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Old 12th October 2010, 14:08   #2716
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Are 4x4 hubs covered? I saw the booklet it says "hubs".
So TASS can say, only normal hubs covered, 4x4 hubs not covered. such is the sillyness of these grey areas.
Quote:
Final drive & front wheel drive: Crown wheel and pinion, differential gears, hub and hub bearing, drive shaft & couplings, constant velocity joints & drive flange.
It mentions hub bearing is covered under extended warranty. Yet I remember Suman mentioning that bearings are not covered under warranty

For example
Quote:
Electrical System: Starter motor and solenoid, alternator, distributor, coil, wiper and washer motor, window motors, fan motors, switches and instruments. (Exclusions: Batteries, light bulbs / units, wiper blades / rubbers, distributor caps and leads.
See "switches"? So why was I not given extended warranty for Power window switches? After raising a stink, 950rs part warranty was given(labor still charged) under "goodwill". I believe "goodwill" is when you are given warranty for a part which is not under warranty. Switches are under extended warranty, so where is the goodwill.

Similar case with tailgate latch. The electrical switch within the latch which turns on the interior lights when door is opened was faulty. This meant entire latch replacement. But it was charged with labor
look at this
Quote:
Casings: Should failure of any of the components covered result in damage to the casings, then they will also be covered and will constitute part of the maximum claim liability.
Switch failure in latch meant that entire latch had to be replaced. So it should be under warranty

Suman you paid for ABS sensor? Why. The warranty booklet clearly says "Electrical switches and instruments are covered".
How is an instrument defined? What is an instrument or switch?
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Old 12th October 2010, 14:13   #2717
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Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
Suman you paid for ABS sensor? Why. The warranty booklet clearly says "Electrical switches and instruments are covered".
How is an instrument defined? What is an instrument or switch?
Hah hah, good line of thinking Tanveer but Sensors are not covered under the category of "switches"

Besides, if you see the booklet, the problem is that they have mentioned every conceivable form of sensor separately - Crank, Cam, blah blah....so, any sensor not mentioned is not covered.
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Old 12th October 2010, 14:17   #2718
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Originally Posted by rb2399 View Post
I can hear engine noise more prominently once I cross ~2000 rpm/100 kmph.This is especially very audible when all the windows are rolled up.The engine sounds strained once I cross 100 kpmh.I know it's a diesel and it's supposed to make noise ,but just wanted to know if this threshold remains for others as well.

All the other indicators are ok i.e. mileage,no smoke,acceleration etc.
Exactly same noise I use to hear during Tirupati trip.

I also faced weird engine noise in 5th gear ~2K RPM. My speed in 5th gear between 70 - 90. Once I increase RPM above 2K noise used to subside. It looks like engine strained noise as it comes when you drive on higher gear with lower speed.

But I was always between speed band and right gear.
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Old 12th October 2010, 22:24   #2719
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suman View Post
Tanveer, bushes are not covered till 35k kms, shock absorbers are.

Having said that, Raktim, as Tanveer has mentioned, 21k is hardly any mileage so you should bully them for warranty replacement nevertheless.

By the way, it seems like your alignment or camber is out, when was the last time you got your alignment checked/done?
I did the alignment check, balancing and camber adjustment before I left got the Goa trip, did it once in Sangli as the road for Gorbandar to Borivali was BAD and so was Peth Naka to Sangli (so bad that I managed to lose my front number plate). Also, just to add, while adjusting the camber before I left, shims were removed. OT: which puja pandal are you linked with? Might just drop in any day if you're available.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
sorry rb, I guess a visit to TASS is needed.
@rideon. Remember, your vehicle has done 21k only, no matter what the job you do not have to pay anything for suspension. Tata service centers(most of them) are cheats, and will try to tell your rubber bushes are paid, but show them the extended warranty booklet. it ways bushes covered till 35000kms.
So do not make the same mistake as I did a year back.
I shall definitely press for FOC replacement if it's finally diagnosed as a bush crack. If the ends need to be replaced, they will go under warranty. I'm just waiting for my known SA to come back from his Puja vacations.
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Old 13th October 2010, 09:47   #2720
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rideon View Post
OT: which puja pandal are you linked with? Might just drop in any day if you're available.
Not really associated as such but we do visit the one near Paras & the one behind Arjun Market (will probably be there tomorrow evening).

Quote:
Originally Posted by rideon View Post
I'm just waiting for my known SA to come back from his Puja vacations.
Ya, he's back around the 26th/27th IIRC

Last edited by suman : 13th October 2010 at 09:48.
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Old 13th October 2010, 10:12   #2721
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Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
@amit, why should we give 10/10 when the job done is not good. 10/10 is for exceptional service. Buy giving false ratings we are contributing to corruption. Thats why i am against tipping also as service centers.
Well If you re-look I applied condition if job done is good and you have no complaints , If I really have no compliant then I see 10/10 as a positive reinforcement to the person who did the job and not encouragement to corruption.
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Old 13th October 2010, 10:35   #2722
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Originally Posted by amitk26 View Post
..if job done is good and you have no complaints , If I really have no compliant then I see 10/10 as a positive reinforcement...
Agree with Amit. We are by nature captious and not good at encouraging. Since, fixing a car is neither digital nor arithmetic, it is difficult to say what is "good", but, then if the reported issues are addressed and they do not reoccur, it should be rated 10/10. IMO, this builds the confidence of the poor fella and probably earns him a day's bonus etc.

-BJ
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Old 13th October 2010, 11:30   #2723
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If you analyze the 182 pages of this thread than you will see that TASS is very inconsistent at providing consistent painless service to its Safari customers. By painless, i mean the need for not revisiting the TASS to fix/refix niggles & problems.

Then too there are numerous grey areas in warranty claims, where some are able to claim warranty for some parts while others are unable to do so for the same. Goodwill seems to be a big factor with the TASS and this is something that I can literally vouch for from personal experience.

The saving grace for Safari customers with/without goodwill has been the customer care department, which in most cases have been able to effectively intervene to redress issues if any. This is why the rating becomes all the more important.

I have literally thrashed the TASS's when signing their satisfaction form after services and also with the customer care calls... which is why i have noticed that they take me seriously when I visit. I have seen numerous Safari customers at the same TASS run around circles for get their problems addressed and chats with them have revealed that they have tried to maintain goodwill by giving a 10 on 10 all the time and now feel betrayed by the TASS's behaviour.

Its a case of the carrot and the stick.
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Old 13th October 2010, 12:16   #2724
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaysmokesleaves View Post
Its a case of the carrot and the stick.
Fully agree and that is why my ratings have fluctuated from 0 to 10 , I had to give zero only once. ( touchwood :-) )

Also all my complaints till now were first raised at the website as product complaint so they were alert before I reached them.
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Old 14th October 2010, 18:57   #2725
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Smile service light issue - followup

This post is the followup for the one I posted in page 135/136 of this thread (last post http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/1856618-post2031.html).

This issue was mainly on the random service light behaviour.
1) After my last post (in April) I had to fight with TASS and Tata customer service engineer both in emails and in person to consider this as an issue.
2) I refused to
a) agree with their "song" saying that this is a fuel problem
b) agree to close the job card open at that point of time.
3) I wanted them to take back the vehicle at premium cost as TML did not know what the problem is and as they had to learn from my car.
4) I asked TASS to open a ticket at TML factory (TASS mentioned that they had already done so)

3) This made Tata service engineer active and he mentioned that at no condition the car will be taken back and he could arrange everything (including changing engine?) to get this problem out. (FYI he is on this from Nov 2009 - and he said that only TASS folks were concentrating that time :-()

4) The car was taken for service and they recorded (n th time) the details of the car/ECU status to send to Pune factory (as per Customer engineer). Also at this time they(TASS) said that the service light appeared during their drive (i.e. they could reproduce this issue). The car was sent back.

5) After a week the car was again called for service. After a day I was called explained about the root cause and fix of the problem (detail below seperately)

6) I asked for 3 months time for me to confirm the fix and I was given.

7)Till date the problem has not come and I completely feel the problem has been fixed (As otherwise I would seen that 30 to 50 times minimum according to frequency I used to get)

Details of problem:
I use to get the "service light" with error code "accerlometer error" randomly most at the cold/high traffic conditions.

What is accerelometer doing under bonnet:
Accelerometer detects the "knocking" feeds back to ECU to alter the fuel parameters. This works on vibration pattern of the engine.

What is accelerometer error:
This says that accelerometer does not give any signal (dead) or gives incorrect signal.

Details of root cause:
1) As I have mentioned earlier they had already changed the accelerometer. Hence "dead" accelerometer is ruled out. The other option is incorrect noise sensed from engine.

2) The culprit was "valve tappet timing". Because of incorrect timing/clearance, unwanted noise (physical noise) has been triggered which in turn has raised incorrect accelerometer signal. This signal coould not be appreciated/correlated by ECU as "knocking" ( because the signal will not correlate with fuel injection timing).

Details of Fix:
Very simple. Adjusted timing and clearance of valve tappets.

So now both my safari and myself are happy with improved mileage and improve performance (that what I experience before).

Finally,
1) The big battle took long time and I got the fix in the end of June 2010. I recently (1 month back) confirmed TASS that my issue can be closed.

2) I deeply apologize for being late to inform the community (as I always had a reason(health or work pressure) to procastrinate the posts - both this one and the earlier ones). Sorry again for that. I thank you all for your support and ideas I got.

3) As my car lease with my company has ended seriously think to go for new car lease. Mostly Fortuner?. Soon I will post the sale ad in ad section for my car.

Thank you,
Vichu
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Old 14th October 2010, 19:21   #2726
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Originally Posted by vichu View Post

This issue was mainly on the random service light behaviour.
Good that your problem is solved , Congratulations.

IIRC your Safari is 3.0 Liter and not 2.2 VTT right ?

Can someone please tell that 2.2 VTT has valve tappet or not , I asked this question to T.A.S.S person long time back when I asked about Hydraulic tappet adjustment and got the answer that Hydraulic Tappet is not present on 2.2 Engine.

Is this correct ?

Last edited by amitk26 : 14th October 2010 at 19:24.
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Old 14th October 2010, 19:47   #2727
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Yes, Amit
My safari is dicor 3.0.
regards
Vichu
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Old 15th October 2010, 19:18   #2728
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Kudos to your persistence, @vichu. That is indeed an interesting problem. Yes, the accelerometer signal cannot be gated for the firing duration only (which cylinder would one do it for?), but this points out a flaw in the (signal pre-)processing of the signal in the ECU. Definitely the signature of the tappet noise and knocking would be different. But then, in the interest of keeping costs down, such niceties have to be dispensed with.

Positive outcome: we are wiser (and hopefully Delphi is too!).
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Old 15th October 2010, 20:15   #2729
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Hi All,

A quick question. Took my safari 2.2 for 60k service. I needed to get the coolant change. The mechanic first mentioned that the car will take in 7 ltrs of coolant. Later we could not pour in more than 5 lts.

I saw the mechanic drain out the whole fluid earlier. later I checked from the service book and it says the coolant capacity is 13 ltrs!

Has anyone recently changed the coolant of their respective SUVs and confirm the amount of coolant used. Thanks


Edit : Also is the brake fluid and clutch fluid the same for the 2.2?

Last edited by rrsteer : 15th October 2010 at 20:16.
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Old 15th October 2010, 20:26   #2730
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
I intend to get it done at 60K since thats what the service manual says.
I checked the service manual, but couldn't find where its mentioned that the belt should be changed at 60k. Can you point me to where its mentioned?
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