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Old 22nd June 2007, 18:08   #61
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Got a reply from Ford:
Quote:
Thank you for contacting Ford India.

We appreciate the time you have taken to write to us. We have noted down the contents of your mail and have taken up the issue with the dealership concerned.

We would revert back to you after we receive relevant information from our dealership. Your concern number is XXXXXXXX

Assuring you of our best services and continuous support at all times.

Thanks and Regards,
Lokesh.P,
Customer Relations,
Ford India Limited.
Also, the Ganges ford chaps called up asking if I had written a mail to Ford. My uncle said yes and they said the Ford guys are investigating the case.

As Suman has mentioned my uncle really doesnt want to take it to a private garage without giving Ford a chance. I also think it's better to only approach the private chaps as a last resort to verify the claims made by Ganges Ford.

Last edited by Vid6639 : 22nd June 2007 at 18:10.
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Old 22nd June 2007, 18:17   #62
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Originally Posted by spadival View Post
A bit of semantics here.. How can you wade thru water if you are "parked" (i.e. stand still) ????? I think the parked car reference is for the bow wave test.

Either way, They cant escape providing warranty cover, considering that they have advertised this so called "feature" of the car surviving .45 meter depth of water for eight hours. They need to provide warranty cover or its a case of fraudulant advertising.

I agree 100% with what you said. Logically speaking no one will PARK his car - in 18 inches of water (ofcourse overnight flooding may cause that to happen) The Ford guys obviously tested it DRIVING thru deep water. There is a fair chance of a warranty claim.
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Old 22nd June 2007, 18:26   #63
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[quote=vid6639;476201]Got a reply from Ford:
Also, the Ganges ford chaps called up asking if I had written a mail to Ford. My uncle said yes and they said the Ford guys are investigating the case.

Nice to know that something +ve has started happening - let's hope the Ford guys come up with a sensible & acceptable solution..
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Old 22nd June 2007, 19:54   #64
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Actually, its quite ironic that the dealer is named after river Ganges .. Looks like they want to "flood" ur uncle with an expensive bill.
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Old 22nd June 2007, 20:57   #65
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That sounds like some trouble there. Jeez, it must feel bad.

Where is the car parked? In the garage? If they know that you aren't going to give in easily, can't they do something to the car/engine since it is in their garage? What is the guarantee that they wouldn't?
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Old 23rd June 2007, 00:48   #66
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I read the entire post, and yes I am quite dissatisfied with service provided by the Ford dealer. Even the estimate sheet provided looks like having stuff like Pulley and belts which should be fine, even if you have water in your engine. How many crank shaft bearings are going to be needed? So I am quite sure, knowing the way they do their estimates, this is a con job.

Water can get into the engine from the Air intake side ONLY. When the exhaust is submerged, even then, keeping revs up, cars can fight thru. Now on the intake bit , for a NA engine any amount of water over the cylinder volume/compression ratio (for Fiesta's case (1400/4)/18 = 19.4 cc = 194 ml approximately a bit less than a mini Thumbs up bottle) is lethal for the engine(infact even lower than that can damage the engine as the sucked in air could be subjected to tremendous pressure) , for a turbo-charged engine as the (intake air is first compressed) its much less than that. Moreover as Fording (Pun intended) involves revving up around say 3000-4000 rpm it only needs the intake to be submerged (note I mean submerged not exposed to stray water) for .01 secs or so to do the damage. So never under-estimate the hazards at a Waterlogged street.

Speaking about driving thru water experiences. I have had quite some in Kolkata, and on the days of the last year torrential rains (August 19 and some other day in September) incidentally I had absolutely to drive thru for reasons other than pleasure. At Park circus, my car became a pathfinder for a convoy, but always in my mind, I knew I was taking a chance.

Even if we have water just below the intake, meaning, the actual water level much lower, (as the car itself creates a wave in front of it which is actually quite high) wave interactions by waves caused by other vehicles like a Bus can sometimes cause the engine to suck in water even when the actual water level is apparently quite low. Last year I had a tough time signalling to a "Saha Institute of Nuclear Physics" Bus (this bus is always rashly driven) to slow down on the opposite side as my cars intake would drown, at the end I had to almost stop and angle the car to take the wave side-on (the wave hit my right fender and went over the bonnet to the other side) and I was lucky that the car did not stop. But on this stretch the water was around the calf depth only. So although I trust your uncle's observation that the car stalled at calf height water when other cars were moving in the same direction but there is a distinct possiblility of a number of things happenning (like a wave interaction from a vehicle coming from the other side, or a wave interaction from a vehicle overtaking from the intake side, or the car falling into a pothole. So looks like your uncle got a bit unlucky.

One more thing is that judging water level by obeserving the previous vehicles exhaust leads to wrong results as there is a breif trough created behind the vehicle.

Moreover Warranty and Insurance both go invalid IF a vehicle is driven in standing water (even if its designed to survive standing water).

Now coming to the point at hand about bad service given by Ganges Ford, I dont have any contacts in Ford (actually i dont have any contacts anywhere!). But let me see if something can be done.

Last edited by 1100D : 23rd June 2007 at 01:05.
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Old 25th June 2007, 10:58   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1100D View Post
Moreover Warranty and Insurance both go invalid IF a vehicle is driven in standing water (even if its designed to survive standing water).
Buddy, you sure about this? Anyone here with dependable contacts in the insurance industry who can verify this?

Now that Ford India are looking into the issue, lets hope it reaches a favourable conclusion.
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Old 25th June 2007, 12:52   #68
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Still no feedback from Ford, just the initial mail that they will look into it. Am trying to reach the Customer Relations guy Lokesh P who replied to my mail.

I'll wait till tomorrow, then probably get in touch with ACI. Is that a wise thing to do?
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Old 25th June 2007, 13:57   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vid6639 View Post
Am trying to reach the Customer Relations guy Lokesh P who replied to my mail.

I'll wait till tomorrow, then probably get in touch with ACI. Is that a wise thing to do?
Unless you are 100% sure that will translate into some positive development, I wouldn't recommend it.

Its wiser trying to get hold of that Lokesh guy - I would go to a third party only after/if Ford washed its hands off the situation. Just my opinion............
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Old 25th June 2007, 14:31   #70
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Originally Posted by alabjarus View Post
Vid, why would anybody change 'Steering Oil' and 'AC Gas' for an engine failure issue...!

I get a bad feeling about Ganges Ford's intention. Beware....! Double check.
When the pistons and camshafts has to be replaced, the engine should be dismounted from the car. for that, the AC coils and compressor has to be removed which ends up in refilling the gas.
The same is applicable for the power steering which is basically a hydraulic one which uses engine power. So the power seering unit has to be removed before dismounting the engine.

But....I still doubt.....barely a feet of water cannot reach the air intake of any engine of any car....not even an Autorickshaw.
I've drove my palio through even higher water levels on recent floods in kerala and it passed comfortably everytime...
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Old 25th June 2007, 16:18   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vid6639 View Post
Still no feedback from Ford, just the initial mail that they will look into it. Am trying to reach the Customer Relations guy Lokesh P who replied to my mail.
Vid, give them some time. I guess they do their checks and then get back. Another TBHPian landcruiser also underwent the same wait when he wrote in to Ford India.
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Old 25th June 2007, 18:42   #72
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This day last year a friend of mine, driving a Opel Corsa got stuck in water. Water has hardly 1 feet as it did not enter the car when the doors were opened. Just then a military truck passed by and splashed some water on the car. My friend tried to start the car but after some noise it just dies on him. He called me and I towed the car to some distance before the GM service vehicle caught us.
Later he was given a bill of 1.45 Lacs because his engine was completely damaged. They showed him the pistons which were completely broken and there was a lot of water in the compartment.
We tried to claim insurance from HDFC but were flatly refused as my friend had tried to start the vehicle in water. No one cares how much water was there, once you have told them that you tried to start the car when it was in water, you have lost all hope of recovering any claims.
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Old 26th June 2007, 11:05   #73
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Originally Posted by RacingForIndia View Post
This day last year a friend of mine, driving a Opel Corsa got stuck in water. Water has hardly 1 feet as it did not enter the car when the doors were opened. Just then a military truck passed by and splashed some water on the car. My friend tried to start the car but after some noise it just dies on him. He called me and I towed the car to some distance before the GM service vehicle caught us.
Later he was given a bill of 1.45 Lacs because his engine was completely damaged. They showed him the pistons which were completely broken and there was a lot of water in the compartment.
We tried to claim insurance from HDFC but were flatly refused as my friend had tried to start the vehicle in water. No one cares how much water was there, once you have told them that you tried to start the car when it was in water, you have lost all hope of recovering any claims.
Yup, once the engine stops one should not attemp to start it. if done its gona ruin the engine. if the water is till the silencer thats enough.
whenever i have to wade through the water logged road, i am prepared to leave the car whereever it is,if it stops and call the service guys.
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Old 26th June 2007, 14:10   #74
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@1100D: That's a good analysis of the *possible* cause of this problem. However, as you also mentioned, I think this stinks of a con job from Ganges Ford.

Regd the insurance, they will reimburse you if your car is damaged by floods, but as some of you mentioned, they are a little reluctant if you let on that you tried to force your way through a flooded street.

@vid: sorry buddy, haven't had the chance to get in touch with anyone during the week... been flooded (no puns intended) with work. will see what i can do.
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Old 26th June 2007, 14:21   #75
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Hey Razor4077, no probs dude. I'm still waiting from feedback from Ford. The Ford chennai people called up and told the diagnosis is ongoing and that the con rods are bent and the pistons are damaged.

Also my uncle spoke to his driver and confirmed that at no point of time did a large vehicle pass by nor did any wave occur that would lead to water entering the engine.

1100D good explanation but any idea how the turbocharger would not fail and just force the water into the engine without any damage. The turbo should ideally fail first.
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