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Old 13th October 2008, 21:39   #16
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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Simply because most coolants work best that way; Water is best at heat transfer. Also, I am not sure if the thicker coolant would flow as efficiently as water.
I disagree. Water is not best of heat transfer fluids.
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Old 13th October 2008, 21:43   #17
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Water is not best of heat transfer fluids.
Would you please tell us - what is best heat transfer fluids and can I use it in M800 as a coolant?
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Old 13th October 2008, 22:52   #18
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Originally Posted by ASHISHPALLOD View Post
I never said that there is no use of ethylene glycol in radiator mix if added at all as coolant.
What i am pointing is if meg added in coolant, then it is added in coolant as antifreeze agent rather than as agent to increase boiling point of water.


but right now, you and me, both don't know whether meg is present in coolant.
Well cant say about you but I am 100% sure that Ethylene Glycol is present in coolant apart from anti corrosive agents and blue color dye.
You can read the contents on the tin if given.

Also ethylene glycol both raises the boiling point of mixture and reduces the freezing point. In Indian Climate anti freezing properties have no relevence because no where except in Himalayas radiator liquid can freez if Vehicle is allowed to stand overnight so the question is why radiator coolent and distilled water mixture is used in hotter climates and answer is clear to prevent the mix from boiling over.

Websites harp only on antifreez part because most auto websites are from countries having cold winters except a handful like team BHP are from tropical countries.
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Old 14th October 2008, 03:51   #19
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Years back in UK, it used to be a regular job to top up the water in the radiator, and to check, as each winter, that there was sufficient anti-freeze in the system. We never called it 'coolant' --- it's sole purpose was to prevent the major damage that would occur to the engine if it froze. Many people would drain the system annually, then refill, ensuring enough anti-freeze for their climate.

Now, and for a decade or two, these cooling systems are sealed and it is very rare that they need any topping up. It has become something barely thought about (although it should be a regular check like the other fluid levels) between services.

Essentially, our engines are water-cooled engines (and if anyone has a rare air-cooled motor, they are not needing additive!) and this stuff is not really the coolant; the sum total of the liquid in there, mostly water, is the coolant.

Maybe the OP is wondering something like if one third is good, maybe two thirds is better and three thirds best? I guess the engine designer has carefully factored in the heat transfer capabilities of their cooling system. If the engine is running hot, then there is something wrong with the engine or the driver!

Back in those earlier days, the cooling system was one of the most troublesome parts of the car. Overheating in slow-moving traffic was a regular event, and some of us had very narrow escapes from serious injury learning the hard way that you do not remove the radiator cap when your coolant is boiling! Thermostats used to stick often, leading to non-working heaters. Radiators of old cars used to leak, and people had all sorts of recipes (like mustard powder) for adding to the water to get some more life out of that radiator.

Anyway, maybe they put 'coolant' on the label to discourage people from pouring it into the oil! The coolant is the total mixed up recipe; there is nothing especially cooling about the stuff in that bottle.
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Old 14th October 2008, 09:07   #20
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Once my coolant was drained out due to minor accident. I was forced to use water as i was on highway. After driving for 5 mins i can hear boiling sound and steam coming out of my bonnet . I filled thrice before i landed up in petrol pump to get a coolant. Beware water in this condition is very hot
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Old 14th October 2008, 18:24   #21
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I completely agree with what others have said and suggested as water being the active member in the cooling process and the "coolant" in the market is an additive to maintain water in a liquid state.
Just to add on.
There are two types of coolants primarily available in the market, sorry dont remember grades or specs but can be distinguished by color.
Thicker ones are usually green in color and are required to be added with water.
The other one is usually light pink or blue in color and is used as it is, straight out of the pack. This types come OEM for Opel(make is ELF) and Ford(Ford Genuine Coolant). Dont know of other companies using this type but the above mentioned are definate. This type does not require any mix with water and is very thin, almost the consistency of water.
The use of any of the above in any vehicle is not a problem as long as the green one is mixed with water in the prescribed quantity or if the company reccomends a specific type.

Coming back to the original question of no water or little water. I did an experiment of my own, unfortunately had to shell out Rs.3500 at the end but here are the details.

I went to a local mechanic for an A/C check up and scince i was there i told the guy to check all the fluids. He found coolant was very less and asked me if i wanted to top it up, i told him to flush the remaining coolant and fill in new.
I dont know if he took the statement literally because what he did was fill in 3 bottles of pure "coolant" without adding a drop of water. This was the green one which required addition of water. 1part coolant and 2 or 3parts water.
While the fellow did this i was away from my car for a smoke so did'nt get to know(I only got to know this when the below mentioned incident happened and i went back to the guy with a whole dictionary of words which are not allowed on the forum:-D). When i returned, i picked up one of the coolant bottles from where he threw them(maybe he collected them because he had a huge pile of them) and read the details, it was locally made but the direction of use were mentioned as 1 part to be mixed with 3/4 parts water, so i presumed he followed the same procedure. He gave me a bill of Rs. 600 in which he said included coolant, washing and A/C Check, so i didnt bother about the detail/breakup of charges and went on.
I was doing night shifts then so i used to go to office at 10pm and return at 6am, both times there is lesser traffic and air-temperature is low. So the temp indicator was normal.
On my week off the following sunday, it was very hot, a very usual Delhi May afternoon, after driving about 7kms from home i noticed smoke from under my car rising up when i just stopped at a stop light. Gradually the smoke appeared to be comming from the hood, i quickly took the car to a side and opened the hood to find out huge amount of smoke bellowing out of the engine head and exhaust maniflold heat sheild as if a barbeque was going on inside. After waiting a while when the smoke cleared out i discovered that the coolant routing pipe had burst, coolant was spattered all over the engine bay and in process also damaged the temperature sensor due to which the engine temperature needle was showing well below normal.
Fortunately the Ford service center was nearby and i had to get the car towed till there and got the pipe and sensor fixed.

So this is what happens when you use complete coolant fluid and no water.
Turns out that the coolant expanded under extreme heat resulting in the burst, obviously it is not capable of heat conduction or it was simply too thick to flow smoothly which i think was the main reason as the pipe which connects from the reservoir had burst initially.
So this type(green/thick) of coolant is good only if added with water as its sole purpose is to keep water in a liquid state irrespective of the temperatures.(Too hot Water turns into steam, too cold water freezes into solid.)
The light pink/blue one is already pre-mixed and serves the same purpose.

P.S: Appologise for the elaborate explanation, just had a lot of time at hand.

Last edited by abhik : 14th October 2008 at 18:27.
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Old 14th October 2008, 19:03   #22
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Last week I noticed that the coolant level had dropped to the "L" mark. So i got myself a bootle of hyundai recommended coolant (green) and topped it up without mixing water .

Saw this thread yesterday and immediately confirmed with my car manual that it must be mixed with water in the ratio 35:65. I had a radiator flush and coolant change 2 weeks ago. I checked my bill and found that 2 litres of coolant was used for 5.5 litre radiator capacity. Immediately went to the nearby petrol pump and got myself a bottle of distilled water and diluted the coolant.

Thanks a lot guys
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Old 14th October 2008, 19:26   #23
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That's an interesting tale, Abhik --- although I'm sure your word for it would be less polite!

aka_iitd, I suspect that your boiling problem would have been because of continued coolant leakage, or perhaps the accident caused some blockage, rather than simply the use of pure water. Cars have, prior to the current generation of sealed units, run with pure water for decades. Well, not so much 'pure' as rusty brown, and anti-rust is one of the purposes of current additives.

Even my original-generation Civic did not have a sealed system. A long traffic jam on Clapham common in London led to my treating the bystanders to a steam fountain. I was very lucky not to be hurt at all: serious injury could easily have happened. Thank goodness I was not leaning over it when I took that cap off!

By the way... even when not overheated there is likely to be pressure inside the cooling system. Nothing except the reservoir tank should be opened when it is hot.
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Old 14th October 2008, 19:41   #24
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Very informative thread. My Corolla was due for service 40k km(main service), coolant had to be replaced, but the mechanic told me there's no real need & added only 2 liters instead of total 7Lt.
But, the coolant he added was one which lasts for 1.6L km.
He told that this would run perfectly for another ~ 20k km & after that it can be replaced. Is this a good practice, or should I have gone in for a complete coolant change?
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Old 14th October 2008, 20:45   #25
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That's an interesting tale, Abhik --- although I'm sure your word for it would be less polite!
You Bet it would! Much Much Lesser!!
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Old 15th October 2008, 01:01   #26
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Thank you abhik for sharing your experience with us. It is the exact answer of my question.

Thank you all for your inputs to make this thread informative. Please keep them comming as we all can learn more with each others experience and knowledge.
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Old 15th October 2008, 17:15   #27
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Originally Posted by DarkEraser View Post
Thank you abhik for sharing your experience with us. It is the exact answer of my question.

Thank you all for your inputs to make this thread informative. Please keep them comming as we all can learn more with each others experience and knowledge.
No problems bro! Thats what we are all here for!
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Old 18th October 2008, 10:56   #28
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Ok, Let me offer my perspective on this.

I worked for quite some time (in 94/95) in a Lubricant company whose bread & butter was making car coolants(or anti-freeze) and was the one which literally introduced this concept to India -- Golden Cruiser Coolant.
  • Coolant or anti-freeze are both one and the same thing as 'we' understand it. It's just that the marketing & use of the terms is dependent on the climatic conditions.
  • Water would be one of the best one to use but issues like impurities, rust, soft/hard water and rapid boiling in hot temperatures/freezing in cold climates are some of the issues.
  • MEG (Mono Ethylene Glycol) is present in all coolants/anti-freezes.
  • MEG helps address the issues that are disadvantages of water (primarily from freezing/boiling point of view). Coolants also have some other additives that possibly help prevent sludge formation, rust prevention etc. etc.
  • The exact % of water to coolant would be determined by the specific coolant brand. Some could be concentrates of varying degree and some could be pre-mixed ready to use mixtures.
  • Color of the coolant is immaterial. Green was the original dye used in coolants here in India (Golden Cruiser Coolants). Blue, green, pink, red are just dyes used in the coolant.
  • In a short term/emergency, there would be no harm if one used less coolant or more water of vice versa. (but 100% concentrate coolant should be avoided)
PS: be careful before opening the radiator cap for checking coolant level. one can get serious burns/injuries in the process.

Last edited by khan_sultan : 18th October 2008 at 10:58.
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Old 31st October 2008, 12:02   #29
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Originally Posted by K a s h View Post
Last week I noticed that the coolant level had dropped to the "L" mark.
My OHC is almost drained of the coolant in the tank. infact there is no more than 20/25ml. I was using the temp gauge to tell me if I'm overheating or if there is any troubleshooting. Am I doing the right thing? I have 1500Km for my next service. Should I just go ahead and Fill some locally? if Yes, then what do I need to watch for? brand etc.
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Old 31st October 2008, 13:18   #30
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My OHC is almost drained of the coolant in the tank. infact there is no more than 20/25ml. I was using the temp gauge to tell me if I'm overheating or if there is any troubleshooting. Am I doing the right thing? I have 1500Km for my next service. Should I just go ahead and Fill some locally? if Yes, then what do I need to watch for? brand etc.
what do you mean by 'locally' ? Authorized service station guys will not do some Abra Ka dabra. They will put in a bottle of coolant and top it up with water itself.

Its surprising that you are aware that there is no coolant there and still you want to think about it. Just go ahead brother, purchase a bottle Golden Cruiser, empty that into your radiator and after that keep fiiling the radiator with normal water, till it starts to overflow.

PS : By the way, try and go with your car to see what the Authorized service centers do to your cars in name of service, you will stop going there after that.
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