Go Back   Team-BHP > Under the Hood > Technical Stuff


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 23rd February 2010, 17:51   #1816
Team-BHP Support
 
tsk1979's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 22,610
Thanked: 14,894 Times
Default

I meant the high pressure pump in the rail. It may be pumping more fuel.
Anyways, do the decarbonization technique, and then see the results!
tsk1979 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd February 2010, 19:24   #1817
BHPian
 
arijit.co.in's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Kolkata
Posts: 68
Thanked: 0 Times
Default

thanks a lot all for the responses. i have checked with TASS today and they say, there will be no warranty issues with upgrade to 245 but performance reduction.

now, what does he exactly mean by performance reduction apart from the evident reduction in the fuel efficiency? how much can i expect my fuel efficiency to drop by on up gradation to 245?

Quote:
Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
One liner simple response don't do it . what you feel may not be necessarily true.

Eloberating the point for fitting 255 R 16 you will need a 7J RIM the Offset of Aftermarket RIMs is not same as OEM Safari RIM so you will need to chop the inner portion of mudflap and also the steel from wheel well from same place by 1/2 inch. The Tyrewala will do this happily for you there will be no visual change from outside but.

1. You will get mud splash on foot board and lower portion of front door when ever your vehicle will zoom through the mud.

2. You should retain the OEM RIMS to get the FOC Wheel alignment with your service.

The wheel alignment values ( Caster , Camber and Toe) is different for 2.2 VTT from earlier Safaris. Also on Safari non-A.S.S alignment shops can only adjust the toe, Caster and Camber correction if required has to be done at A.S.S.

It is best to get the wheel alignment done at T.A.S.S because most of the reputed Wheel Alignmnet setups atleast in bangalore ( recommended on TBHP ) go by old Safari values so often misalign your wheels , I suffered from this.

If you go to T.A.S.S for correction they will put all 4 wheels from another Safari and then do the alignment for you because the Laser Pads they have fit only on OEM RIMS ( fitting brackets are unique).

I got the wheel alignment done after 10K km on my own at outside shop and felt a pull to left , but my My A.S.S ( Concord motors) were too generous they put in 1/2 day of labor free of cost to replace 4 wheels from a new Safari and then did adjustment free of cost but strictly speaking they could have denied warranty and put labor charges.

3. 255 mm Tyre gives you 20 mm of more rubber that is the size of tip of your finger the trouble state above does not justify this.

4. Power Steering setup will be stressed more.

5. Fuel efficiency goes down.
thanks for your response brother, but i clearly stated up gradation to 245 and not 255. i am indeed aware of the body modifications required for fitting in 255/70, so i am dead against that.
arijit.co.in is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd February 2010, 20:12   #1818
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 2,018
Thanked: 360 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by arijit.co.in View Post
thanks for your response brother, but i clearly stated up gradation to 245 and not 255. i am indeed aware of the body modifications required for fitting in 255/70, so i am dead against that.
I think you did not get it , It is not about the Tyre size but the RIM offset.

I faced all the issues mentioned due to 7J aftermarket Alloy with OEM 235 R16 bridgestone tyres and thanks to T A.S.S they fixed all issues for me Free of cost any other companey would have denied fixing FOC.

For Tyre bigger the 235 you need to increase the rim width from 6.5J and aftermarket rims have different offset. So it does not matter if you go for 245 or 255.

I would suggest that you read about offset , PCD and rim width related information available on T-BHP before you upgrade.

Choice is yours I just provided my view based on my personal experience as I feel I wasted 25 K rupees just for looks.
amitk26 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd February 2010, 22:18   #1819
Senior - BHPian
 
tsk13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 1,233
Thanked: 270 Times
Default

SS, you can't compare Indian roads to roads in Australia, Malaysia and Indonesia. Our climatic conditions are way different, particularly Delhi which has Continental Climate. These tyres are simply unfit for Indian roads and for technical aspects to my point Nikhilb2008 and iraghava are the best to ask.
tsk13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th February 2010, 16:13   #1820
BHPian
 
smsrini's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 959
Thanked: 213 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DerAlte View Post
Since there is no separate thread for 3L DICOR problems, let me ask the question here:

Why would there be copious black smoke ONLY on hard acceleration? That is, a lot of black smoke only when the turbo goes on when one accelerates hard.
* Happens only after 1800rpm in 2nd and 3rd gears
* Does not happen anytime when the revs increase gradually to 2300-2500rmp
* Does not happen in any other driving condition
* No error codes whatsoever registered
* Air filter is clean
* Happens with any diesel - Indianoil, HP, Shell

Happens with my 2.2 also. TASS explanation is "incomplete combustion". But i dont see this happen with other Diesels - Swift, Fiat, Chevy...
smsrini is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 24th February 2010, 18:55   #1821
BHPian
 
arijit.co.in's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Kolkata
Posts: 68
Thanked: 0 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
I think you did not get it , It is not about the Tyre size but the RIM offset.

I faced all the issues mentioned due to 7J aftermarket Alloy with OEM 235 R16 bridgestone tyres and thanks to T A.S.S they fixed all issues for me Free of cost any other companey would have denied fixing FOC.

For Tyre bigger the 235 you need to increase the rim width from 6.5J and aftermarket rims have different offset. So it does not matter if you go for 245 or 255.

I would suggest that you read about offset , PCD and rim width related information available on T-BHP before you upgrade.

Choice is yours I just provided my view based on my personal experience as I feel I wasted 25 K rupees just for looks.
thanks a lot Amit. i did get you a bit wrong. well now, completely aware of the issues, i will really give a second thought to the upsizing but, the 235s looks like skinny legs of this aggressive king. the same size looks majestic on the scorpio. Tatas really should provide wider tyres for this vehicle due to its size atleast, if not for any other reasons.
arijit.co.in is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th February 2010, 23:31   #1822
Distinguished - BHPian
 
jkdas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Thiruvananthapu
Posts: 9,575
Thanked: 1,234 Times
Default Tata Safari 2.2L Retro fitment

Quote:
Originally Posted by dadu View Post
So here are the details of the Updation (I wonder why they dont call it as recall) which was done.

1) ECU flashing
2) ECU Cover to protect from water changed, problem reported here first.

Attachment 167690

3) Timing belt changed

Attachment 167691

4) Timing Pulley/s changed

Attachment 167692

5) Timing belt tensioner/ idler changed

Attachment 167684

6) Timing Belt cover not appropriate, changed

Attachment 167685

7) Water pump was leaking into the timing belt casing, minute leak but visible due to the white marks inside the cover, changed.

Attachment 167693

8) A/C pipe insulation, for better cabin cooling, was done.
9) A/C condensor Fuse changed to 30A now as it would melt in the Fuse
box, again reported here first.

Attachment 167689

They grouped the vehicle into 4 types which is directly proportional to the parts/ time required, details of which I have posted here.

So if you get a call dont miss this Major updation as this is being done directly by the technicians from Pune plant and under their direct supervision.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dadu View Post
As others, I received a call from Dealer CS asking me to bring the vehicle for some updation(not clear what). They told me that it would take only 2 hrs but upon reaching there I found it can take from 2-6 hrs depending on what all needs updation from the list below:

1) ECU flashing
2) ECU Cover
3) Timing belt
4) Timing Pulley/s
5) Timing belt tensioner/ idler
6) Timing Belt cover
7) Water pump
8) A/C insulation
9) A/C condensor Fuse change

Based on what all will be changed in the Safari 2.2l updation is categorized into 4 types :

A - 2-3 hrs
B - 2-3 hrs
C - 5-6 hrs
D - 5-6 hrs

Now the best part is that they can tell you the type only once they open up the timing belt cover.

They found mine to be category D, but all changes were getting done under the supervision of hands-on technician's from the Pune plant. They would use the T.A.S.S to open up/ fix the parts under their supervision and then do the rest fine tuning and inpection themselves afterwards before finally closing it off.

More details in the TATA Safari 2.2l technical thread as that's where it belongs
Took my Safari for retro when I heard that some TBHPians here at Trivandrum got it done after they got a call.

The Safari stayed there for a day ( left it yesterday and bro picked it up today evening).

The bill says this:
  1. Starter Motor Solenoid Updation For 2.2L Safari Dicor (Retro Fit) : Free
  2. Safari 2.2L Dicor - AC Grommet Updation : Warranty
  3. Safari 2.2L Dicor - Condenser Fan Fuse Updation : Warranty
  4. Safari 2.2L Dicor - W/Regulator Updation : Warranty
  5. Safari 2.2L Dicor - ECU Cover Updation : Warranty
  6. Safari 2.2L Dicor - ECU Software Updation : Warranty
  7. Safari 2.2L Dicor - Timing KitA- B Updation : Warranty
  8. Safari 2.2L Dicor - Timing Kit - C Updation : Warranty
  9. Safari 2.2L Dicor - Timing Kit - D Updation : Warranty
Total cost was 0 Rs. I also got it washed for free and the front seats came packed in plastic covers, the one it comes in when you get a brand new Safari.

Is there a difference? YES ! drives different, smoother and more torque
Didnt drive is a way to check the change as I was late from office. Will update in a day or two about the change effect.

Issue? I DONT see an ECU Cover !
I also need help in finding if they have indeed changed/done the things said in 2,4,7,8,9 !
jkdas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25th February 2010, 13:30   #1823
v&v
Senior - BHPian
 
v&v's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Delhi
Posts: 1,523
Thanked: 1,022 Times
Default

JK,
ECU cover is just behind the battery. it a black rubber cover.
What i find missing is the Retro Fitting of Doors.

I had some additional fitting on left door.

Dont know about solonoid, but rest were on their retro list.

Mine was only cover, door fitting and software updation.

v&v

Quote:
Originally Posted by jkdas View Post
Took my Safari for retro when I heard that some TBHPians here at Trivandrum got it done after they got a call.

The Safari stayed there for a day ( left it yesterday and bro picked it up today evening).

The bill says this:
  1. Starter Motor Solenoid Updation For 2.2L Safari Dicor (Retro Fit) : Free
  2. Safari 2.2L Dicor - AC Grommet Updation : Warranty
  3. Safari 2.2L Dicor - Condenser Fan Fuse Updation : Warranty
  4. Safari 2.2L Dicor - W/Regulator Updation : Warranty
  5. Safari 2.2L Dicor - ECU Cover Updation : Warranty
  6. Safari 2.2L Dicor - ECU Software Updation : Warranty
  7. Safari 2.2L Dicor - Timing KitA- B Updation : Warranty
  8. Safari 2.2L Dicor - Timing Kit - C Updation : Warranty
  9. Safari 2.2L Dicor - Timing Kit - D Updation : Warranty
Total cost was 0 Rs. I also got it washed for free and the front seats came packed in plastic covers, the one it comes in when you get a brand new Safari.

Is there a difference? YES ! drives different, smoother and more torque
Didnt drive is a way to check the change as I was late from office. Will update in a day or two about the change effect.

Issue? I DONT see an ECU Cover !
I also need help in finding if they have indeed changed/done the things said in 2,4,7,8,9 !
v&v is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 25th February 2010, 15:53   #1824
Distinguished - BHPian
 
jkdas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Thiruvananthapu
Posts: 9,575
Thanked: 1,234 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by v&v View Post
JK,
ECU cover is just behind the battery. it a black rubber cover.
What i find missing is the Retro Fitting of Doors.

I had some additional fitting on left door.

Dont know about solonoid, but rest were on their retro list.

Mine was only cover, door fitting and software updation.

v&v

They forgot to fix it last day. Got it fixed today.

I too got the door work done, seems they forgot to mention it.

Drove for a 100kms

Drive is smoother, no jerks when I do sudden acceleration, I can putter around in 4 from 40kmph with no jerks or sort. I cruise at 80kmph with ease in 5th coz of the confidence it gives now that power is on tap far better than before.

My SA said mine got the time belt and works changed/done, the AC work was done so as to avoid water from dripping into cabin( rear overhead AC) and door work for; window to close correctly when you wind it up when you are doing high speeds ( to stop window popping ,that's the word he used).
jkdas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25th February 2010, 17:34   #1825
BHPian
 
bj96's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Pune
Posts: 766
Thanked: 117 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jkdas View Post
I can putter around in 4 from 40kmph with no jerks or sort. I cruise at 80kmph with ease in 5th
Exactly how I felt after the retro on my truck .

-BJ
bj96 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd March 2010, 10:40   #1826
BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Gurgaon
Posts: 154
Thanked: Once
Default Differential Gone

No one seem to be having any problem with their Beast for quite sometime. This is unimaginable. Hence this post.

I went to ABS Motors in Gurgaon 2 weeks back as I was getting to hear a clank sound on releasing the clutch. I was told 4x4 comes with this added feature (some double clutch bull....). While on the test drive I ensured that the service guy not only hears the sound from the clutch but also the one that was quite audible when one releases the acceleration and steps on it again. The same clank sound was coming. With my limited knowledge I told him that it could be the differential. I had experienced this on my Dads Ambassador 20 years back. He convinved me it was not so. Something to do with the front wheel. I was surprised he said so as the sound was coming from the back. Anyway I gave my vehicle and told them that they could keep it for the whole day and return it after solving the problem.

In the evening I got a call saying that it indeed the differential and since they do not have the part, they are returning it as it is. They have placed an order in Pune for the parts and that it would take a week to 10 days for it to arrive. Still ahve not received a call from them.

Anyway, how could the differential go? Has anyone faced the problem? What could be the reason?
Country Road is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd March 2010, 14:34   #1827
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Dubai
Posts: 3,841
Thanked: 117 Times
Default

Country_Road,

How many KM's has your vehicle done so far?
HappyWheels is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd March 2010, 14:39   #1828
BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Gurgaon
Posts: 154
Thanked: Once
Default

I have done only 40k km till date. It is a 2007 Nov vehicle.
Country Road is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd March 2010, 14:55   #1829
Senior - BHPian
 
suman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Gurgaon
Posts: 4,589
Thanked: 256 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Country Road View Post
Anyway, how could the differential go? Has anyone faced the problem? What could be the reason?
An Achilles heel of the Safari 4x4 from the good old days (Petrol & TCIC). Check my ownership thread - I had a problem which Dhingra couldn't diagnose or solve. Started around 35k kms. That is how I found my way to Autolinks & Atul. They fixed it (initial fix with spacers etc didn't work so they changed pretty much everything inside the diff).

By the way, I hear that the 4x4 experts of ABS are now back at Autolinks - may be a good idea going back to Autolinks

Last edited by suman : 3rd March 2010 at 14:58.
suman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd March 2010, 14:55   #1830
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Dubai
Posts: 3,841
Thanked: 117 Times
Default

With regard to the noise (like a bell ring) when releasing clutch: it was there for me. But it always came from the front and now it is not there. Had noticed the same in another 2.2, so took the SA's word that it is normal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by suman View Post
An Achilles heel of the Safari 4x4 from the good old days (Petrol & TCIC). Check my ownership thread - I had a problem which Dhingra couldn't diagnose or solve. That is how I found my way to Autolinks & Atul. They fixed it...
Yikees!!! Hope things have changed for the good from then!

Last edited by HappyWheels : 3rd March 2010 at 14:58.
HappyWheels is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Skoda Laura: Problems & solutions thread anandbhat Technical Stuff 1010 24th November 2016 13:48
Tata Safari - Technical Specifications & Feature List Stratos Technical Stuff 11 24th June 2011 20:48
technical aspects in technical driving ram_hyundai Technical Stuff 1 2nd February 2008 21:12


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 19:20.

Copyright 2000 - 2016, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks