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Old 18th December 2008, 12:25   #106
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Details can be found here.

WHEELS - Immobilizer
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Old 18th December 2008, 14:06   #107
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thanks Vikram, That info is useful.
I need to scout for these products now in Hyd.
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Old 18th December 2008, 15:01   #108
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I have this type of system on my laptop computer. However, there is also a manual password system as a backup. It is a first class security system because unless someone chops off your finger and uses it, no one but you can open your comp and in this case, these new cars! (James Bond - Die Another Day springs to mind!)

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Originally Posted by sanjz View Post
The second security system that has come is recently is the biometric finger print reader. If the owners finger prints are not stored in the memory then its impossible to start the car. ( can store up to 9 finger prints)

Both the systems cannot be over ridden for in both systems the electric supply to the ECU is cut off.
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Old 19th December 2008, 08:15   #109
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getsurya will post the link for the bio metric sensor car security this evening the other link for the wheels immobilizer has already been posted by my friend vikram_d
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Old 19th December 2008, 11:02   #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sanjz View Post
getsurya will post the link for the bio metric sensor car security this evening the other link for the wheels immobilizer has already been posted by my friend vikram_d
There is also a biometric sensor system on the link that I have posted. It is the Thumb Print Transponder Immobilizer. It is the same thing as what getsurya has posted.
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Old 19th December 2008, 12:31   #111
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In my opinion, no aftermarket fitment can give the security of an OEM product that is integrated into the car's electronics, like the iCATs from Maruti.
You are focussing on the front end of the system only, like fingerprint reader or suchlike. More important is the back end - what/where exactly does it control? If it is something as simple as cutting off power to the ignition, then any thief needs to only know where this point is, in the fusebox or wherever. Short it and you're good to go! That, in fact, is the essence of 'hot-wiring' a car for stealing!
Only an 'embedded' system will disable an ECU to prevent the car being started. Short of replacing the ECU, there is no way around it.
The ECU, in turn, needs to be wired up in such a way that disconnecting it's wires sets off an alarm that is powered by its own dedicated battery which is concealed elsewhere.
Any opinions?
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Old 19th December 2008, 12:35   #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anupmathur View Post
Only an 'embedded' system will disable an ECU to prevent the car being started. Short of replacing the ECU, there is no way around it.
The ECU, in turn, needs to be wired up in such a way that disconnecting it's wires sets off an alarm that is powered by its own dedicated battery which is concealed elsewhere.
Any opinions?
Yes but with so many ECU's being reported stolen these days, I'm sure the thief has access to one for replacing it.

Having dedicated battery is a good idea but again pushes up car cost which we Indians are not very fond of. The best system according to me is a GPS or even a GSM based tracking system. Even if your car is stolen, at least you know where it is.
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Old 19th December 2008, 13:31   #113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vikram_d View Post
The best system according to me is a GPS or even a GSM based tracking system. Even if your car is stolen, at least you know where it is.
Agreed, but that is the second step.
There are two aspects:
1) Theft prevention.
2) Car tracking/Recovery.

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This is why I am in favour of fitting a car tracking system, so that the chances of recovery are better.
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Old 19th December 2008, 13:42   #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anupmathur View Post
Agreed, but that is the second step.
There are two aspects:
1) Theft prevention.
2) Car tracking/Recovery.
Agree completely.

But the biggest problem with prevention is that it is extremely difficult to implement it. I mean we have already seen on this thread that Scorpio's are being stolen left, right and center in spite of having decent security.

It is much easier to implement a tracking/recovery tool. Also not many thieves will be expecting it to be there, unless they know that it is there. The surprise factor of a tracking/recovery system is much higher than that of a normal security system.
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Old 19th December 2008, 19:16   #115
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but anup if you check the details in the starting thread you will find that all the m hawks where fitted with OE immobilizing systems.!! they where eaisly broken into by thieves and the rest as they say is history.Atleast in the case of my car when thieves broke into it they could not steal as it was gearlocked and had the card transponder system.They could eaisly silence they central locking security system by removing the batt termiinals but could do nothing much after that
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Old 19th December 2008, 19:33   #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sanjz View Post
but anup if you check the details in the starting thread you will find that all the m hawks where fitted with OE immobilizing systems.!!
You're quite right in what you say. I can only blame M&M for mis-guiding customers. What I am gathering here is that the so-called OEM system is a Nippon Security system which is not really OEM, nor is it 'integrated' with the car's electronics in the same sense as the iCATs.
I'd be keen to know who fits this Nippon system - the dealer or M&M factory. Further why could it not be with the already well-established technology that Maruti has included in every car it makes?

Engine 'immobilizer' is a much abused term. Some of them can only give the thief a good laugh!

Last edited by anupmathur : 19th December 2008 at 19:38.
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Old 19th December 2008, 19:38   #117
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this is what i found in yesterday's newspaper, maybe of help to someone:
Attached Thumbnails
8 Scorpio mHawks stolen-immobilizer codes cracked!!!-scan0006.jpg  

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Old 19th December 2008, 19:45   #118
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Anup, I would not put the complete blame on M&M. I have a pre-iCats model Swift ZXi. I was never told by Maruti that I need to change the code, else my vehicle might be stolen. I read about it in the Nippon User Manual and changed it myself. I'm sure not even half of the sales people in Maruti showrooms will know about this feature.
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Old 20th December 2008, 08:48   #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vikram_d View Post
I have a pre-iCats model Swift ZXi. I was never told by Maruti that I need to change the code, else my vehicle might be stolen.
Vikram, either way it is of very dubious merit. These systems simply are not effective, whether or not you change the code. A four digit code; not even alphanumeric! That's well below industry standards, LOL! Not integrated into the vehicle ECU. How much protection is that?
I too changed the code on my car when I bought it; because I habitually read the user manuals. But I did not rely on that as the only protection for my car!
I'm still trying to find out if anyone has heard of an iCATs equipped Maruti getting stolen.
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Old 21st December 2008, 09:23   #120
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anup if i am not mistaken one of the wagon R s used in the ahmedabad bomb blasts which was parked at the civil hospital was equipped with I cats and so where the Wagon Rs which where picked up the police in Surat.Infact if my memory does not fail all the three had icat systems
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