th April 2007, 17:03   #121
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this question is for mpfi cars only. when we give car for servicing they offer tune up of engine and mostly we welcome it expecting better mileage. what do they actually do? just clean plugs? adjust something? remap ecu? connect some kind of handheld device and download data from ecu? if so can they not tune up for best performance? experts please comment
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Old 12th April 2007, 17:28   #122
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Oh there are enough dynos in India, in the hundreds is a likely number. Just that none of them are open to the public.
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Old 12th April 2007, 17:42   #123
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Originally Posted by v1p3r View Post
Oh there are enough dynos in India, in the hundreds is a likely number. Just that none of them are open to the public.
If they are not accessible, then their presence is redundant for the purpose of this discussion.
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Old 12th April 2007, 21:14   #124
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Quote:
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Oh there are enough dynos in India, in the hundreds is a likely number. Just that none of them are open to the public.
Shops with dynos in the states make a killing...$75 USD or more for 3 pulls. Odd that they are kept privately.
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Old 12th April 2007, 22:36   #125
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Engine swaps in Asia are driven by cheap used Japanese engine imports.
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Old 12th April 2007, 22:54   #126
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nextlevel350z View Post
Shops with dynos in the states make a killing...$75 USD or more for 3 pulls. Odd that they are kept privately.
I think viper was talking about manufacturer dynos
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Old 12th April 2007, 22:56   #127
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Quote:
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I think viper was talking about manufacturer dynos
I was. Thats news to me as well.

Viper
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Old 13th April 2007, 00:26   #128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by viper View Post
I was. Thats news to me as well.

Viper
binz was referring to v1p3r
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Old 13th April 2007, 00:40   #129
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guys guys how about we stay on topic? we were discussing the effectiveness of bolt-on mods remember?

lets start a new topic for dynos if thats what we want to talk about.
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Old 13th April 2007, 01:11   #130
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mpower View Post
Engine swaps in Asia are driven by cheap used Japanese engine imports.
Tell me about it. i had a 118NE with a used/abused nissan diesel engine in it.
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Old 13th April 2007, 04:45   #131
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1998 Honda Civic EX - Power Pages - Import Tuner Magazine
try reading this page at the bottom with dyno gains...
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Old 13th April 2007, 05:01   #132
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gigy View Post
this question is for mpfi cars only. when we give car for servicing they offer tune up of engine and mostly we welcome it expecting better mileage. what do they actually do?

I know this is way off topic... but just cant help replying to that..

1] maybe just wash ur car and hand it back to you..if they think the customer doesnt know much about cars.
2] if the car was knocking and even if u explain to them there is issue with valve lash/setting. they dont understand what the hell you are talking about, or simply say ur fuel was bad.
3] if you ask to get ur oil changed they will top it up way over the max level without flushing the older oil or if u are lucky they will fill new oil and use new filter and again top it up way above max...
4] change some part for 5000 bucks or 300$ etc etc ...

I can go on and on..

Quote:
Originally Posted by gigy View Post
just clean plugs?
you wish..they do something


Quote:
Originally Posted by gigy View Post
adjust something?
adjust nothing if it doesn't squeak, rattle, clunk or about to fall off or catch fire or something you would like them to adjust specifically

Quote:
Originally Posted by gigy View Post
remap ecu?
definately they wont remap your ECU during a regular service unless its a known issue with those models..

Quote:
Originally Posted by gigy View Post
connect some kind of handheld device and download data from ecu?
only if the the MIL/CEL is on or there is a problem with the MPFI engine which they cant understand whatthe hell is going on..

Quote:
Originally Posted by gigy View Post
if so can they not tune up for best performance?
wish dealers would do that..


If you are really hyper or crazy like all the bhpians out here .. you will do most of the things with a private garage and personally supervise everything or do it yourself.. or even plug a Obd2 software to ur ECU and analyse..
If it's like a timing/valve clearance/ECU thing or something very delicate then only go to the delership and hope he doesnt rip u off...

from my personal experience atleast this is what i have understood..maybe other people have had better experiences at their delarship's service stations..

Last edited by chetanhanda : 13th April 2007 at 05:08.
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Old 13th April 2007, 11:11   #133
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even i have seen how they bill you up and nothing noticeable is found at end of servicing. even i do most of the routine maintenance myself, go to a known garage for other works. only insurance claims i prefer from authorized service center due to the painting quality.
i know one of my garage mechanic customer whose honda city engine seized because the engine oil was never changed, he used to follow maintenance at service center religiously, dont know what happened to the court case he filed after that.
coming to topic what should this thread lead to ? is this to clear myths, or inform about myths or inform tbhp members how to go about modifying.
i think then the experts can list out the myths, things to be done or not to be done and in what ,manner. they can recommend known sources for everyone's benefit so that all of dont assume we have bolted on additional 10bhp with each modification and increased the power to 160bhp from 90bhp
one faq kind of list will be great.

1] Plug wires?

2] Iridium Spark Plugs, 4 electrode plugs?

3] Air filter/CAI?
colder denser air gives more power, how dense it can be ??

4] Lightened flywheel?

5] electric supercharger?
supercharger is to make air dense, good for hilly region operation. airplane piston engines have supercharger for this reason

6] synthetic oil?
good lubricated engine with good cooling property can help in better life of engine than power

7] 97 octane fuel with octane boosters?
beter octane rating better power.

8] TB spacers?
not for mpfi i suppose... for the carb muscle cars.

9] Strut braces?
handling

10] ECU reflash or remapping?
this should definitely exploit the full potential of engine, but loss of fuel economy.

11] Low profile tyres?
great handling improvement at educed ride quality and more surface drag beyond a particular size?

12] free flow exhausts?
this does help but cost a sound

13] high lift cams?
giving more feed to engine, hope it can eat it all without vomiting.

14)porting polishing?
whats this.

15) reduce weight?
this will definitely increase power due increased power to weight ratio.

16) do not ice performance cars.you put in lot of weight with those sub and its box, amps. dampimg

17)spoilers?
we do not have spoilers which provide any performance increase since all are bad design and fully cosmetic in nature. a inverted aerofoil structure should face the wind for providing aerodynamics many look funny but they work, it starts above 150kmph speed.

18)corner slammers and dtm slammers?
lighter cars tend to keep lifting of ground, these give downward force to help keep front wheel on ground.

19)see a formula car for design improvements, why it sticks to tarmac?
its the design

Last edited by gigy : 13th April 2007 at 11:28.
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Old 13th April 2007, 13:05   #134
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one thing about free flow exhaust......whats fact?
i have observed: the normal exhaust diameter chosen by manufacturer is sufficient for normal level of gas outflow in all normal operating rpms of engine. its when you push in for more that the exhaust is not able to exit of the engine fast and could possibly builtup back pressure. here is where free flow helps, so freeflow puts in few more punch at higher rpm only when gas mass flow rate is high. varoius dyno test results i saw on net confirms this. there is no change at lower rpms. the faster the exhaust can get out the better it is.

how do people claim increasing low end response or mid end response or tune exhaust?
i am learning
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Old 13th April 2007, 13:31   #135
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Well, I'll start the answering, and the others can contribute if I'm wrong or have missed out something. My answers in bold.

1] Plug wires? On a stock car, useless.

2] Iridium Spark Plugs, 4 electrode plugs? Same as above.

3] Air filter/CAI?
colder denser air gives more power, how dense it can be ?? Useful, but CAI could get wet and damage engine in the rain. How dense air can get depends on location, altitude, season etc.

4] Lightened flywheel? Practically useless, since you will die in traffic.

5] electric supercharger?
supercharger is to make air dense, good for hilly region operation. airplane piston engines have supercharger for this reason Hahahahaha...this is the most useless.

6] synthetic oil?
good lubricated engine with good cooling property can help in better life of engine than powerTrue, useful. But also expensive to an extreme for some brands. Whether it justifies the expense is debatable

7] 97 octane fuel with octane boosters?
beter octane rating better power.Useless on a stock car. A lot of Indian cars perform better on regular unleaded.

8] TB spacers?
not for mpfi i suppose... for the carb muscle cars. Useless.

9] Strut braces?
handling Useful. But then you have to push the car or drive that fast to know the difference.

10] ECU reflash or remapping?
this should definitely exploit the full potential of engine, but loss of fuel economy. Depends on what you remap for. And I don't think you can get it done anywhere in India.

11] Low profile tyres?
great handling improvement at educed ride quality and more surface drag beyond a particular size? Also heavier, since the rim will be larger.

12] free flow exhausts?
this does help but cost a sound No it doesn't. An exhaust system is like a chain. Only as strong as its weakest link. The most restrictive part is normally the cat-con or the mid-muffler. You need a complete free-flow system with a well-designed set of headers to extract some power.

13] high lift cams?
giving more feed to engine, hope it can eat it all without vomiting. Costs a load. You will need to fiddle with idle settings for days to get it right. Bye-bye, fuel efficiency. Low-end response will also die, if you get a wild cam.

14)porting polishing?
whats this. Enlarging and smoothing the ports on the intake and exhaust of the head, to ensure better flow-rates. Helps.

15) reduce weight?
this will definitely increase power due increased power to weight ratio. And your car will bounce about because there is less weight to root it to the ground.

16) do not ice performance cars.you put in lot of weight with those sub and its box, amps. dampimg And again, your car will bounce about.

17)spoilers?
we do not have spoilers which provide any performance increase since all are bad design and fully cosmetic in nature. a inverted aerofoil structure should face the wind for providing aerodynamics many look funny but they work, it starts above 150kmph speed. Useless, unless you live on the autobahn.

18)corner slammers and dtm slammers?
lighter cars tend to keep lifting of ground, these give downward force to help keep front wheel on ground. Never seen a car lift its front off the ground.

19)see a formula car for design improvements, why it sticks to tarmac?
its the design Also it only seats one, gets wet easily, is too low, has no GC, etc. Life is all about choices...
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