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Old 1st November 2008, 23:21   #1
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Default My Tweaked Wagon R

Another thing to check is the A/c it tends to get clogged and ends up straining the engine in the process revs typically start higher at idle in the process i suggest you check that too. i have a 5 year old wagonR and the main trouble for me is the A/c. tends to eat a lot of power. another way is to wait until the revs settle after you first start the car. wait for 30 secs. switch off wait another 10 and start. call me silly but it tends to work for my car.
4th and 40 will not give you much power.
IMO optimal shifts points in the wagonR before a stock replacement K&N are as follows.
1st-30, 2nd-50, 3rd-70, 4th-95/110.
Max shift speed after a stock replacement K&N now running for close to 15k are as follows:
1st-50, 2nd-80, 3rd-100, 4th-120/130. thats as far as it will take on a highway with a/c and two adults+baggage. it will still return close to 18kmpl.
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Old 2nd November 2008, 17:51   #2
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Originally Posted by valhallen.282 View Post
another way is to wait until the revs settle after you first start the car. wait for 30 secs. switch off wait another 10 and start. call me silly but it tends to work for my car.
4th and 40 will not give you much power.
IMO optimal shifts points in the wagonR before a stock replacement K&N are as follows.
1st-30, 2nd-50, 3rd-70, 4th-95/110.
Max shift speed after a stock replacement K&N now running for close to 15k are as follows:
1st-50, 2nd-80, 3rd-100, 4th-120/130. thats as far as it will take on a highway with a/c and two adults+baggage. it will still return close to 18kmpl.
Wow.
OK, let me take those one at a time...
I wait for 40 to 60 seconds after starting up the engine before easing into first and driving away slowly. Usually, the temp needle budges off the peg before I hit second gear. Could you please explain why you switch off and wait for 10 and restart? This is the first time I'm hearing about it, and any new gyaan is always welcome

Second - are you *serious*??? You run 1st upto 30 or 50 kmph, and then shift to 2nd??? And yet you get **18 kmpl**??
Wait - you mention only 4 gears... that adds to the mystery - does you car not have a 5th OD gear?

My shifting occurs a lot earlier - 1st gear up to 15 kph; 2nd upto 35; 3rd up to 45; 4th up to 60 - then I shift into 5th and try to keep it between 60 and 70kph.

And after all this trouble I STILL get an average of 18 or 19 kmpl - what gives???

Sorry if my queries are ignorant, that's because I'm not an engineer

Thanks in advance for the enlightenment...

Cheers
Ed.
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Old 3rd November 2008, 01:00   #3
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IMO optimal shifts points in the wagonR before a stock replacement K&N are as follows.
1st-30, 2nd-50, 3rd-70, 4th-95/110.
That's not optimal by a mile. The speeds for each gear are too high.

Last edited by Technocrat : 4th November 2008 at 13:03. Reason: Thread Split
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Old 3rd November 2008, 11:21   #4
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1) My shift points are not off by a mile. my wagonr is highway tuned ONLY so tends to have a higher shift point. with no strain whatsoever. also i don't clutch a lot. braking in all gears except first is done without clutch. unless its panic braking. using the clutch in panic braking prevents the engine from switching off. a potentially dangerous situation. all turns are done with left foot braking so speed can be maintained. car is driven with a light foot no sudden jerks or acceleration. also i drive alternating the ac on and off depending on how cold it gets. lowest in city so far has been about 12kmpl.
2) all cars come fitted with a catalytic converter. this i am speaking out of pure experience. my car takes about 30 seconds to warm up the catcon. but then tends to remain at that idle speed even after it has warmed up. so restarting for me tends to bring it down as the ECM sees the catcon is already at operating temp. hence the lower revs.
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Old 3rd November 2008, 12:44   #5
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my wagonr is highway tuned ONLY
Interesting what all has been tuned? Also how does this change gear shifting?
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Old 3rd November 2008, 13:01   #6
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Originally Posted by valhallen.282 View Post
1) My shift points are not off by a mile. my wagonr is highway tuned ONLY so tends to have a higher shift point. with no strain whatsoever. also i don't clutch a lot. braking in all gears except first is done without clutch. unless its panic braking. using the clutch in panic braking prevents the engine from switching off. a potentially dangerous situation. all turns are done with left foot braking so speed can be maintained...
A bit curious:
  1. What is this highway tuning? How does it change shift points?
  2. Even in normal vehicle in any driving city or highway, clutch should not be used while breaking – one should use power of unfed engine to bring down the speed instead.
  3. And what is this left foot breaking? – you mean right foot pressing the accelerator and left foot pressing the break?

Last edited by Path_Finder : 3rd November 2008 at 13:02.
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Old 3rd November 2008, 13:06   #7
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I am totally taken aback by Val's description of gear changes and subsequent FE ( 18kmpl) return.

IMO,I dont think even a Tata Nano can return such a FE with such gear changes ( shifting to 4th at over 100kmph)

As far as i know, most people shift into 5th gear as early as 60kmph on highway driving. Maybe a little later if they want that thrust back into the seat feeling.

In any case, if its returning Val 18kmpl with that style of driving then he is blessed with a good car.
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Old 3rd November 2008, 13:27   #8
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There are slight changes done some torque adjustments. i have to get the list for you. i'd be glad to give anyone a drive in my car if they wish to see a demo. i will probably be there at next weekend bang meet. essential difference in the car is that it moves a little quicker and puts thorough the rev band faster. a good car yes touch wood its a beauty. apart from a few bumps and bruises. P.S 100 is highway shift after a K&N. i mentioned these shift points as the car in question was a highway driver. also not too many people are aware of the fact that no clutching should be done in other gears.
left foot braking is essentially using your left foot to brake while still on the accelerator. provides higher stability on turns as the vehicle is a front wheel drive. for further questions i believe there is a video by james may of top gear. for example those familiar with bangy and the wagonr will know that you can't turn at the kmangala-indiranagar ringroad faster than 70 or 80. with left foot braking you can safely take it up to 100 and still not break traction or understeer.
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Old 3rd November 2008, 13:34   #9
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There are slight changes done some torque adjustments. i have to get the list for you.
The question is what changes & how, as in ECU changes & or gearing etc etc?

Please elaborate for benefit of all
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Old 3rd November 2008, 15:13   #10
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verified with my service advisor essentially its slightly higher valve clearance, clutch adjustments and a change in torque. but please tell me if i am wrong. the first info of this came to me when i had done a trip to cunnoor. a driver there had let me in on the fact that there are some slight changes made to a stock car to just give that extra bit of power and smoother flow. seems to work for me. also please note i never mentioned any DOWNSHIFTS. I only spoke about up. lowest speeds in each gear are as follows for me. 2nd-5/10, 3rd-25, 4th-35, 5th-50. 1st obviously is standstill. so if i don't want the power i just don't shift simple. no one asked how i get that mileage it slipped my mind to mention it. please note simple changes make a bigger difference than bigger things like ECU'S. also i have a stock replacement k&n thanks to which i get 2kpl extra as compared to the regular 14-16.

ALSO for the clarity of all please note that i mentioned those as the optimal MAX possible speed the car will take with 2people and luggage. without killing itself or straining the internals. also i just realised that you'll are presuming those to be MY shift points when i drive. they are a little lower and i don't typically use first much. except in dense traffic. my bad if you'll thought THAT is the way i shift. of course a stock replacement K&N does wonders for the mileage. while letting the engine breathe better. so can rev higher than most stock cars.

Last edited by Technocrat : 3rd November 2008 at 15:31.
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Old 3rd November 2008, 15:33   #11
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Originally Posted by valhallen.282 View Post
verified with my service advisor essentially its slightly higher valve clearance, clutch adjustments and a change in torque. but please tell me if i am wrong. the first info of this came to me when i had done a trip to cunnoor. a driver there had let me in on the fact that there are some slight changes made to a stock car to just give that extra bit of power and smoother flow. seems to work for me. also please note i never mentioned any DOWNSHIFTS. I only spoke about up. lowest speeds in each gear are as follows for me. 2nd-5/10, 3rd-25, 4th-35, 5th-50. 1st obviously is standstill. so if i don't want the power i just don't shift simple. no one asked how i get that mileage it slipped my mind to mention it. please note simple changes make a bigger difference than bigger things like ECU'S. also i have a stock replacement k&n thanks to which i get 2kpl extra as compared to the regular 14-16.
Downshifts really dont matter when we are trying to extract that much extra mile from a liter. We were discussing the upshifts and according to your previous description no car would return that mileage.

Also, i am hearing it for the first time that stock replacement K&N filter will increase your FE by 2kmpl

I have a stock replacement Green Cotton filter and i dont see any change to my FE, i noticed only a better pick-up and smoother revving, thats all. you seem to be getting a lot lucky with automotive performance parts as well
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Old 3rd November 2008, 16:21   #12
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@mobike008 IN that case i suggest you drive my car. i had tune change and the filter done together. along with it i made a few changes to my driving style. POINT to NOTE downshift and upshift BOTH affect your FE. If you don't shift down you don't HAVE to shift up. no rocket science in that. simple things like braking efficiency, distancing vehicles and maintaining speed make the difference along with judicious use of ac. my father used to also drive a few trucks for fun in his age. picked up a few tricks from him. for example on a stock bike. kinetic 01 model i get over 30kpl. for my driving my own technician does not expect more than 25. so maybe i learnt something. IF AFTER a green filter you still don't have an FE change thanks to the earlier upshift aided by better torque i would find it strange. my mileage jumped. even i was shocked. thats considering dad and me both drive the car alternatively.
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Old 4th November 2008, 00:19   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by valhallen.282 View Post
1st-50, 2nd-80, 3rd-100, 4th-120/130.
Quote:
Originally Posted by valhallen.282 View Post
1) My shift points are not off by a mile.
If you are looking at efficiency, shifting from 1 - 2 @ 50 and 2 - 3 @ 80 is off by a mile. The WagonR will be redlining at this point. If you are trying to tell us that your WagonR gives 18 kpl with these shift-points, I am sorry but your posts don't have even an iota of truth in them.

Quote:
my wagonr is highway tuned ONLY so tends to have a higher shift point.
Quote:
all turns are done with left foot braking so speed can be maintained.
Quote:
Originally Posted by valhallen.282 View Post
There are slight changes done some torque adjustments.
Quote:
Originally Posted by valhallen.282 View Post
verified with my service advisor essentially its slightly higher valve clearance, clutch adjustments and a change in torque. but please tell me if i am wrong.
Absolute balooney! What change in torque has your genius technician come up with? And a clutch adjustment = highway tuning! God, I am really done for the day.

Quote:
P.S 100 is highway shift after a K&N.
A K&N is an air-filter, not a turbocharger. Don't expect any noticeable change in performance with a stock replacement. If you still do, let me assure you that its MHP (Mental Horse Power).

Quote:
for example those familiar with bangy and the wagonr will know that you can't turn at the kmangala-indiranagar ringroad faster than 70 or 80. with left foot braking you can safely take it up to 100 and still not break traction or understeer.
You take a turn @ 100 kph and the WagonR doesn't understeer Maruti seems to have sold you a Ferrari in tall boy guise.

Do me a favour : Please stop making such impossibly tall claims. Give us a little credit will ya!
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Old 4th November 2008, 01:17   #14
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IMO optimal shifts points in the wagonR before a stock replacement K&N are as follows.
1st-30, 2nd-50, 3rd-70, 4th-95/110.
I read your figures first and thought these were figurs for Drag Racing but when I read above lines "optimal shift". I was like . I have a Swift Diesel (no comparison with any other car just to mention what I do) and I have hardly done over 20 Km/Hr in 1st gear, 35 in 2nd, 55 in 3rd and 5th gear comes at 70. I mean taking your car to 50 in 1st Gear that too with Wagon R 1.1 engine. Dont you love your car. Unless you are a racing driver, IMO please don't do it and have some mercy on your car.
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Old 4th November 2008, 08:23   #15
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@GTO & @austere_sly those shift points are the MAX the car will take did you not read AT ALL. here is what i wrote with the important points highlighted for you to see <thats as far as it will take on a highway with a/c and two adults+baggage> that means that over that you would be killing the engine. still hard to get? and in case you dont understand baloney i suggest you go ask your MASS advisor what it is they do when you tell them you are going to drive on a highway. find out first before you point fingers. read the other posts. i dont shift at that point unless ABSOLUTELY necessary. i am neither mad nor am i lost in some third world. i would love to do this for a living but i cant so i collect as much knowledge as i can before i speak. please understand left foot braking before you say anything about it. i have used it and would be happy to show you how to do it properly on a 75-80deg turn without facing too much understeer which you normally would. here is colin mcrae giving you a demo.

also please note that the entire point of changing stuff in a car is to get something better. if you still use your original speed based shift point while having a higher airflow you are lower in the rev band thereby consuming less fuel. not rocket science as i said. who is underestimating this forum definitely not me. but never underestimate a newcomer. understand what i have written if you still have queries i will answer. i dont believe in tall claims and 18 is highway why have you presumed it to be city???? i mean where did i say that even??? or are you reading wrong? nothing personal but did you even understand what i wrote AT ALL???

Last edited by valhallen.282 : 4th November 2008 at 08:24. Reason: typo
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