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Old 27th August 2015, 10:34   #46
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Default Honda City - Brake pads 'sticking' on to Rusty Rotors!

Hi friends,

I have been facing a peculiar brake issue on my 2011 Honda City since the onset of the monsoons.

Whenever the car is not used for 2-3 days, I notice the presence of rusting on the brake rotors, which usually cleans out after a short drive.

The overall brake performance has dropped a bit too, but it was manageable.

However, I was out of station and the car remained unused for about 8-10days. During this time, it had been raining quite a bit, however the car was parked in our basement parking.

Now this morning, I got into the car (after a gap of 10days), started it, released the handbrake, shifted into 1st and tried to move ahead, but the car JUST WOULDNT MOVE!

I was surprised. It was like something was holding it back. Rechecked the handbrake and tried again, still wouldn’t move. Slid back into neutral and got down to check is there was some object against the tries, but nothing!

Tried again with more power and hear a 'thump' metallic sound from the brakes and car moved forward with a jerk!

Got down to check the brakes and this is what I saw:

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Notice the big dark patches? Looks like the brake pads had got stock to the rotors due to the rust.

Tried driving the car slowly and I could hear a grinding sound from the brakes, but since it was rust, I was hoping it will clear out within a few kms so continued ahead.

The grinding sound mellowed down in a few kms, but I continued to get a pulsating feel at the pedals whenever applying the brakes. The feel was similar to the effect when the ABS kicks in, but with lower intensity. It took another 15-20kms for this effect to die down.

All through this drive of 80kms I felt the braking performance was 30-40% below normal.

When I got back home, I clicked below pics of the rotors:

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As you can see, the pads are still not making full contact with the rotors.

Just for reference, I clicked pics of the brake rotors of two other Honda City’s in our apartment parking:

This one is of another 2011 Honda City: Contact looks much better than mine.
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This one is of a 2014 Honda City Diesel : Contact looks perfect.
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Now, I have the following questions in mind:

1. Is it normal for the brake pads to stick to badly to the rotors? Or could this be a case of the calipers being slightly stuck and not returning back to their position once the brake is released.

2. Should i replace just the brake pads or both the rotors and pads?

3. I have an extended warranty till Nov 2015. Will it cover these replacements?

4. If not, then could i go in for performance brands like Tarox / brembo/ etc

Looking forward to your suggestions & feedback.

rgds,

Vikash

Last edited by vikash49 : 27th August 2015 at 14:08. Reason: Honda City - Brake pads 'sticking' on to Rusty Rotors!
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Old 27th August 2015, 17:09   #47
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Default re: Honda City - Brake pads 'sticking' on to Rusty Rotors!

Thread moved out from the Assembly Line (The "Assembly Line" Forum section) section. Thanks for sharing!
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Old 27th August 2015, 22:51   #48
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Default Re: Honda City - Brake pads 'sticking' on to Rusty Rotors!

Rust in Disc Brakes isnt a big issue.

The stickiness you faced was from the rear drums. They tend to stick if not used for a long time. Especially during monsoons.

Solution is not to leave the car with handbrakes ON. Also, as soon as you take the car, brake several times, make sure the 'bite' is normal and continue your journey.
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Old 4th July 2016, 21:01   #49
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Default Re: Rear wheel jammed after car stationary for a couple of days !

It rained heavily on Friday night while I was returning from work. The car went into quite a lot of puddles all over Delhi and then after I almost reached home, the area near my apartment's entrance gate had a lot of water logging and I had to drive through that for a couple of metres. Then I reached my parking spot and left it parked on handbrake as I usually do. I remember having read somewhere that leaving the vehicle on reverse gear causes damage to the gearbox over time.
Then on Monday morning, I was running late for work already and the vehicle did exactly as mentioned here. My immediate instinct was to look up the internet. I found all kinds of weird stories about how to disengage handbrake lever. But this appeared like someone had actually put a lock on the wheels or something and definitely not a handbrake lever issue. I engaged and disengaged the footbrakes; handbrakes…tried physically pushing the car on neutral. Nothing.
Finally I was lucky enough to locate this post which told me exactly what my problem was. I then did a bit of shoving back and forth on 1st, then reverse, 1st and then reverse gear and finally there was a slight creaking sound from the rear wheels and it was able to move backward and thereafter the vehicle moved smooth.

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Old 5th July 2016, 10:06   #50
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Default Re: Rear wheel jammed after car stationary for a couple of days !

After wading through water, drive for a small distance with your brakes pressed, slightly. This will help remove water from the drums and dry out the discs too. And, use the traditional methods like a stone behind the wheel or engage the gear while you park your car on such a day or park it for long.
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Old 5th July 2016, 10:43   #51
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Default Re: Rear wheel jammed after car stationary for a couple of days !

Quote:
Originally Posted by ashis89 View Post
After wading through water, drive for a small distance with your brakes pressed, slightly. This will help remove water from the drums and dry out the discs too. And, use the traditional methods like a stone behind the wheel or engage the gear while you park your car on such a day or park it for long.
+1
Have been practicing this for the last 20 years and the wheels got locked only once when dad forgot not to engage the handbrake after driving in heavy rain.
We keep a wooden block so as to not let the tyres roll (the ground it flat but to not exert pressure on the GB). Checking the rubber seals of the vision holes of the Hubs also helps in not letting much water in.(for rear drum brakes).

The monsoons have never given us trouble but the brakes of Linea squeal when the car is not driven for a few days but vanishes within a couple of kms. Yet to trace down the cause.
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Old 5th July 2016, 21:38   #52
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Default Re: Rear wheel jammed after car stationary for a couple of days !

I've heard of this issue and have advised my father on the same when he parks after driving in the rains.

What I'm really surprised by is the fact that this is not mentioned in the user manual of my VW Polo or in any other car. Most of them tell you to engage the parking brake whenever the car is parked and make no mention of this wet weather phenomenon.
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Old 5th July 2016, 22:49   #53
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Default Re: Rear wheel jammed after car stationary for a couple of days !

This problem has been in almost all cars with drum brakes. It happens specially in monsoons or after the drums get wet, and have been engaged for long. The springs get rusted, preventing the brake shoes to retract fully even after the handbrake has been disengaged by driver.

Its best to park with transmission in 1st or reverse gear with a brick under the wheels during monsoons or after a wash. The brakes won't get jammed in a day or two for sure.

If such a thing happens, no need to panic. Just remove the wheels, give some gentle blows by a hammer on the drum, and on the area between studs. The brakes will become free.

Regards,
Shashi
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Old 6th July 2016, 20:41   #54
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Default Re: Rear wheel jammed after car stationary for a couple of days !

This is very common in rains, and even after washing your car. If one applies handbrake and leaves it for longer. Once the brake pads get engaged into the drums, even after leaving the handbrake, they fail to retract resulting in jammed wheel. Been there. The only solution is to remove the wheel, open the drums and disengage the pads manually. Make sure you scrub the insides of the drums with a sand paper to remove any rust.
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Old 10th July 2016, 19:09   #55
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Default Re: Rear wheel jammed after car stationary for a couple of days !

I don't think it has anything to do with rust. To understand the phenomena better, try skating on smooth floor wearing a pair of well worn rubber sandals. Now wash the sandals to remove the dust from under and mop the floor and try skating again. Your footwear will adhere to the floor due to vacuum. Same phenomena and occurs with the rubber brake shoes adhering to the washed brake drums. It has nothing to do with rusting. So don't do things like lubricating the surfaces of wheel drums.
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Old 19th September 2016, 18:01   #56
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Default Re: Rear wheel jammed after car stationary for a couple of days !

Experienced the same issue today morning when I have taken my Elite I20 car after 6 days. It was raining most of nights last week in Chennai.

Started the car, disengage the hand brake and tried to take reverse (front is close to compound wall). Car was struggling to move.
I thought something is stuck under the tyre and hence tried with little acceleration.
Car moved back with a 'thung' metallic sound (like releasing forcefully some locks from wheel).
Moved forward and driving the car slowly. I could hear exactly same grinding sound from the bottom (technically from brakes) as mentioned by vikash49.
When I applied brake, I felt intermittent opposite force on my foot through brake pedal.
The grinding sound and opposite force on foot when applying brake are reduced after some more miles passed. After around 8 KMs ride, I felt normal.

Now I got some good tips from this thread to take care of parking during monsoon. Thanks.
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Old 23rd September 2016, 13:41   #57
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Default Re: Rear wheel jammed after car stationary for a couple of days !

It happened to me last week for the first time, to my Duster AWD left rear drum brakes.

(Sorry for the longish post below.)

Background:
The vehicle had been parked for 8 days after a full body wash and in continuous Mumbai rain. I applied the hand brake while the vehicle stood on mud/slush.

On the 9th day morning the wheel refused to rotate. I had read that reversing sometimes releases the jammed breaks and so tried reversing it immediately. After 5 mins of dragging the wheel back and forth for 1-2 meters there was no change. Logged back into Team-BHP and checked this thread which essentially made it clear that it is likely to be a simple problem. This gave me the confidence to try again for another 5 mins but without success. Initially I was confident the mud/slush would do no damage to the tyre, but anxiety ruled and I gave up. Panicked because I had a 3-day, 800+ Kms drive starting next day, called up Renault road side - my first time ever.

First Renault Roadside Experience:
The first question the lady asked me was if I had an accident. On receiving a negative reply she requested that I be on hold while she attended to an emergency case, which I obliged to. A minute later she verified details and told me that I will receive a call back from a technical center within 15 mins.

Local Dealer Experience:
After 20 minutes and no response and so I call my contact at local Renault dealer. He told me that the issue could be simple or major - will have to bring in the vehicle to workshop to determine. Could be as simple as opening and cleaning or complete replacement of the drum in case the liner was damaged. He also said they will close at in the next 90 minutes because of Ganpathi Visarjan and unlikely that I would be able to start my journey next morning. But he ended the call saying that I should still call Roadside (which I had already done at this point) and wait for their advice. Panicked big time and sent messages to my friends about impending possibility of cancelling the trip!

More Roadside Experience:
I get a call from the technical center after 30 minutes and a lady connects me with their local mechanic. I described the problem and he said he will arrive in 1 hour - am a bit relieved. Ninety minutes after this call he is standing next to my vehicle. I was expecting some boy to saunter in and call their preferred towing company, but was happy to see him pulling the jack from the back of his well equipped Omni - hoping I may just not yet need to cancel my plans.

In the next 5 mins, he lifted the vehicle, opened the wheel bolts and using the back of the same spanner knocked at the drum and using his bare hands set the wheel spinning! And almost accusingly telling me 'bus do minute ka kaam hai ye'. He bolted the wheel back and asked me to take it on a short drive, which I did promptly and found nothing seemed to be out of the normal. I had earlier seen some rust on the front disc, and intentionally used the brake 3-4 times but everything worked!

By the time I returned in 5 mins, he was already driving out in his Omni and stopped next to me to say one thing 'Saab hand brake lagane ke wajah se hota hai ye, maat lagao, chahiye tho gear mein lagao. Apke yahan tho zaroorat bhi nahi hai hand brake lagane ki".

As Leoshashi said - no need to panic. Felt a bit foolish for having panicked , when it was a simple job.
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Old 23rd September 2016, 15:27   #58
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Default Re: Rear wheel jammed after car stationary for a couple of days !

Quote:
Originally Posted by vijayk View Post
Started the car, disengage the hand brake and tried to take reverse (front is close to compound wall). Car was struggling to move.

I thought something is stuck under the tyre and hence tried with little acceleration.

Car moved back with a 'thung' metallic sound (like releasing forcefully some locks from wheel).
Just a word of caution, based on my experience, which is similar to that of vijayk.

Mine is a Palio. The incident happened when we went to Panchgani (in rainy season). Since the car was to be parked in the open, had applied hand-brake.

In the morning, the car didn't move forward. A little acceleration resulted in the 'thung' sound and then wheel started turning.

However, I guess the combination of 'hand brake jam + force of acceleration' put pressure on wheel cylinder (which in turn has two rubber boots on either side), and caused it to leak. As a result, the brake fluid started leaking. Lost the braking ability progressively - somehow, managed to reach Wai. Chances of finding a replacement cylinder was ruled out. Did some jugaad (so as to get back to Pune) and got it replaced subsequently.

When the assembly was opened, found that one of the brake shoes' lining was also about to come off. But I learnt this -

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leoshashi View Post
This problem has been in almost all cars with drum brakes. It happens specially in monsoons or after the drums get wet, and have been engaged for long. The springs get rusted, preventing the brake shoes to retract fully even after the handbrake has been disengaged by driver.

Just remove the wheels, give some gentle blows by a hammer on the drum, and on the area between studs. The brakes will become free.
Exactly - this is what seems to happen.

Only thing is, merely assuming that the brake has jammed only due to the above, is an 'assumption'. Better way is to remove the cover over the drum (in Palio is just a matter of removing two nuts and prise away the cover), after doing the 'gentle blows', so that you are sure that there is nothing else wrong.....

Lesson learnt -

Thereafter, at least once a year, I go a local garage remove all the four wheels, and get the front and rear brakes thoroughly cleaned and fitted. And keep the car parked in 1st gear (there is a backward slope in my parking spot)
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Old 23rd September 2016, 16:39   #59
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Default Re: Rear wheel jammed after car stationary for a couple of days !

This happens on my Civic too. It has rear disc brakes. I always keep the handbrake on and at times when i don't drive for more than a day the rear wheels do lock up. The issue is resolved simply by releasing the brake and driving in reverse. The brakes release with a Kaddd sound and become free. This is quite common in monsoon season. Also during the dry season i ask the washer guy not to pour left over water from the bucket on the wheels after he is done washing. This i have observed also contributes to the wheels jamming up.

Last edited by sumeethaldankar : 23rd September 2016 at 16:41.
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