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Old 22nd May 2013, 09:18   #5146
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Default re: The Tata Safari 2.2L Technical / Problems Thread

Hi,

Last weekend i took my Ex for a long 1000km ride. While on the onward journey, the car was smooth and no issues. But while on the return journey, i felt the engine is not breathing normally and felt a lot of strain while reviving. The car started to judder while on lower RPM's and steep roads. Also, when i release the gas or rev it suddenly at above 2k rpm ,there is a thud kind of effect and the car jerks for a second, it moves freely then.

What could be reason for this? should i check the filters?.
I will check it in TASS over the coming weekend, but would like to have some suggestions on what all could casue this problem.

As said in last post, this is a pre worshipped car i bought recently. I may not be aware of the existing problems in it. But it had a detailed service history and the owner is a Ex-colleague and genuine.

Hope you don't mind if the questions are silly and already discussed
I am just trying to understand my dream car better.

Thanks
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Old 22nd May 2013, 11:02   #5147
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Default re: The Tata Safari 2.2L Technical / Problems Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by BulZire View Post
Hi,

Last weekend i took my Ex for a long 1000km ride. While on the onward journey, the car was smooth and no issues. But while on the return journey, i felt the engine is not breathing normally and felt a lot of strain while reviving. The car started to judder while on lower RPM's and steep roads. Also, when i release the gas or rev it suddenly at above 2k rpm ,there is a thud kind of effect and the car jerks for a second, it moves freely then.

What could be reason for this? should i check the filters?.
I assume that you do not have the service light glowing, or intermittently coming up when you experience the problem. Just do idle pumping and see to what RPM is your engine going and the smoke..is smoke normal or sooty?? Check around in the engine bay for leaky/damaged pipes or wiring. Also cleanup the air filter. Most likely this sounds like a turbocharger/vaccum pipe damaged/leaky.
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Old 22nd May 2013, 11:31   #5148
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Default re: The Tata Safari 2.2L Technical / Problems Thread

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Originally Posted by DerAlte View Post
1. If there is no electrical output from the alternator, the red Battery symbol HAS TO show up first since the battery is no longer charging
This never happened in the whole drive and did not show up at any given time.
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Old 22nd May 2013, 11:39   #5149
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Default re: The Tata Safari 2.2L Technical / Problems Thread

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Originally Posted by gowda79 View Post
This never happened in the whole drive and did not show up at any given time.
Strange! Then what made the A.S.S. suspect the alternator? If your battery is completely drained (the voltage doesn't go to 0 - it won't crank the engine), it is easy to check with a replacement battery.
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Old 22nd May 2013, 11:46   #5150
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Default re: The Tata Safari 2.2L Technical / Problems Thread

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Originally Posted by DerAlte View Post
Strange! Then what made the A.S.S. suspect the alternator? If your battery is completely drained (the voltage doesn't go to 0 - it won't crank the engine), it is easy to check with a replacement battery.
We explained the problems over phone to a ex-TASS person & close friend ie the dimming of headlights, meters resetting, ABS, SRS lights coming off & on and he concluded on the phone it is nothing but the alternator problem at the 1st go and we also spoke to the TASS people at Kurnool and even they concluded it should be the Alternator issue.

We came to know that the battery is draining out and we indeed jump started once using a alternate battery and ran the vehicle for 200kms but never the battery symbol popped up on the console and this strange.
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Old 22nd May 2013, 11:54   #5151
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BulZire View Post
Hi,

Last weekend i took my Ex for a long 1000km ride. While on the onward journey, the car was smooth and no issues. But while on the return journey, i felt the engine is not breathing normally and felt a lot of strain while reviving. The car started to judder while on lower RPM's and steep roads. Also, when i release the gas or rev it suddenly at above 2k rpm ,there is a thud kind of effect and the car jerks for a second, it moves freely then.

Thanks
I faced a similar condition 2 days back in Ooty.

On ghat roads with ac on, the car was not picking up speed in 1st gear. Same with steep slopes.

I observed this happening after I filled fuel at Gudalur. So on a full tank.

No indicators or warning lamps came on.

Suspect the following:

1) bad fuel
2) loose connections in turbo or injector plumbing.
3) clogged injectors
4) some sensor problems...
5) clogged air filter. Was cleaned 2 weeks back. Still can't rule out.
6) air pressure at a height leading to fuel pumping issues.

The car drove fine, touching 100kph speeds once I came down to Gudalur / masinagudi

Will be taking the car to the service Center to check errors with a laptop and decide next course of action.

Cheers
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Old 22nd May 2013, 11:56   #5152
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Default re: The Tata Safari 2.2L Technical / Problems Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by ankur_gupta10 View Post
I assume that you do not have the service light glowing, or intermittently coming up when you experience the problem. Just do idle pumping and see to what RPM is your engine going and the smoke..is smoke normal or sooty?? Check around in the engine bay for leaky/damaged pipes or wiring. Also cleanup the air filter. Most likely this sounds like a turbocharger/vaccum pipe damaged/leaky.
Quote:
Originally Posted by smsrini View Post
1) bad fuel
2) loose connections in turbo or injector plumbing.
3) clogged injectors
4) some sensor problems...
5) clogged air filter. Was cleaned 2 weeks back. Still can't rule out.
6) air pressure at a height leading to fuel pumping issues.

Service Indicator is not glowing any time during the trip and there is only a mild black smoke while reviving hard in lower gears, which should be normal i hope.

I did check the engine bay after reaching home, There is no oil leak. But should check the pipes and wiring for any leak/damage.

Last edited by BulZire : 22nd May 2013 at 12:21.
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Old 22nd May 2013, 12:01   #5153
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Default re: The Tata Safari 2.2L Technical / Problems Thread

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Originally Posted by gowda79 View Post
... we indeed jump started once using a alternate battery and ran the vehicle for 200kms but never the battery symbol popped up on the console and this strange.
That could be really because the alternator is NOT faulty, as TASS didn't bother to investigate physically, and relied on speculative reasoning. Had they investigated properly (instead of speculating) they would have found the source of the problem.

It is quite likely overload + temporary short / open, which led to cascading failures.
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Old 22nd May 2013, 13:27   #5154
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DerAlte View Post
That could be really because the alternator is NOT faulty, as TASS didn't bother to investigate physically, and relied on speculative reasoning. Had they investigated properly (instead of speculating) they would have found the source of the problem.

It is quite likely overload + temporary short / open, which led to cascading failures.
The TASS indeed did all sorts of test since morning and by afternoon they concluded it is indeed the Alternator problem and there was no overload, short or even a lose connection.

The final thing was overhauling done for the Alternator & rewinding done.
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Old 23rd May 2013, 14:47   #5155
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Default re: The Tata Safari 2.2L Technical / Problems Thread

I am planning to take my car to Concorde service centre at Hosur road near kudlu gate to check some issues.
Can i get reference to a reliable SA in that Centre.

I stay in EC and this centre should be easily reachable for any issues.

Thanks.
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Old 23rd May 2013, 16:41   #5156
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BulZire View Post
I am planning to take my car to Concorde service centre at Hosur road near kudlu gate to check some issues.
Can i get reference to a reliable SA in that Centre.

I stay in EC and this centre should be easily reachable for any issues.

Thanks.
My SA at Concorde Kudlu gate is a gent named ASAF. Reliable and can be counted on to get the repairs done right. Their senior mech is a chap called Ganesh I think, and Girish their workshop manager.
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Old 23rd May 2013, 16:55   #5157
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Default re: The Tata Safari 2.2L Technical / Problems Thread

Hello smsrini

Any updates to this.. What did the SA say about this behaviour?

Quote:
Originally Posted by smsrini View Post
I faced a similar condition 2 days back in Ooty.

On ghat roads with ac on, the car was not picking up speed in 1st gear. Same with steep slopes.

I observed this happening after I filled fuel at Gudalur. So on a full tank.

No indicators or warning lamps came on.

Suspect the following:

1) bad fuel
2) loose connections in turbo or injector plumbing.
3) clogged injectors
4) some sensor problems...
5) clogged air filter. Was cleaned 2 weeks back. Still can't rule out.
6) air pressure at a height leading to fuel pumping issues.

The car drove fine, touching 100kph speeds once I came down to Gudalur / masinagudi

Will be taking the car to the service Center to check errors with a laptop and decide next course of action.

Cheers
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Old 25th May 2013, 12:53   #5158
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Default re: The Tata Safari 2.2L Technical / Problems Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by smsrini View Post
My SA at Concorde Kudlu gate is a gent named ASAF. Reliable and can be counted on to get the repairs done right. Their senior mech is a chap called Ganesh I think, and Girish their workshop manager.
I took my Car to the Concorde service centre today morning. With the help of Asaf and Ganesh, did a complete diagnosis using a laptop. Everything seems to be fine. only the clutch and brake pedals which had some play were tightened .

About the thud effect while reviving the car in top gears, it seems to be the play from rear axle which is common in all the real wheel drive cars. I did not know this.

May be i shouldn't drive the Safari like i drive my swift. Should change my style while driving the SUV.

Planned for a full service next week, I believe the car should perform much better after that.

Last edited by BulZire : 25th May 2013 at 12:54.
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Old 25th May 2013, 17:29   #5159
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Default re: The Tata Safari 2.2L Technical / Problems Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by smsrini View Post
On ghat roads with ac on, the car was not picking up speed in 1st gear. Same with steep slopes...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rahulk76 View Post
.. What did the SA say about this behaviour?
I have also noticed similar behavior in my Safari and also in Brio on a upwards slope, particularly in 2nd gear. When I approach the incline with rpm about 2k and shift to 2nd gear and press the pedal to accelerate, it would not, as if, it is ignoring my pedal press.

Could it be due to "Drive-by-wire" throttle sensor? ECU is not allowing to stress/lug engine too much by rapidly accelerating on such an incline? In a similar situation, when the engine speed (car speed) was low and gear does not match, pressing the accelerator pedal would result in some "knocking" in my wagonr (old school cable driven throttle). However, there is 0 knocking in both Safari and Brio.

-BJ
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Old 25th May 2013, 20:28   #5160
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Its by design and something which needs to be checked, even my truck has the same behaviour and even my friend experienced the same.

It gets pretty annoying when you have a steep incline to climb and the truck looses its breathe, and in the process of getting the momentum we may end up burning the clutch.
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