Go Back   Team-BHP > Under the Hood > Technical Stuff


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 18th January 2008, 14:05   #16
BHPian
 
breezydrive's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: NOIDA
Posts: 709
Thanked: 68 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by rapideffect View Post
The link provides much needed info!
breezydrive is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd July 2009, 15:11   #17
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Chennai
Posts: 99
Thanked: 2 Times
Smile CRDi Vs Multijet

Hi Everyone,

All of us know in recent past that the Diesel powered hatches and sedans are a big success in Indian market. The most important factor (IMHO) for the success is the very successful engines either CRDi or MJDs. These diesel engines are giving very good mileage, good power and less maintenance compared to the older engines. Now almost all the auto manufacturers are either sticking to CRDi technology or the most celebrated MJD engine. Going by the trend the MJD is becoming more popular and successfull.

Now the question is with all the celebrations and fanfare, how does the MJD engine perform when compared to other CRDi engines with similar capacity?

Let us compare the 1.3L MJD with the main rivals 1.5 CRDi of Hyundai and 1.4 TDci of Ford. Please give your views on the following parameters

Parameter 1.3 MJD 1.5 CRdi 1.4 TDCi
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
1. Fuel Economy
2. Engine Noice/Vibration
3. Cost of Maintenance (including spares)
4. Frequency of Service/ Maintenance
5. Power (per 1000cc is a fair play)
6. Torque/acceleration
7. Lifespan of the engine
8. Technically Specific Superiority

The inputs from our auto gurus will definitely help others in deciding the proper diesel hatch/sedan during their purchase. So please please put in your valuable points.

@Mods: If neccessary Please move this post to a proper thread.
ForeRunner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd July 2009, 17:12   #18
Senior - BHPian
 
architect's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Ghaziabad, U. P
Posts: 1,275
Thanked: 448 Times
Default

Isn't the Multijet also a CRDI engine as well? So is the Ford TDCi and the others. These are just different badging by manufacturers, with some differences, of course, but with a similar basic technology.

I think this thread can be called :"Fiat MJD vs Hyundai CRDi vs Ford TDCi vs GM TCDi vs Mahindra CRDe vs Tata DiCOR vs Mercedes CDI vs whatever"
architect is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd July 2009, 17:31   #19
Senior - BHPian
 
greenhorn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: TN-14
Posts: 6,838
Thanked: 1,317 Times
Default

CRDi's are usually Bosch systems
The ford's common rail is Siemens made
Dicors are Delphi
greenhorn is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd July 2009, 17:35   #20
Senior - BHPian
 
clevermax's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Tvm/Amsterdam
Posts: 1,601
Thanked: 403 Times
Default

I don't know the technical details, but the Hyundai CRDis produce that 'boat engine' sound after running a lot. Listen to the engine sound of Accent Crdis which has some figure around 60K in the odo, if you are wondering what I'm talking about.

Last edited by clevermax : 3rd July 2009 at 17:36.
clevermax is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd July 2009, 17:44   #21
BHPian
 
pb10gagan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Construction Capital
Posts: 357
Thanked: 2 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by clevermax View Post
I don't know the technical details, but the Hyundai CRDis produce that 'boat engine' sound after running a lot. Listen to the engine sound of Accent Crdis which has some figure around 60K in the odo, if you are wondering what I'm talking about.
@clevermax
Accent CRDi is a three cylinder engine, where as in verna and getz its a four cylinder mill.
Three cylinder mill being inherently noisy.
I guess verna or getz dont get so noisy even after 1000k kilometers.
pb10gagan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th July 2009, 03:55   #22
BHPian
 
Ketan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 828
Thanked: 160 Times
Default

I know its a bit OT, but just wanted to know you guys opinion on naturally aspirated disel engine like what I have in my Palio 1.9D!!!
Ketan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th July 2009, 07:43   #23
BANNED
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: haridwar
Posts: 588
Thanked: 448 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by breezydrive View Post
1.3 MJD is a hot topic these days ( ever since DDis swift arrived & now Palio + new Indica are going to have the same heart), as a potential buyer, some of the questions on this engine are :
  • How many km this engine should last as compared to its petrol counterparts? eg. suzuki's 1.3 ltr engine ( used in esteem)
  • After how many km overhaul would become necessary?
Several times, i have noticed thick black smoke bellowing from the tail-pipe in so called modern diesel cars ( Swifts, fiestas, vernas & some bigger ones like Endaevour, Innova etc.) when subjected to sudden acceleration.
Does this happens because diesel emissions are more visible than petrol emissions? I mean the the petrol cars might be emitting the same amout of gases but mostly unvisible.
Guys, pl. share your views!


Well first of all,diesel should never be compared to a gas motor,its just above them and in league of its own,splly the mordern ones.

Having worked with engines for quite some time ,what i can tell you is life will depend upon how you use it or abuse it.general family man,60-90kmph ride all his life,with good maintainence schedule and mild dusty conditions,almost all crdi(also mjd) engines will do 1lc+,sometimes might go even 1.5l but this can sharply fall with rise of revs,and aggresive driving.

3 barrel crdi was completely different design to the 4 barrel now being used,it sure was just a lil bit noisy,but majority of issues came with tougher balancing aspect of 3 cylinder design.

Ok now with the black smoke seen outa diesel,
Guess what its much cleaner than petrol motors,because its black colour comes from soot(unburnt carbon particles),emmissions in ppm, diesel is almost 1/3 of what petrol engines throw out.Carbonmonoxide and nitric di-oxide,sulpher dioxide to go along with carbon di oxide(green house gas).

diesel has lrgly sulphur di oxide(because of sulphur content of diesel) and soot,plus others in reduced quantity.however govt has standards in place for sulpher contents of diesel,almost all petrol pumps over shoot it by atleast twice! dunno whts the reason for standards not being enforced,also there by degrading diesel quality!


diesel engines has a diff funda of increasing rpm,where petrol motor,allows more charge(mix of petrol/air) by oppning the throttle valve,diesel entirely relies upon induction of air,making an ultra rich mixture(more diesel),thus increasing revs with more MEP.
although mordern diesel has come up with butterflies on intake manifold,but funda for accelerating is still same,inject more diesel,this extra rich charge produces more power then lean mixture,thus piston speed increases and draws in more air.

Now the thing to note is,when you step on the pedal ,you are injecting much more diesel than the air available to burn it,hence incomplete combustion and left over fuel gets converted into soot!

although this is unwanted in world,but it still is not as bad as green house gasses and acid rain making compounds from petrol motors
dustom_99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th July 2009, 07:45   #24
Senior - BHPian
 
headers's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Greater Chennai
Posts: 4,589
Thanked: 454 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ketan View Post
I know its a bit OT, but just wanted to know you guys opinion on naturally aspirated disel engine like what I have in my Palio 1.9D!!!
@ketan: You've got a rocking engine mate! Its one of the best from the old school!
headers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th July 2009, 08:02   #25
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Chandigarh
Posts: 182
Thanked: Once
Default

To make engine life better and smoother, which Diesel is recommended for Diesel engines out of "Normal" and "Extra Mile" ?
tarunmadhok is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th July 2009, 08:41   #26
BANNED
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: haridwar
Posts: 588
Thanked: 448 Times
Default

[quote=ForeRunner;1369434]Hi Everyone,

All of us know in recent past that the Diesel powered hatches and sedans are a big success in Indian market. The most important factor (IMHO) for the success is the very successful engines either CRDi or MJDs. These diesel engines are giving very good mileage, good power and less maintenance compared to the older engines. Now almost all the auto manufacturers are either sticking to CRDi technology or the most celebrated MJD engine. Going by the trend the MJD is becoming more popular and successfull.

Now the question is with all the celebrations and fanfare, how does the MJD engine perform when compared to other CRDi engines with similar capacity?

Let us compare the 1.3L MJD with the main rivals 1.5 CRDi of Hyundai and 1.4 TDci of Ford. Please give your views on the following parameters,

i guess power/1000cc wont be relevant if the overall vehicle weight is more,so BHP/tonne would give better idea.assuming cars to be swift/getz/fiesta(base modles)



Parameter 1.3 MJD 1.5 CRdi 1.4 TDCi
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
1. Fuel Economy 15cty/19hw 14cty/18hw 14cty/20hw
2. Engine Noise(idle) 68~74DB 70~76DB 64~67DB
3. Engine noise(2200rpm) 71~78DB 69DB 70db
3. Cost of Maintenance Depends on manufacturer/vendors
4. Frequency of Service almost same for all 3
5. Power (/1000cc) 57.6bhp/1000cc 73.33 48.5
6. Torque/0-100kmph 190/15sec 240/11 163/15sec
7. Lifespan ofengine(expected) 1l km 1l 1.3l
8. TechnicallySuperiority 5 injections/stroke 3 3
8valves 16v 8v
9. Highest state of tune(reliablyknown) 92bhp 157bhp 71bhp
10.power to weight ratio 70 100bhp/tn 59
dustom_99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th July 2009, 14:34   #27
BHPian
 
Bubby's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 497
Thanked: 152 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tarunmadhok View Post
To make engine life better and smoother, which Diesel is recommended for Diesel engines out of "Normal" and "Extra Mile" ?
What say guys? Has anybody got any concrete say on this.
I think for better engine life we should use normal.
For smoother it should be premium.
Bubby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 5th July 2009, 02:40   #28
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Chennai
Posts: 99
Thanked: 2 Times
Default

[quote=dustom_99;1370230]
Quote:
Originally Posted by ForeRunner View Post
i guess power/1000cc wont be relevant if the overall vehicle weight is more,so BHP/tonne would give better idea.assuming cars to be swift/getz/fiesta(base modles)

Parameter 1.3 MJD 1.5 CRdi 1.4 TDCi
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
1. Fuel Economy 15cty/19hw 14cty/18hw 14cty/20hw
2. Engine Noise(idle) 68~74DB 70~76DB 64~67DB
3. Engine noise(2200rpm) 71~78DB 69DB 70db
3. Cost of Maintenance Depends on manufacturer/vendors
4. Frequency of Service almost same for all 3
5. Power (/1000cc) 57.6bhp/1000cc 73.33 48.5
6. Torque/0-100kmph 190/15sec 240/11 163/15sec
7. Lifespan ofengine(expected) 1l km 1l 1.3l
8. TechnicallySuperiority 5 injections/stroke 3 3
8valves 16v 8v
9. Highest state of tune(reliablyknown) 92bhp 157bhp 71bhp
10.power to weight ratio 70 100bhp/tn 59
Thanks Dustom for your valuable input.
Few Doubts from my side:

Now shall I conclude that economy and NVH are more or less same in 1.3
MJD and 1.5 CRDI?

Does the number of valves determine smoothness(NVH) and efficiency of the engine?

Thanks,
ForeRunner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th February 2015, 16:46   #29
BHPian
 
petroguzzler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Madras
Posts: 384
Thanked: 149 Times
Default Re: Life of MJD engine

The mechanic to whom i give my vista quadrajet for servicing told me that the fiat multijet (75bhp) is known to run for about 4lakh kms without much work.
petroguzzler is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12th February 2015, 17:28   #30
BHPian
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Pune
Posts: 280
Thanked: 68 Times
Default Re: Life of MJD engine

I recently hired a taxi at Trivandrum airport and it was a Vista MJD. I was chatting with the driver and he said the engine has run 1.7 lakh kilometres and there are no issues with pickup, excessive vibration, or noise, except that it sips about 100 ml more oil. I forgot to ask him about suspension overhauls.

Pradeep

Quote:
Originally Posted by petroguzzler View Post
The mechanic to whom i give my vista quadrajet for servicing told me that the fiat multijet (75bhp) is known to run for about 4lakh kms without much work.

Last edited by pradkumar : 12th February 2015 at 17:31.
pradkumar is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Life's like that: Real life anecdotes. Sam Kapasi Shifting gears 533 8th December 2017 23:19
My Italian bombshell Formosa-FIAT Grande Punto 1.3 MJD E-Pack finally enters my life! sumobom4 Test-Drives & Initial Ownership Reports 58 27th March 2011 00:52
Swift VDI+ABS or Fiat Punto MJD or New Fabia 1.2 Diesel. Edit- Booked Fiat Punto MJD magnanimousdude Hatchbacks 59 27th October 2010 13:18
Indica Vista MJD vs Palio MJD vs Swift DDiS greenhorn The Indian Car Scene 452 24th April 2010 18:11
Punto MJD Emotion Pack or Linea MJD Dynamic Pack atilla Hatchbacks 1 4th August 2009 14:16


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 23:10.

Copyright 2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks