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Old 9th September 2015, 17:45   #6046
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Default Re: The Tata Safari 2.2L Technical / Problems Thread

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Originally Posted by param22k View Post
Hi Ameaa
My sympathies for the terrible experience you are having.
The Safari's injection system is state of the art, and if you search international sites you'll find similar issues occurring in premier cars as well. The injector problems are more due to bad fuel that we get at pumps in India than a design problem. Be patient and get a thorough repair work done, and you'll forget the bad experience when you are behind the wheel of this amazing truck again.
Thanks param for the comments. In the process of removing the injector the head is damaged. Now i am looking at a reconditioned head with four injectors. Total damage is 38K for parts and some more for labor and consumables. Though the design is just a press fit, are these things not designed to be removed in field? Its not only diesel quality, but the quality of the products do matter. I think a Bosch product would have been much better than Lucas. I have an Innova and a Laura fed with the same diesel and have done similar distances. They don't have such issues.
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Old 12th September 2015, 13:48   #6047
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Default Re: The Tata Safari 2.2L Technical / Problems Thread

Hi guys

Need help on something. Whole driving on highway, a dog suddenly came in front of vehicle. Inspite of best attempt to steer away, it got hit. Due to which the chrome plate on front bumper underside broke away. The bumper is alright. The TASS says that they will replace whole bumper. Is it possible to source just the plate?

Thanks
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Old 12th September 2015, 14:05   #6048
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Default Re: The Tata Safari 2.2L Technical / Problems Thread

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Originally Posted by sheelz View Post
Hi guys

.... a dog suddenly came in front of vehicle...chrome plate on front bumper underside broke away. The bumper is alright. The TASS says that they will replace whole bumper. Is it possible to source just the plate? ...
Yes very much possible. I had done it after a very similar incident couple of years back. The chrome garnish + the gray plate attachment (VX trim) comes as a separate assembly for some ~2.5K or so and whole bumper (w/o painting) is about ~4.2k. If you want the part# I have to hunt for it. But, insist on TASS to get just this garnish.

-BJ
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Old 12th September 2015, 16:33   #6049
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Default Re: The Tata Safari 2.2L Technical / Problems Thread

Thanks BJ

Tass here has told me that it doesn't come as a separate part. Could you tell me from where did you get it? Or part no etc?

Thanks
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Old 12th September 2015, 16:38   #6050
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Default Storme - DTC P2147 - Injector Bank 1 fault (electrical) - Low

Hi,

My Storme (Dec 2013 model, 35K run) threw up the Check Engine light with huge power loss (most probably limp mode).

Diagnostics at the TASS threw up DTC P2147 - Injector Bank 1 fault (electrical) - Low

As per the TASS, whatever is the issue is probably with Injector 1 (or) Injector 4. All the connectors to the Injectors were removed and put back and the DTC was cleared. Took a test drive and the CEL/DTC did not show up. However, while exiting the TASS the CEL came on again. Promptly went back to the SA and informed him of the same.

Has anybody seen this. Any pointers.

Thanks
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Old 12th September 2015, 22:07   #6051
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Default Re: The Tata Safari 2.2L Technical / Problems Thread

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Originally Posted by bj96 View Post
Yes very much possible. I had done it after a very similar incident couple of years back. The chrome garnish + the gray plate attachment (VX trim) comes as a separate assembly for some ~2.5K or so and whole bumper (w/o painting) is about ~4.2k. If you want the part# I have to hunt for it. But, insist on TASS to get just this garnish.

-BJ
Thanks for the reply

Spoke to Tass guys. They are saying that they checked their catalogue and it doesn't exist. Could you please tell me where to procure it? Thanks
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Old 13th September 2015, 00:08   #6052
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Hi kochup,

The problem you are facing is due to loose injector connectors or moisture or rust in them.

Similar thing had happened with me.
TASS guys fixed it and it never appeared again.

I have an obd module too which confirmed that there was a problem with my injector 3.
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Old 13th September 2015, 09:49   #6053
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sheelz View Post
Thanks for the reply

Spoke to Tass guys. They are saying that they checked their catalogue and it doesn't exist. Could you please tell me where to procure it? Thanks
Hi Sheelz.

Check 99rpm.com for safari,s bumper. You will get the part number. Unfortunately they have stopped providing tata parts, else you could have ordered it online. Wait for few months till they are online or drop a mail to their sales team if they can provide.

Regards
Saurabh

Last edited by saurabh2711 : 13th September 2015 at 09:50.
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Old 13th September 2015, 10:12   #6054
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Default Re: The Tata Safari 2.2L Technical / Problems Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by v_safari View Post
Hi kochup,

The problem you are facing is due to loose injector connectors or moisture or rust in them.

Similar thing had happened with me.
TASS guys fixed it and it never appeared again.

I have an obd module too which confirmed that there was a problem with my injector 3.
Thanks v_safari, I am also hoping it is nothing serious.
Btw, on checking the diagonistics file which tsk1979 had shared, it has some step-by-step instructions.

Hoping and praying that the issue does not require an injector change.(skeptical about the actual work.)
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Old 14th September 2015, 12:30   #6055
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Default Re: The Tata Safari 2.2L Technical / Problems Thread

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Originally Posted by sheelz View Post
Could you please tell me where to procure it....
It was done at local TASS in Hadapsar- Srinivas Auto. Bill attached. Not sure the part number is correct as it looks like a generic labor category.

The Tata Safari 2.2L Technical / Problems Thread-imag0589_1_1.jpg

-BJ
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Old 16th September 2015, 12:28   #6056
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Default Re: The Tata Safari 2.2L Technical / Problems Thread

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Originally Posted by ameaa View Post
Thanks param for the comments. In the process of removing the injector the head is damaged. Now i am looking at a reconditioned head with four injectors. Total damage is 38K for parts and some more for labor and consumables. Though the design is just a press fit, are these things not designed to be removed in field? Its not only diesel quality, but the quality of the products do matter. I think a Bosch product would have been much better than Lucas. I have an Innova and a Laura fed with the same diesel and have done similar distances. They don't have such issues.
I've had injectors of my Safari removed a number of times and they are designed to be removed in field. Under certain circumstances injectors of any make can get seized inside the head and getting them out becomes a task. Another common issue is the injector coming out but washer getting stuck which can be a bigger pain. In such scenarios the outcome really depends on the skill of the mechanic. The big difference between Bosch and Delphi injectors is that Bosch ones are fully serviceable whereas Delphi ones require replacement. I've been told that this is a trade off for better performance, though I don't have details on this.

I came across this user made custom tool for pulling out stuck injectors. The fact that someone's made the effort of designing a custom solution points to this issue being fairly common.

http://www.runonbeer.com/puller.html

BTW, the cost for reconditioned head and injectors seems good. Do check the performance of RECON injectors before paying. Official Lucas cost of RECON injector is 6500 each and they strike off 1000 if old injector is returned. This price is slightly negotiable.
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Old 16th September 2015, 17:34   #6057
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Default Re: The Tata Safari 2.2L Technical / Problems Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by param22k View Post
I've had injectors of my Safari removed a number of times and they are designed to be removed in field.
Thanks for the info. Injectors were tested in pump house, Bangalore before buying. I didnt had any injectors to return as two which came out were damaged and two never came out even in a hydraulic press in lathe. Engine is getting rebuild again as i got the gaskets only yesterday. I found difficulty in sourcing the original Telco gaskets and parts in major shops around bangalore but finally got them from Concorde.
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Old 16th September 2015, 21:48   #6058
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Angry Re: The Tata Safari 2.2L Technical / Problems Thread

I sent out my Safari GX 2009 for service at 29km to Concord Motors Hyderabad, I just wanted easy experience after last experience with Butt Motors and also wanted ECU update as it was never carried on my vehicle and not even retrofitment.

However what came of this is another frustrating experience - bill of 18k of replacing timing kit and associated stuff with total of 38 k.

Some interesting conference calls/ and emails later - here is the status, what a shame really !

Is there any way out of this mess or its given that I need to suffer it? I am totally done with this Safari and esp. TATA
__________________________

Dear Mr. Uday and Mr. Nitin,

Thank you very much for calling me along with Mr. Ramarao and Mr. Thoufick from Concorde Motors to address some of queries I had raised with you. I do acknowledge that problems I have faced previously with Tata authorized service centers in the past esp. Butta Motors near Hi-tech city have nothing to do with Concorde but sheer frustration with absolute lack of professionalism and plain cheating/fraud made me move to Concorde this time (detailed below). I just wanted this vehicle to be back in shape as much as possible and my note to you was just to ensure all ECU updates are carried out as I could not break through your professional (sarcasm) authorized service centers in past.

I am very cognizant of the fact, some of the problems are deep rooted in the culture prevalent at TATA motors and nothing to do with you as in personally and I am indeed thankful that both of you gentleman did indeed take pain to reach out to me, I appreciate that. I just want you to realize the deep frustration I have undergone at TATA’s service centers and abnormal amount of time that needs to spent for something as routine as service.

Key Facts: -
1. I booked my vehicle for service via online booking request on Concorde Motors website for pickup on 14 Sep 2015 at 11:00 am, which was confirmed over phone and email from Laxmi on 12 Sep 2015 at 6 PM.
2. The vehicle was collected on 14 Sep, I explained to the driver the problems, namely
a. The wobbling of steering wheel, loose rear bumper – which has been the case for more than 2.5 years as every time car was sent for service some quick fix was done as apparently the parts were not available and I was tired of the ungainly look. I wanted permanent and reliable fix/replacement.
b. I wanted general service and all missing rubber parts in the doors to be fixed as well as they keep dropping and are never replaced during service due to unavailability of parts. I also wanted the wheel caps of the alloys to fixed as some of them dropped off. And cleaning of alloys as well, as they had brake dust deposited over them.
c. I also told him about ECU software update.
3. Kranthi from Concord called me later on the receipt of the car and I explained all the issues to him again, he told me that he will find out about ECU software as he is not aware. I also asked him the phone/email of RM of TATA Motors so that it gets sorted out this time. He outlined he doesn’t have the contact/email and that I should speak to his bosses etc. He outlined that car can be delivered only on Tuesday. I managed to get Mr. Kataria’s email ID from one of my friend in Delhi and requested that he provides support to Concorde Motors so that they can update ECU software.
4. Kranthi called again later that day and outlined that he recommends that Timing belt is also changed as there are chances of it breaking due to wear’n tear and also some bearing of a wheel. I told him to go ahead and asked for an estimate – he mentioned 18k for timing belt, which was too high in mind and I requested for break-up. He mentioned that since design of timing belt has changed all associated system including pulley, assembly and water pump needs to be changed hence 18k. I remember that retrofitment was done somewhere in 2008/09 that changed the timing belt and associated peripherals, ECU cover, ECU software update, door lock changes etc which was never carried out on my vehicle. So I told him that since TATA motors had acknowledged the problem with Timing belt, why I should bear the cost of the associated cost – related to change of design- like water pump etc. He outlined that I should speak to Tata Motors and in anycase all these things would be addressed in the end.
5. I dropped an email to Mr. Uday, outlining the same at around 7 PM on 14 May, which I again followed up on 15th May to which he replied that he is checking if any updates are available for my vehicle etc and would come back to me.
6. I called up Kranthi on 15th May to check the progress on the vehicle as it was committed date, he mentioned it will take one more day. I asked about retro fitment and ECU update, I was again advised to follow up with TATA Motors.


I did receive call from all you gentlemen first by Uday and later rest of you as detailed above – key point as follows

- No ECU software update required for my vehicle or any retro fitment based on chassis number based on information from TATA plant.
- The water pump needs to be changed as it was leaking and not due to timing belt changes. I was also told that infact this is what was communicated to me by Mr. Kranthi. I repeated the whole set of state of statement and sequence on the second call with Mr Kranthi – which he did not dispute. Mr Rama Rao confirmed that bill is around 31k and that its normal service expense considering its 2009 vehicle. The replacement is not due to running which is around 29k but age of the vehicle. BTW I have all the call recordings so there must not be any doubt about FACTS, so don’t go about inventing facts anymore.

I am astonished to the level TATA Motors and associated service partners go and lie about facts and no wonder you have such a horrible service across all workshops, where the focus is just to swindle money and cheat customer – Tata Motors is essentially running swindling racket in form of so called authorized service centers. I mean every word of it based on my direct experience since 2005 using TATA products, and one esp with Safari has been a NIGHTMARE. I had no intention to waste time on the topic and just wanted routine service and little courtesy by TATA motors to update the ECU software.


Please, I request you to substantiate the following

1. Outline the ECU software version on my vehicle. Outline the current version of ECU software based on the advisories issued by TATA for BSIII vehicles.

2. Outline and detail – what retro fitments have been done by TATA motors on TATA Safari 2009 model till date, when have they been carried out on my vehicle and by which Service Center?

3. Clearly spell out that its normal for TATA Safari 2009 to go for replacement of Timing belt at 29k, whereas your manual say 1 lakh km.

4. Outline – typically, what parts are changed for timing belt changes.

5. Send me the written estimate of work that you plan to carry as part of the service – which is with Concorde Motors since 14 Sep – 11 AM.


I look forward to your response and its real unfortunate that in a years time and less than additional 1000km, I am again spending time with TATA Motors and their service center. I was harassed by Butta motors for more than a month last time, they stole my battery, trashed the alternator and just kept vehicle standing at their workshop without doing anything. They had some new GM at workshop at that time and he did all he could and even than it took more than a month. One of the advisor told me that typically Safari is bought by politicians at Hyd and they are told to raise bill minimum 50k whenever vehicle comes to them. Again my worst fear came true, again take out time away from work and family – and spend it on TATA motors and their blessed service centers. It’s a shame really but I am not willing to put up with nonsense anymore, I am tired of this con game – I am tired of Safari and TATA Motors.

I look forward to your response to the above 5 points.
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Old 16th September 2015, 23:34   #6059
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vivek.singh.73 View Post
I sent out my Safari GX 2009 for service at 29km to Concord Motors Hyderabad
Vivek, I was advised by TASS to get the timing belt replaced when my dicor was 4.5 years old. ODO reading was 40k. In fact I asked them to look at the belt for any issues as we were planning for a long drive. They said it was fine but they do recommend changing the belt in 5 years as a precautionary measure.

May be the safari experts in the forum can help you with more info on this aspect.
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Old 17th September 2015, 01:34   #6060
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Thumbs down Re: The Tata Safari 2.2L Technical / Problems Thread

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Originally Posted by BipB View Post
Vivek, I was advised by TASS to get the timing belt replaced when my dicor was 4.5 years old. ODO reading was 40k. In fact I asked them to look at the belt for any issues as we were planning for a long drive. They said it was fine but they do recommend changing the belt in 5 years as a precautionary measure.

May be the safari experts in the forum can help you with more info on this aspect.
Fair point, and I have no issue they changing the timing belt at all, however issue is that due to timing belt design change - after previous one was withdrawn due to design fault - they are asking you to change all associated peripherals connected to timing belt, pulleys, water pump etc and then invent a story that water pump is leaking hence we are asking for a change is plain fraud. I was fine, but really lost it when they tell me - NO - YOU GOT IT WRONG even when every call is recorded - that's a real shame! On top of it they claim that they are being transparent - and later on I receive an email saying that they are waiting for parts etc and my consent is just a cock and bull story to hide the facts !

How does one tolerate TML anymore?
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