Go Back   Team-BHP > Under the Hood > Technical Stuff


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 3rd August 2008, 19:56   #16
Newbie
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 12
Thanked: 0 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vezj420 View Post
yes, the MPFI fuel injector wires are the ones in FRONT along the intake runners on the rocam engine. the spark plugs and wires are in the BACK.


Hey Vez - any updates after your visit to the *** ? wht did they say about the mis-firing?
Kary is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th August 2008, 13:17   #17
BHPian
 
vezj420's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 266
Thanked: 17 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kary View Post
Hey Vez - any updates after your visit to the *** ? wht did they say about the mis-firing?
Hi Kary, sorry about the late response as I was away the whole day yesterday! so here's the conclusion about the parts that needed fixing/replacing on my car:

1) "Card" wires - These are the wires that connect the spark plugs to the ignition coil (4 of them). Somehow have gotten damaged (fused, etc.) and thus needed replacing. Cost ~Rs. 1600.

2) Spark plugs - I had recently got a set of NGK non-iridium plugs fitted at another garage which are supposed to be the exact same as the Ford OE ones! I suspect, however, that these were the culprit as MF reported that they had started to foul out. Therefore, had to get these replaced with Ford OEs. Cost ~Rs. 360.

3) Intake sensor valve (ISV) - blockages here may cause engine jerks/misfiring. ISV was taken out and carbon cleaned. Cost ~Rs. 250-ish.

4) Fuel intake hose (? - I'll clarify this from the bill) - Again, same deal as the ISV with the blockages. Hose taken out and cleaned. Cost ~Rs. 100.

If you want me to, I'll doublecheck these figures from the bill (this was from memory at work! )

A tad expensive, but I must say that the guys hit the problems spot on...no misfiring or even cold start jerks now!

All the best for your car too mate!
vezj420 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 5th August 2008, 12:03   #18
Newbie
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 12
Thanked: 0 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vezj420 View Post
Hi Kary, sorry about the late response as I was away the whole day yesterday! so here's the conclusion about the parts that needed fixing/replacing on my car:

1) "Card" wires - These are the wires that connect the spark plugs to the ignition coil (4 of them). Somehow have gotten damaged (fused, etc.) and thus needed replacing. Cost ~Rs. 1600.

2) Spark plugs - I had recently got a set of NGK non-iridium plugs fitted at another garage which are supposed to be the exact same as the Ford OE ones! I suspect, however, that these were the culprit as MF reported that they had started to foul out. Therefore, had to get these replaced with Ford OEs. Cost ~Rs. 360.

3) Intake sensor valve (ISV) - blockages here may cause engine jerks/misfiring. ISV was taken out and carbon cleaned. Cost ~Rs. 250-ish.

4) Fuel intake hose (? - I'll clarify this from the bill) - Again, same deal as the ISV with the blockages. Hose taken out and cleaned. Cost ~Rs. 100.

If you want me to, I'll doublecheck these figures from the bill (this was from memory at work! )

A tad expensive, but I must say that the guys hit the problems spot on...no misfiring or even cold start jerks now!

All the best for your car too mate!
Thanks Vez,
Well I got my car inspected today at nearby garage and found that one of the card-wires (plug wire) was leaking current, perhaps happened due to faulty handling after service, the connector inside was cutoff with the lead, so the mech jus changed that one wire and asked me to check if mis-firing still happens on cold starts..so far so good, iam happy it turned out to be one faulty plug wire..Gosh wht a relief!!
Kary is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22nd September 2008, 23:16   #19
Senior - BHPian
 
kiku007's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 1,610
Thanked: 1,223 Times
Default

Had posted this in a different thread,

"My Ikon (1.3 Petrol. 57K Kms) vibrates heavily on cold starts. The RPM Meter just jumps up and down and the engine feels like it's going to shut down. This happens for a few seconds and then the car settles to it's idle RPM. No issues thereafter. Absolutely no issues in the pick up as well."

Update --> Went to MPL Ford. They checked the Cables and nothing wrong with them. Then they started the engine, disconnected the tube from the Air Filter and sprayed some solution inside. The Service Advisor said this will clean the valves and things should be fine.

The vibrations at cold start have now vanished. Best Part? Ford did not charge me
kiku007 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd September 2008, 10:40   #20
Team-BHP Support
 
Eddy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Delhi
Posts: 7,406
Thanked: 4,683 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kiku007 View Post
Ford did not charge me
Thats quite unlike Ford !!!
Good for you

Did you notice what did they spray ?
Eddy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd September 2008, 10:48   #21
GTO
Team-BHP Support
 
GTO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Bombay
Posts: 47,763
Thanked: 89,538 Times
Default

Quote:

2) Spark plugs - I had recently got a set of NGK non-iridium plugs fitted at another garage which are supposed to be the exact same as the Ford OE ones! I suspect, however, that these were the culprit as MF reported that they had started to foul out. Therefore, had to get these replaced with Ford OEs. Cost ~Rs. 360.
Reason enough to avoid after-market plugs. Unless your car is very heavily modified (forced induction etc.), these will offer absolutely NO benefits. And then there are the compatibility headaches.

I am satisfied with my OEM plugs. Period.
GTO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th September 2008, 21:04   #22
Senior - BHPian
 
kiku007's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 1,610
Thanked: 1,223 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddy View Post
Thats quite unlike Ford !!!
Good for you

Did you notice what did they spray ?
Short lived happiness! I paid Rs.1000 for Inlet Valve cleaning when the problem persisted. The problem still
didn't go

* The Car again shuddered when starting after a long time
* There was a momentary loss of power in second gear
* The pick up had gone down. More on this later.

Took the car back to Ford. They were puzzled initially and then took me to the car and told that the Fuel Pump
wasn't functioning at its best. Seems it wasn't giving enough pressure.

Here's the Demo they gave to prove their point.

They disconnected the Fuel Overflow pipe and put the ignition key in ON position. There was no flow of fuel from
the overflow pipe. They turned the ignition on; the fuel came out only at times. It wasn't continuous. Then a guy
banged the under body of the tank with something and the flow was continuous.

Then they did the same in another Ikon Flair and the fuel flow out of the overflow pipe was continuous when the
ignition key was in ON position and when the engine was running.

So Fuel Pump was changed for around Rs.9000. The labour charge for the valve cleaning was adjusted.

Now the car does not shudder and no momentary loss of power in 2nd gear.

But letís come back to the drop in pick up story. Previously, the Car used to rev freely and the engine never used to feel strained. The increase in speed was proportional to the raise in RPM.
Now the Car
* Feels strained when revved
* Move's at snail's pace in 1st gear when the accelerator pedal is not pressed
* When I take the leg off the accelerator pedal at any gear the car seems to slow down faster
I don't think am explaining the problem correctly. To put it simply in my terms, it's like driving the car with the brake pedal half pressed (Am not doing this though)
Ford says this is normal and don't acknowledge the problem. But I know the difference when I have driven 30K Kms in the same Car.
The only thing I notice is that the car idles just below 1000 RPM. Previously it was just above it.

Could someone please help me in sorting out this issue? Any Ford specialists in Chennai? I would really appreciate your help.

Thanks in advance.
kiku007 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th October 2008, 12:04   #23
Senior - BHPian
 
kiku007's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 1,610
Thanked: 1,223 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kiku007 View Post
Could someone please help me in sorting out this issue? Any Ford specialists in Chennai? I would really appreciate your help.

Thanks in advance.
Guys

Any help on the above post?
kiku007 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th October 2008, 12:29   #24
Team-BHP Support
 
Jaggu's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 17,753
Thanked: 7,478 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kiku007 View Post

* Move's at snail's pace in 1st gear when the accelerator pedal is not pressed
* When I take the leg off the accelerator pedal at any gear the car seems to slow down faster

The only thing I notice is that the car idles just below 1000 RPM. Previously it was just above it.
The 2 symptoms you mentioned can be linked to idle rpm, which is the normal rpm for ford IIRC.

Power drop, do a throttle body clean up and complete tune up. You can do a compression check of engine to determine the health of the cylinders.
Jaggu is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 4th October 2008, 12:41   #25
Senior - BHPian
 
kiku007's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 1,610
Thanked: 1,223 Times
Default

Thanks for the update, Jaggu. Now I need to search for a good place to do the suggested works.
kiku007 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th May 2016, 12:54   #26
BHPian
 
black_rider's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 280
Thanked: 196 Times
Question Santro shudders on cold start

My '02 Santro has been shuddering some times during cold start over the last couple of weeks. Engine shakes like crazy for a couple of seconds and dies out. I even hear some metallic sounds when its shuddering. Two or sometimes more attempts are needed for a clean startup and its runs perfectly normal after that. This happens only when car has not been started for more than a day or two.

What could be the problem? The car had its alternator replaced a month back.
black_rider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th May 2016, 13:10   #27
Senior - BHPian
 
sandeepmohan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Wellington
Posts: 1,945
Thanked: 1,627 Times
Default Re: Santro shudders on cold start

Quote:
Originally Posted by black_rider View Post
What could be the problem?
You might want to run a check on the distributor and spark plugs.
sandeepmohan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th May 2016, 14:17   #28
BHPian
 
black_rider's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 280
Thanked: 196 Times
Default Re: Santro shudders on cold start

Quote:
Originally Posted by sandeepmohan View Post
You might want to run a check on the distributor and spark plugs.
I don't think Santro has a distributor. The spark plug cables were changed around a year back. But won't the complete ignition system behave the same on hot and cold engine? Why does car shudder only on cold starts? If ignition had problem, wouldn't it cause problems during normal running as well?
black_rider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th May 2016, 19:00   #29
Senior - BHPian
 
sandeepmohan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Wellington
Posts: 1,945
Thanked: 1,627 Times
Default Re: Santro shudders on cold start

Quote:
Originally Posted by black_rider View Post
I don't think Santro has a distributor.
I think the reference used is still an ignition coil pack or something similar. It is usually a unit with the spark plug wires attached to it.

I had a similar experience if not as severe on my previous car, a Ford Ikon. It would hesitate to move at slow speed, bumper to bumper traffic. On the highway, it felt like nothing was wrong. Turned out to be the distributor or whatever else the term is, that is used to describe a distributor-less system in a modern day car.

You can start with a diagnosis of the coil, then the fueling system, check the condition of the spark plugs. It will be good to get the car scanned using a OBD scanner. This should tell you what is the real fault.

Last edited by sandeepmohan : 16th May 2016 at 19:02.
sandeepmohan is offline   (1) Thanks Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
RPM drops after cold start, and engine shuts off DCEite Technical Stuff 13 28th May 2017 01:33
Suzuki Fiero mis-fires GreenDay Motorbikes 11 15th February 2011 22:10
Cold start vs warm start, is there a difference? Shan2nu Technical Stuff 6 18th May 2010 18:32
Car shudders in lower gear ajayclicks Technical Stuff 21 2nd April 2007 15:15


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 00:43.

Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks