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Old 23rd September 2007, 08:40   #1
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Unhappy Engine Overheating... Siena 1.6

Mod Note : Please continue the discussion in our Engine Overheating Article (What to do if your Engine Overheats on the road). Thanks

Hi

I've been noticing this lately that the engine temp touches half
mark and the fan starts in low speed... Isn't the temp supposed to hover
between 1/4th and 1/3rd...

Even with the a/c it touches half mark and fan starts in high speed
and cuts down to slow in few seconds... and temp comes down to
1/3rd...

but still above 1/4th... The a/c becomes ineffective when the temp
touces 1/3rd and 1/2 mark...

could 1.6 owners please fill in...

well i don't know if i'm right or wrong but I have seen the fan
working at 1/4th mark and keeping the temp around it...

have checked fan relay, switch, radiator air lock... will check
thermostat valve on monday... car's at greentarcks/javali...

We tried flushing water while running the car at high rpm around 4000-
5000, with water hose inside the coolant box and the pipe taken off for draining, it cooled down instantly was at low temp idle position...

Plaio/Siena 1.6 users could take a pic of the engine temp gauge at normal operation conditions like traffic etc would be useful, as words are different then how it looks.

Please help...

Regards
Samy
Fiat Siena Weekend 1.6
bangalore

Last edited by GTO : 25th January 2013 at 10:44. Reason: Link to Article
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Old 24th September 2007, 06:52   #2
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Well its nothing much to worry about even i had faced the same problem with my 1.2 Siena that i had bought in 2000, even i tried all that you have mentioned above, but to no vain. Finally sold the car cos i had a Baleno and now an Sx4, the main reason for this problem lies in the cooling system it self that car was developed in the cold countries where even the summer temp's rarely touch a max of 32degrees, but in India the temp,s hit higher than that, but Fiat with their cost cutting idea have put in the same system and it has to work hard and hence the cooling efficiency drops and after a while the gauge reads up to half, the best way to sort of keep it efficient is to check the coolent level every week and keep it toped up all the time..

Last edited by memo45_m : 24th September 2007 at 06:53. Reason: spellings
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Old 24th September 2007, 07:12   #3
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Default Any proof for this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by memo45_m View Post
Well its nothing much to worry about even i had faced the same problem with my 1.2 Siena that i had bought in 2000, even i tried all that you have mentioned above, but to no vain. Finally sold the car cos i had a Baleno and now an Sx4, the main reason for this problem lies in the cooling system it self that car was developed in the cold countries where even the summer temp's rarely touch a max of 32degrees, but in India the temp,s hit higher than that, but Fiat with their cost cutting idea have put in the same system and it has to work hard and hence the cooling efficiency drops and after a while the gauge reads up to half, the best way to sort of keep it efficient is to check the coolent level every week and keep it toped up all the time..

Rather than just saying, do you have any evidence to prove your claim that FIAT has not thought about Indian Climate?

Also , from the signature of the creator of this thread, he is from Bangalore. I believe Bangalore has much lower summer temp than Rajasthan!!

Please note that Palio is a car that is also in South Africa and Brazil. In fact Palio to Brazil is Padmini to Mumbai.

Coming back to the issue, a picture of your temp gauge when its overheating will help us to evaluate whether its really overheating or not.

Also, did you check the cooling fan is switching on when it is required? An engine scan will help to identify if there are any issues with it.

Hope it gets resolved soon.
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Old 25th September 2007, 12:46   #4
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Default Hi..

Well the fan kicks only at half mark exact... nothing below it...
when I turn on teh a/c the fan spins at high speed for few minutes and cuts off...

I'll take a pic makes more sense...

Regards
Samy
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Old 25th September 2007, 14:06   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by urdudesamy View Post
Well the fan kicks only at half mark exact... nothing below it...
when I turn on teh a/c the fan spins at high speed for few minutes and cuts off...

I'll take a pic makes more sense...

Regards
Samy
It seems that your fan is kicking in only in high speed mode. There is something called the thermostat switch. I guess it switches on and off the fan based on the temp. Get it checked.

Is you a/c cooling as before ir is it also not working.
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Old 25th September 2007, 14:16   #6
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I agree with gemithomas. Get you thermostat checked. Is the heating behavior same in case when AC is switched on
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Old 26th September 2007, 06:27   #7
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:( kicks in slow mode when it has to kick in high speed... a/c doesn't cool that much when around half mark... if its afternoon there's no use running a/c. However, in the evening it cools. Greentracks did check the thermostat valve and the thermostat unit which is built in together.

When i turn on the a/c the high speed fan kicks in for few seconds and cuts off...

Quote:
Originally Posted by gemithomas View Post
It seems that your fan is kicking in only in high speed mode. There is something called the thermostat switch. I guess it switches on and off the fan based on the temp. Get it checked.

Is you a/c cooling as before ir is it also not working.
Will go to concorde for ECU diags on thrusday...

Regards
Samy
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Old 26th September 2007, 20:33   #8
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Am not a techy . Have you checked if the ac gas needs a topup?
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Old 27th September 2007, 08:32   #9
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Default some tips .

hi,
do u oprate the cabin heater?
i think its fully or partially clogged.
any way
run the engine and while the engine is running @ 3000 rpm, on off on off the heater switch/knob several times .till very hot air comes through the air vents.
this will clear the passage to some extent,
then after the car cools down ,check out the coolent colour , if its dirty be sure the heater matrix is the culprit .
clean it with radiator flush with 3000- 4000 rpm bursts for @ 20- 50 kms drive
then double flush the system .
IF THE VENTS THROWS HOT AIR IMMEDIATELY AT THE FIRST PLACE then there is a major possibility of air pocket in the cooling path and its trapped either in the head or the radiator.
if u have replaced the coolent every 20000 / 1 year then there is very very less chance that the thermostat is the problems <in 7 years at fiat dealership we have changed only5or 8 thermostats on 1.6 engines so they are utter reliable in short, and none of them followed the schdulded maintaince >
ABOUT THE DESIGN OF THE COOLING SYSTEM OF THE 1.6 ENGINE
it has double split radiator that is - water enters in the radiator at one of the top ends<A> ,travels to the other top end<B> then goes down from the end cover<C> and travels to out let below the inlet <d>this system transfers 30 % more heat than the radiator of the same size and standard one way in other way out type .
80 % of the coolent goes to head and 20% goes to the block .
.. please understand the cooling system designs of moderm fiat cars.. thats one of the reasons of ultra long life of the engines and no oil consumption cases, ULTRA LOW BLOW BY VALUES even after 4,00,000kms.
do u mean to say that as v w beetle with horizontal AIR COOLED engine designed only for germany that too the for an avrage man < u know the avrage temp of germany>is over heating and melting in african deserts? actuallu field martial romel of germany used them with 100% confidence.
the beetle engines were more reliable than the camels in deserts.
SO PLEASE DONT PASS ANY TECHNICALLY INCORRECT STATEMENTS WHICH MAY MISGUIDE THE PERSON WHO WANTS TO BELIVES YOU!
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Old 27th September 2007, 08:48   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TURBOSAM View Post
hi,
do u oprate the cabin heater?
i think its fully or partially clogged.
any way
run the engine and while the engine is running @ 3000 rpm, on off on off the heater switch/knob several times .till very hot air comes through the air vents.
this will clear the passage to some extent,
then after the car cools down ,check out the coolent colour , if its dirty be sure the heater matrix is the culprit .
clean it with radiator flush with 3000- 4000 rpm bursts for @ 20- 50 kms drive
then double flush the system .
IF THE VENTS THROWS HOT AIR IMMEDIATELY AT THE FIRST PLACE then there is a major possibility of air pocket in the cooling path and its trapped either in the head or the radiator.

Turbosam. But will this stop the fan from working properly. He says his fan "kicks in" in slow mode only when the temp. needle reaches half. I think the normal state is that the higher speed fan should come on at the half way mark. Also he says that once he swtches on the a/c the fan works just for some time and then goes off again.
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Old 29th September 2007, 02:29   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whenasked View Post
Rather than just saying, do you have any evidence to prove your claim that FIAT has not thought about Indian Climate?

Also , from the signature of the creator of this thread, he is from Bangalore. I believe Bangalore has much lower summer temp than Rajasthan!!

Please note that Palio is a car that is also in South Africa and Brazil. In fact Palio to Brazil is Padmini to Mumbai.

Coming back to the issue, a picture of your temp gauge when its overheating will help us to evaluate whether its really overheating or not.

Also, did you check the cooling fan is switching on when it is required? An engine scan will help to identify if there are any issues with it.

Hope it gets resolved soon.

Well if you did notice from where I am, I am also from BANGALORE.. and yes the fan on my car used to work when it had to work and I hade even taken the car on the track in Chennai also and it performed fine, all engine scans were done on it with me being present everytime at Sundram Motors, when I did and extensive study on the same and then ran into this website here in the US thats called MOTOR-AllData it showed it up on the techinical service bulliton that it is a common feature faced by most Fiats in the Regions where there is not so cold temperatures, and for a FACT I do know that all important fiat parts have to be shipped to India for Brazil.

Last edited by memo45_m : 29th September 2007 at 02:31.
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Old 29th September 2007, 02:38   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by memo45_m View Post
for a FACT I do know that all important fiat parts have to be shipped to India for Brazil.
Including the alloy wheels.
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Old 29th September 2007, 23:19   #13
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Does your car have the Valeo cooling system or Delphi? For cars equipped with the Valeo unit, I have observed that the fan does not go into the slow mode at all, when the A/C is switched on. If it does, then please check with the dealer if it should happen. My experience says that if the fan is running in full speed mode, then even in Delhi heat (45 degrees Celcius), the temperaure should hover to around 4 mm above the 'C' mark.

I am not sure of the characteristics of the Delphi system, so I am unable to provide inputs. My car is a 2002 Palio 1.6 GTX.

BTW the Valeo cooling system on the Palio is absolutely amazing. Early Palios came with the unit. I am told that the Valeo radiator costs Rs. 11,000, which is double the price of the Delphi system.
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Old 29th September 2007, 23:38   #14
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Default hi

if the coolent is not being circulated well then its bound to happen.
90-94 deg first speed on95-99 2nd speed on 94-90 deg 2nd speed off 85-89 deg 1 st speed off thermostat opens at 86 -90 deg fully open at 101-105 deg c of coolent temp
get it checked on examiner
it will show fan on 1st speed on at 97 deg <coolent temo in the head >105 deg 2nd on

Quote:
Originally Posted by gemithomas View Post
Turbosam. But will this stop the fan from working properly. He says his fan "kicks in" in slow mode only when the temp. needle reaches half. I think the normal state is that the higher speed fan should come on at the half way mark. Also he says that once he swtches on the a/c the fan works just for some time and then goes off again.
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Old 1st October 2007, 10:39   #15
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samy any updates. has the problem been solved. what is the diagnosis by the service centre guys.
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