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Old 2nd November 2008, 11:59   #46
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Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
Filter like K&N allow more dust into the engine.
Any filter which allows in more air, will allow in more dust. This has been proved in tests, and even K&N says "Use shroud in dusty conditions".
With stock air filters you do not need to use any shrouds etc.,
Of course with stock air filters, air flow is restricted more, hence 2-3% lesser performance than K&N is possible
You are right, and my 2c would be, dont use them unless you know your car needs it. I have to, and hence have to live with the additional dust that makes it into the engine. Although, have to say that have never seen any real proof that the little extra dust that makes it into the engine harms it in any perceptible way.

And I carry the stock filter in the car, and will take the pain of swapping them out when conditions deteriorate. As in, very dusty, or wet.

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Originally Posted by speedzak View Post
Just a thing to remember, never use compressed air to dry these filters. They'll give up very fast and you'll see holes in it sooner than you know. I won't even recommend using a slow speed vaccum cleaner blower in this case. Many dealers use this shortcut to save time. Beware!
Just use non-pressurized running water, clean side towards the water. And yeah, every workshop tries to clean it with pressurized air.

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Originally Posted by amit_mechengg View Post
oh ****, i have done 15k plus without cleaning it. i had shown it to my dealer twice. he says its still not clogged.

but now i think the oil holds the key here. it must have dried up and thats why doesnt hold the particles.
by the way how much bucks do these people take for cleaning the filter. mine is a replacement filter. my dealer said its 350 rs which i find is quite high.
I think the cleaning solution + oil "kit" is around Rs. 1000, can be used for around 5 cleanings. So, slightly cheap if you DIY.

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Originally Posted by ghostrider View Post
Seems like everyone says that the Green cotton filters are much better than the K&N ones. Wish I'd known this earlier. Sigh.
Not in my experience. Me thinks the equivalent K&N can send more air in. Rider is, I also think that it sends more dust in.
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Old 2nd November 2008, 12:13   #47
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when my throttle body was opened, i found lots of black paricles in it. also the intake manifold was fouled with lots of dirt.

now does this mean i need a engine decarb immediately?
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Old 2nd November 2008, 12:20   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amit_mechengg View Post
oh ****, i have done 15k plus without cleaning it. i had shown it to my dealer twice. he says its still not clogged.

but now i think the oil holds the key here. it must have dried up and thats why doesnt hold the particles.
by the way how much bucks do these people take for cleaning the filter. mine is a replacement filter. my dealer said its 350 rs which i find is quite high.
I dont have K&N filter in my car.
But I am using it on my bike since 35K kms now,never cleaned it,and it performs Brilliantly,recently got the carb checked and it was clean.
K&N's filtration capabilities are good,although some people curse it,but it has never let me down.
350 bucks for cleaning is kind of Okay.
Dealer here charges 200 bucks for a Small filter like RC-1060

Last edited by akshay4587 : 2nd November 2008 at 12:22.
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Old 2nd November 2008, 13:37   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amit_mechengg View Post
when my throttle body was opened, i found lots of black paricles in it. also the intake manifold was fouled with lots of dirt.

now does this mean i need a engine decarb immediately?
Not really. Unless there are signs of deterioration in performance.
I'd say switch back to the stock filter and with some spirited driving most of the loose carbon would get blown out!
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Old 2nd November 2008, 18:44   #50
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Default K&N will damage your engine

Let me just start by saying that I have used K&N air filters in at least 10 different vehicles over the past several years, and have found a performance improvement every time.

HOWEVER, there are 2 very big downsides to using a K&N:

1. The oil from the K&N will find its way into the MAF and cause problems. I have had a couple of replacements of MAF units over the years, and most likely the root cause was the K&N filter.

2. Lower air restriction (K&N) = Less filtration. In other words, the K&N filter allows some fine dust through. This is a very bad situation for high dust conditions that prevail in most of India. This will shorten your engine life.

So if you are willing to accept the downsides of the K&N filter in exchange for the performance increase that is o.k.. But do not be under the impression that the K&N or any other oiled cotton fabric filter, will give the same engine protection as a standard paper filter.

Nor will more frequent cleaning of the K&N filter help with the above mentioned issues.
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Old 2nd November 2008, 20:03   #51
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BUT K&N claims that these filters are way better than stock paper filters in terms of performance and filtration too. they also claim to increase the mileage.
i think excess oiling on the filter causes failure of MAF. it needs to be cleaned and re-oiled very carefully
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Old 3rd November 2008, 02:09   #52
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I m also planning to go for K&N filter in my Swift. Since the K&N Filter dynamics is different from the regular stock filters, does it affect the tunning and timings?
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Old 3rd November 2008, 02:27   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amit_mechengg View Post
BUT K&N claims that these filters are way better than stock paper filters in terms of performance and filtration too. they also claim to increase the mileage.
i think excess oiling on the filter causes failure of MAF. it needs to be cleaned and re-oiled very carefully

You are correct in stating that K&N "claims". They can claim whatever they want, but can emphasize the benefits without telling you about the downside.

Yes, there will be better performance. I have run cars at dragstrips with no intake filter at all. Guess what? The performance is better for a 1/4 mile run. No filter is better than a K&N for performance. The same holds for mileage. No filter will give the engine more air and a leaner mixture resulting in better mileage for a short while.

Problem is that K&N will allow more dust into the engine at the expense of performance. You will not find any claims by K&N or others that they filter more efficiently than stock paper element filters. By more efficiently, I mean filter more of smaller size particles. All you have to do to test this is after a few thousand km with the K&N, pull the intake hose off, and wipe in inside of throttle body with a clean white cloth. You will see dirt.

Yes, excess oil will cause problems with the MAF. But so will just a little oil. Chances are that every time you clean and re-oil your filter, some oil will deposit on the MAF. Do this a few times, and you will have MAF problems. The other problem is that if dont put enough oil on the K&N, it will not filter efficently. So either way, you will have problems.
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Old 3rd November 2008, 11:50   #54
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I was planning to go for K&N in the near future. But after reading with troubles in mainting the vehicle, I'm doubtful.
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Old 3rd November 2008, 12:10   #55
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is there any way we can avoid oil getting to the MAF. and why dont the K&N engineers take care of the problem that oil fouls MAF.

i think conical filters which are not covered might do more harm than replacement filters.
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Old 3rd November 2008, 13:34   #56
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Are conical air filters better performance wise as compared to replacement filters?
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Old 3rd November 2008, 13:46   #57
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Originally Posted by anantnehru View Post
Are conical air filters better performance wise as compared to replacement filters?
yes they suck in more free air and they provide swirl in the intake air so that you get the turbo effect.
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Old 3rd November 2008, 13:51   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amit_mechengg View Post
yes they suck in more free air and they provide swirl in the intake air so that you get the turbo effect.
All unsubstantiated 'claims' by the makers!
How would it suck in more free air unless you somehow increase the induction vacuum?
And if you're talking about 'allowing' unrestricted flow, then surely less filtration is being done!
All in all, you're best off with the stock filter, unless the 2 or 3 % gain in performance (with a price to pay in the longer term) is of paramount importance to you.
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Old 3rd November 2008, 13:57   #59
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Ok, stupid question - but if theres no gain in performance, however little; what are the other advantages of having a K&N air filter?
As far as I know, they last longer and require less maintenance than normal filter but the USP being performance gain. So if that doesnt happen in a replacement filter then the point of fitting it is?
Also, would a CAI make sense if you have only the replacement filter, not the conical one?

Last edited by anantnehru : 3rd November 2008 at 13:59.
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Old 3rd November 2008, 14:02   #60
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K&N Filters are performance filters and after using i too have seen fine dust particles inside, however i have switched back to paper ones as for performance filters to give the best the car has to be modified accordingly which gives performance but poor FE
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