Go Back   Team-BHP > Under the Hood > Technical Stuff


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 10th September 2007, 14:51   #31
Senior - BHPian
 
nitrous's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: UAE/Lon/Madras
Posts: 6,966
Thanked: 282 Times
Default

Aseem, Zavoli sequential kit costs 42k in Chennai.
This kit basically has four fuel-injectors drilled to the intake manifold. The injectors and various fuelling sensors are connected to the ECU provided and they fuel exactly like petrol-MPFI cars.
Go ahead with the seq!
nitrous is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th February 2012, 16:04   #32
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Chennai
Posts: 51
Thanked: Once
Default re: Open loop or Closed loop - CNG / LPG

Hello,

I have a Palio 1.2 ELX run about 70K Kms in Chennai. My monthly usage is above 1000 kms. I am planning to install a LPG kit to save on monthly fuel bills.

I would like to know what type of LPG kit is appropriate - closed loop or open loop - sequential or ordinary - brand - price.

Looking forward to your comments and suggestions.

Cheers!

Tanveer
sparkglow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th March 2012, 16:35   #33
AGP
BHPian
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 84
Thanked: 67 Times
Default re: Open loop or Closed loop - CNG / LPG

Friends,

I have Zen 2002 MPFI Modela nd going to install Closed Loop CNG kit (Mostly Bugatti or Tomasetto or Lovato).

I did scan of my car and two codes came 1) P0105 - MAP Sensor 2) P0340 Engine Speed

Since MAP sensor has a problem, Lamda control system will have a problem? or in other words a faulty MAP sensor has any impact on performance of closed loop CNG kit?

I am waiting for your reply at the earliest.

Thanks a lot yar,

Anil Patel
Mumbai
AGP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15th March 2012, 17:24   #34
BHPian
 
infotech58's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Toronto
Posts: 629
Thanked: 217 Times
Default re: Open loop or Closed loop - CNG / LPG

Quote:
Originally Posted by sparkglow View Post
Hello,

I have a Palio 1.2 ELX run about 70K Kms in Chennai. My monthly usage is above 1000 kms. I am planning to install a LPG kit to save on monthly fuel bills.

I would like to know what type of LPG kit is appropriate - closed loop or open loop - sequential or ordinary - brand - price.

Looking forward to your comments and suggestions.

Cheers!

Tanveer
I am very curious to know why did you decide to go with LPG kit and why not with a CNG kit? with the current price for automotive LPG, the difference in the running cost of Petrol vs. LPG is not significant enough to warrant for a conversion.
infotech58 is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 16th March 2012, 00:40   #35
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Chennai
Posts: 51
Thanked: Once
Default re: Open loop or Closed loop - CNG / LPG

Quote:
Originally Posted by infotech58 View Post
I am very curious to know why did you decide to go with LPG kit and why not with a CNG kit? with the current price for automotive LPG, the difference in the running cost of Petrol vs. LPG is not significant enough to warrant for a conversion.
I live in Chennai and CNG is not available there...
sparkglow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd August 2012, 14:18   #36
BHPian
 
HimuraKenshin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Mumbai/London
Posts: 246
Thanked: 183 Times
Default Re: Open loop or Closed loop - CNG / LPG

I was recently told be a dealer that closed loop systems are a failure. He claimed, that in his experience of over 8 years, he has never fitted a closed loop system. He says that the stepper motor gets clogged etc, and it doesnt perfrom well(the kit in general) He said he only does open loop/ sequential installations..
what do you guys say?
HimuraKenshin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd August 2012, 14:48   #37
BHPian
 
k2max6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 482
Thanked: 129 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HimuraKenshin
I was recently told be a dealer that closed loop systems are a failure. He claimed, that in his experience of over 8 years, he has never fitted a closed loop system. He says that the stepper motor gets clogged etc, and it doesnt perfrom well(the kit in general) He said he only does open loop/ sequential installations..
what do you guys say?
No doubt the sequential kits are better but closed loop kits are not a failure, they don't perform at par with the open loop kits.
I've done almost 80k kms in my wagon R with a closed loop kit with almost no problems.You do need to get it tuned once in 8-10 months sometimes.You also can't ignore the fact that an open loop kit costs twice as much or even more.
The motive behind installing a kit is savings after-all.
Closed loop kits do not work well with K-series engines so no choice their.Sequential kit is recommended.
k2max6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd August 2012, 15:28   #38
Distinguished - BHPian
 
sgiitk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Kanpur
Posts: 7,158
Thanked: 3,752 Times
Default Re: Open loop or Closed loop - CNG / LPG

Let me put a different spin to it. We are all aware of Carburettor and Fuel Injected cars. Which is better is again not in dispute.

An open loop system is akin to a Carburettor while the Closed Loops to MPFI. As we all know the latter will have problems on sensor failure while the former will somehow muddle through.

Pay your money and take your choice.
sgiitk is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 23rd August 2012, 21:13   #39
BHPian
 
HimuraKenshin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Mumbai/London
Posts: 246
Thanked: 183 Times
Default Re: Open loop or Closed loop - CNG / LPG

Quote:
Originally Posted by sgiitk View Post
Let me put a different spin to it. We are all aware of Carburettor and Fuel Injected cars. Which is better is again not in dispute.

An open loop system is akin to a Carburettor while the Closed Loops to MPFI. As we all know the latter will have problems on sensor failure while the former will somehow muddle through.

Pay your money and take your choice.
I own a car with a closed loop system...
it wasnt giving enough mileage, so i took it to another mechanic to get it checked, this smartass started telling me that closed loop systems are a failure, and he only does open loop installs. he said team bhp is giving me wrong information, and that i shouldnt read so much on the net. lol
btw, could you tell me what i could do to check the mileage problem...?
i did everything? new air filter, new cng mixer, new plugs.
is there a way to get rid off the engine check light?
HimuraKenshin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd August 2012, 21:22   #40
BHPian
 
k2max6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 482
Thanked: 129 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HimuraKenshin

I own a car with a closed loop system...
it wasnt giving enough mileage, so i took it to another mechanic to get it checked, this smartass started telling me that closed loop systems are a failure, and he only does open loop installs. he said team bhp is giving me wrong information, and that i shouldnt read so much on the net. lol
btw, could you tell me what i could do to check the mileage problem...?
i did everything? new air filter, new cng mixer, new plugs.
is there a way to get rid off the engine check light?
As far as mileage is concerned,is your car giving the desired mileage on petrol?
Do you have lambda installed?

To get rid off the engine check light, take out the battery wires for approx 15 mins and it should be gone after you reconnect.

Which car are you talking of ?
k2max6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd August 2012, 21:41   #41
BHPian
 
HimuraKenshin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Mumbai/London
Posts: 246
Thanked: 183 Times
Default Re: Open loop or Closed loop - CNG / LPG

Quote:
Originally Posted by k2max6 View Post
As far as mileage is concerned,is your car giving the desired mileage on petrol?
Do you have lambda installed?

To get rid off the engine check light, take out the battery wires for approx 15 mins and it should be gone after you reconnect.

Which car are you talking of ?
I own a 2006 swift. (not a k series engine)
The kit is a advanced closed loop, with TAP, emulator, lambda etc...
as far as i remember, mileage on petrol was perfectly fine..
I tried disconnecting the battery, the engine check light doesnt go...
please help
HimuraKenshin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th August 2012, 09:59   #42
BHPian
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: DELHI
Posts: 630
Thanked: 323 Times
Default Re: Open loop or Closed loop - CNG / LPG

What kit would you guys recommend for a 2006 Santro XO that has run 70,000 kms.

I would also like to know:
- What is the cost of various branded kits?
- Should I opt for the Dealer to get the Kit installed or are there any recommended Fitters in Delhi?
- what is the Mileage that I can expect with a CNG kit,
- Capacity of the cylinder.

On Petrol, my Santro gives about 12kmpl (AC on), 14 kmpl (w/o AC)& 15kmpl (AC on) on highways.
My usage is 200 kms of NCR city driving per week, in pretty much bumper to bumper traffic.
Also,are there any adverse effects of using CNG? Smell, Power loss, increased engine wear and tear etc?

thanks in advance!

Last edited by BUXX : 24th August 2012 at 10:01.
BUXX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th August 2012, 18:31   #43
BHPian
 
HimuraKenshin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Mumbai/London
Posts: 246
Thanked: 183 Times
Default Re: Open loop or Closed loop - CNG / LPG

Quote:
Originally Posted by BUXX View Post
What kit would you guys recommend for a 2006 Santro XO that has run 70,000 kms.

I would also like to know:
- What is the cost of various branded kits?
- Should I opt for the Dealer to get the Kit installed or are there any recommended Fitters in Delhi?
- what is the Mileage that I can expect with a CNG kit,
- Capacity of the cylinder.

On Petrol, my Santro gives about 12kmpl (AC on), 14 kmpl (w/o AC)& 15kmpl (AC on) on highways.
My usage is 200 kms of NCR city driving per week, in pretty much bumper to bumper traffic.
Also,are there any adverse effects of using CNG? Smell, Power loss, increased engine wear and tear etc?

thanks in advance!
i would recommend a a BRC kit.
A closed loop system shouldnt cost you more than 35000.

The other options are lovato and Tomasetto Achielle.
you should get around 20Kms/KG

There will be a minute power loss at the lower end, there is no wear and tear to the engine and you wont get any smell unless there is a leak.
HimuraKenshin is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Old 25th August 2012, 12:24   #44
BHPian
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: DELHI
Posts: 630
Thanked: 323 Times
Default Re: Open loop or Closed loop - CNG / LPG

Thank you HimuraKenshin for the reply. Can you tell me what is the capacity of the CNG cylinder?
BUXX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25th August 2012, 23:00   #45
BHPian
 
HimuraKenshin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Mumbai/London
Posts: 246
Thanked: 183 Times
Default Re: Open loop or Closed loop - CNG / LPG

Quote:
Originally Posted by BUXX View Post
Thank you HimuraKenshin for the reply. Can you tell me what is the capacity of the CNG cylinder?
i think for a santor, installer usually fit a 14KG tank, you should be able to fill 8-9Kgs of gas in this.
HimuraKenshin is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
ooty to coimbatore road closed or open to traffic? nutmello Route / Travel Queries 3 5th February 2010 11:28
Open open open Sesame!! VJ_MAVRICK Shifting gears 12 10th January 2008 15:24
Wagon-R: VXi+LPG OR LXi+Upgrades+LPG? EDIT: Now booked LXi sohu9 Hatchbacks 14 16th January 2007 13:37


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 06:56.

Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks