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Old 19th October 2015, 14:38   #31
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Default Torsion beam simulation

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Originally Posted by alpha1 View Post
you have linked to the t-bhp attachment - there is no animated gif file.
Fixed-

Bump on one side wheel

Uneven bump on both sides

Movement during cornering

Note: These animations are exaggerated, movement is much less in real life
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Old 30th January 2017, 23:17   #32
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Default Re: Why are car makers abandoning independent rear suspension?

I was wondering why my more than a decade old Esteem was riding and handling much better than my relatively newer and more expensive 2012 Verna.

The reason was the Esteem had independent rear suspension while the Verna just has solid rear axle. Shame manufacturers do this on car's now just to cut costs.

I believe if a customer wants IRS he has to look at D1 segment and above. Shamefully even D1 segment car's like some variants of the Octavia have solid rear axle.
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Old 31st January 2017, 00:13   #33
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Default Re: Why are car makers abandoning independent rear suspension?

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Originally Posted by stanjohn123 View Post
I was wondering why my more than a decade old Esteem was riding and handling much better than my relatively newer and more expensive 2012 Verna.

The reason was the Esteem had independent rear suspension while the Verna just has solid rear axle. Shame manufacturers do this on car's now just to cut costs.

I believe if a customer wants IRS he has to look at D1 segment and above. Shamefully even D1 segment car's like some variants of the Octavia have solid rear axle.

Even in the D1/D2 segment, only the Jetta and the 1.8TSi engined Octavia get a multi link rear suspension. Additionally, the Hexa has a sophisticated 5 link setup and the AWD variant of the Duster gets IRS. This depth in engineering shows in the way they drive.

Rest, all other cars make do with a basic torsion beam setup at the back.

The only real reason I can think of is cost. We are a market where all the customer wants is chrome, push button start and DRLs. Manufacturers are happy to cheap out when the customer is blissfully ignorant.

Last edited by Shreyans_Jain : 31st January 2017 at 00:16.
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Old 31st January 2017, 00:42   #34
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Default Re: Why are car makers abandoning independent rear suspension?

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Originally Posted by Shreyans_Jain View Post
...Additionally, the Hexa has a sophisticated 5 link setup and the AWD variant of the Duster gets IRS. This depth in engineering shows in the way they drive.

Rest, all other cars make do with a basic torsion beam setup at the back.

The only real reason I can think of is cost. We are a market where all the customer wants is chrome, push button start and DRLs. Manufacturers are happy to cheap out when the customer is blissfully ignorant.
Aria has always had a 5 link suspension setup. (IIRC even Safari has had the same.)

As you said, the main reason is R&D cost and benefit of ignorant customer. If customer is happy with something cheaper to develop, then why bother spending on R&D and giving customers something better.

But this is not at all to say that Tata Motors follows this policy in everything. Just that they didn't seem to have followed that principle in this aspect (possibly thinking people would recognise this tech as it provided a good ride quality).
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Old 31st January 2017, 00:59   #35
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Default Re: Why are car makers abandoning independent rear suspension?

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Originally Posted by GrammarNazi View Post
But this is not at all to say that Tata Motors follows this policy in everything. Just that they didn't seem to have followed that principle in this aspect (possibly thinking people would recognise this tech as it provided a good ride quality).
I believe Tata Motors has always been a bit of an exception when it comes to the sheer technical and engineering depth they are willing to put into their products when push comes the shove.

For their times, cars like the Sierra, Tata Estate, Safari and even the original Indica were pretty advanced for their segments from a purely mechanical point of view. The Nano might not have sold much but it was a marvel of miniaturization and cost engineering.

Tata Motors is one underrated car company and is capable of truly great things when it applies itself.
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Old 31st January 2017, 01:57   #36
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Default Re: Why are car makers abandoning independent rear suspension?

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Originally Posted by Shreyans_Jain View Post
I...
Tata Motors is one underrated car company and is capable of truly great things when it applies itself.
Having been a close follower of Tata Motors, Having owned a Nano for close to 7 years, having being called by the Ex-MD to give suggestions about the cars Tata should develop (after being guided through its factories processes etc), I guess I can give a statement qualifying about all of the above you mentioned.

But at the same time I'd have to admit that it isn't (just like any company can't be) the absolute all round bestest company when it comes to regular passenger automobiles. It has (just like any company) its positives, but an undeniable set of non-positives too (having experienced their dealers and ASCs first hand, maybe I can qualify to say that too).

Just that the market has accepted the kind of non-positives that others offer (like Maruti flimsy build quality, or Toyota crazy high prices, etc), and rejected on a regular basis (initially due to the unforgiving ASC experience, later as the brand value took a beating), whatever Tata has had to offer, including rather capable products like Zest (not just the car but also the ASCs attitude towards Zest owners etc).

Generally I'd be positive about this company's future and would like to end with a "Let's see", but having seen the response of family, friends, acquaintances and even enthusiasts to the Hexa's price, I'd rather say "nevermind" now on.

Have a great day.

Last edited by GrammarNazi : 31st January 2017 at 02:01.
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