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Old 12th December 2008, 17:52   #61
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Well my two cents too. nice article guys lots of knowledge shared. in case i mess up somewhere here please do correct:
A lot of effort has been spent on explaining braking etc. yes i have read the whole thread but noticed one question remains unanswered. if 60kph is then what. i remember this one vehicle that hardly had any pick up or power or speed but figured in a magazine as one of the best cars ever! why? that was because it had a sweet handling and if you kept it in top gear it just kept going. thats the point stay on your speed. this would involve multiples of what has already been said here. let off the gas when you need to slow down. stop using your brakes like anchors. Here smoothness is the key along with watching the road and knowing it well. Along with heel and toe learn left foot braking. VERY effective in FWD cars. In our cars here it will help you get that nice balance trailbraking and being on the power through a turn. It can also help aim the corner better. however learning it on a track is a good idea as mentioned here many times over.
DISCLAIMER: i am not a fast driver i do not drive a quick car. however i only know how to make it play within reasonable limits.
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Old 12th December 2008, 17:55   #62
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Originally Posted by mclaren1885 View Post
Different scenarios will need different kind of reactions. One needs to use his logic in such cases depending on the on road & traffic conditions. If one could predict every move and have a remedy for it in advance there would be no accidents. Besides this thread is not on how to "avoid accidents", its to educate the precautionary measures one needs to take before setting off.
How will logic save me in this case yaar??
And adding "how to avoid accidents" will make this thread more complete, IMO.

Last edited by tsk1979 : 12th December 2008 at 18:17. Reason: Quoted post removed
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Old 12th December 2008, 18:02   #63
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How will logic save me in this case yaar??
Quoting an eg from a previous TBHP drive. I was slowing down for a speedbreaker while the car behind me couldn't stop on time. I hear screeching of locked up tires, look into the RVM to see smoke from tires. What does logic tell me to do? Stop braking for the speed breaker, accelerate quickly and get away from the car behind. End result - No damage done to either car. Get the point? If I would have sat and braked cooly not keeping an eye on the car behind my car both cars would have had damage. I am sure you know what I mean.

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And adding "how to avoid accidents" will make this thread more complete, IMO.
Since you claim you are a more responsible driver than me, I suggest you chip in with this bit from your experience. My experience in "avoiding accidents" is very limited. I hardly ever have gotten close to meeting with an accident on a highway till date. My experience in that department is very minimal.
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Old 12th December 2008, 18:06   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mclaren1885
I hardly ever have gotten close to meeting with an accident on a highway till date.
Not taking sides on this thread, but purely from a literary perspective, this would means you are AWESOME at avoiding accidents. !!

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Originally Posted by mclaren1885 View Post
My experience in "avoiding accidents" is very limited.
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Old 12th December 2008, 18:11   #65
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Originally Posted by mclaren1885 View Post
Quoting an eg from a previous TBHP drive. I was slowing down for a speedbreaker while the car behind me couldn't stop on time. I hear screeching of locked up tires, look into the RVM to see smoke from tires. What does logic tell me to do? Stop braking for the speed breaker, accelerate quickly and get away from the car behind. End result - No damage done to either car. Get the point? If I would have sat and braked cooly not keeping an eye on the car behind my car both cars would have had damage. I am sure you know what I mean.

Since you claim you are a more responsible driver than me, I suggest you chip in with this bit from your experience. My experience in "avoiding accidents" is very limited. I hardly ever have gotten close to meeting with an accident on a highway till date. My experience in that department is very minimal.
That example is different from my case. You cant afford to run over a two-wheeler in front of you if you see smoke coming from the tires of the car behind you. Can you?

If you want to learn from my experience, or anyone else's, all you need to do is listen carefully, young paduan. Do YOU get the point, mate?

Last edited by amitoj : 12th December 2008 at 18:13.
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Old 12th December 2008, 18:13   #66
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If you want to learn from my experience, or anyone else's, all you need to do is listen carefully, young paduan. Do YOU get the point, mate?
I am all ears! Kindly proceed. Besides, are you going to add anything valuable to this thread or just keep criticizing, finding faults with others?
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Originally Posted by manveet View Post
Not taking sides on this thread, but purely from a literary perspective, this would means you are AWESOME at avoiding accidents. !!
Manveet, I am certainly not awesome. I just don't take unwanted, stupid risks. For eg, if I see slow moving traffic ahead I back off early, never try to squeeze into the tiniest gap between vehicles etc. If you notice the first Yelagiri drive video you will notice that even at extremely high speeds none of us took unnecessary risks or even came close once to a panic stricken situation. Its about knowing when to ease off and thats what matters the most.

Last edited by tsk1979 : 12th December 2008 at 23:11.
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Old 12th December 2008, 20:37   #67
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When I meant not all cars can be driven fast, I meant you cannot have a qualis and hope to do speeds like a esteem.
I think we should all agree that the driver matters more than the car.
The Qualis is no slouch if in the right hands(i'm not claiming to be the person with the right hands).

I'm told that my driving looks erratic and out of control, even at 40kmph. I tend to believe that,but I rarely take a car above 140kmph.
What I would like to gain from this thread is to learn how to be smoother and more considerate to my passengers,whom I normally treat like inanimate objects.
I've had passengers who refuse to belt up, ricochet off the windscreen, make short trips from the back seat to kiss the gear lever and sometimes throw up all over my car seats.
I need to stop doing that to my family and friends. Any help will be appreciated.
Dont tell me to slow down, Please....
How do I manage to get my kick from the lateral Gs and acceleration and still travel with family?

BTW- Does reading about how to drive better, make one a better driver?
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Old 12th December 2008, 20:40   #68
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we should stop pointing fingers like this.
this thread had a good start.
but its gone away since.

lets us discuss about how to drive fast and safe on public roads and not go on doubting each other and pointing fingers.

now, that 'public roads' part is important as being fast on track and on public roads are two completely different things.

i'll start off with some general road advice
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

one thing that we all need to remember is that,
no mater how skilled one is or how he can control the car in extreme situations,

you should not drive the car on the limit on the road,
i'll list some reasons for this,

suppose you are cornering on the limit: (not your limit, but the real limit)
1. the road may not be clean, some dust on the road and a patch of low grip and you could be in the barriers in no time.
2. a pot-hole on the perfect line or a small stone and it could be worse.
3. some stupid maneuver by a fellow road user or a pedestrain, you try to brake or take other avoiding action, that is not possible on the limit

all these apply when you are at the physical limit of cornering forces
if you are at the limit of your own driving skills, then too these apply, cause if you cannot take the car to the limit during normal driving, then you would not be able to control the car in this panic striken situation, when due to sudden maneuvering, your car might reach its limit, but you cant control it.

so, you can be fast, but always maintain a factor of safety.
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Old 12th December 2008, 21:00   #69
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Originally Posted by rippergeo View Post
I'm told that my driving looks erratic and out of control, even at 40kmph. I tend to believe that,but I rarely take a car above 140kmph.
What I would like to gain from this thread is to learn how to be smoother and more considerate to my passengers,whom I normally treat like inanimate objects.
I've had passengers who refuse to belt up, ricochet off the windscreen, make short trips from the back seat to kiss the gear lever and sometimes throw up all over my car seats.
I need to stop doing that to my family and friends. Any help will be appreciated.
Dont tell me to slow down, Please....
How do I manage to get my kick from the lateral Gs and acceleration and still travel with family?
buddy, i was in your position for a long time, not as bad as you seem to be though

i have improved a lot since, not that they dont scold me, but i feel i have improved.
And that has involved innumerable hours of scolding and fight between me and my parents.

coming to the point,
the way to improve and be comfortable for passengers
1. avoid potholes
2. be slow over road irregularities
3. accelerate slower, if you cant help flooring it, shift gears like your dad does, i mean, shift earlier than usual, i know how irritating it is
4. dont downshift when you brake, again irritating
5. brake well in advance
6. corner without screeching or.....
BASICALLY, JUST GO SLOW

actually, convince yourself that the best driver is the one who is fast but at the same time very comfortable for the passengers.

If you happen to be around a minister's car, or any other 'lal batti' car,
just follow it and learn how it avoids bumps and how smooth it is but fast at the same time
most of the time, they have drivers who are fast but are also extremely comfortable


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Originally Posted by rippergeo View Post
BTW- Does reading about how to drive better, make one a better driver?
yes it does, no doubt about it
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Old 12th December 2008, 21:01   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rippergeo View Post
I'm told that my driving looks erratic and out of control, even at 40kmph. I tend to believe that,but I rarely take a car above 140kmph.
What I would like to gain from this thread is to learn how to be smoother and more considerate to my passengers,whom I normally treat like inanimate objects.
I've had passengers who refuse to belt up, ricochet off the windscreen, make short trips from the back seat to kiss the gear lever and sometimes throw up all over my car seats.
Thats probably because you drive a peted swift and a 110 bhp verna
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Old 12th December 2008, 21:13   #71
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Originally Posted by vinit.merchant View Post
I thought this thread is going to be informative.

But most part of the thread contains bashing each other. Ultimately, I wasted most of the time reading ego's rather than reading some info. Phew!

@Mods: Please intervene. This is going on and on and on.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jalsa777 View Post
we should stop pointing fingers like this.
this thread had a good start.
but its gone away since.

lets us discuss about how to drive fast and safe on public roads and not go on doubting each other and pointing fingers.
Exactly what I have been trying to point out since my first post. Lets discuss technical stuff here so that all of us (including me) can learn/correct our mistakes.
Quote:
suppose you are cornering on the limit: (not your limit, but the real limit)
1. the road may not be clean, some dust on the road and a patch of low grip and you could be in the barriers in no time.
2. a pot-hole on the perfect line or a small stone and it could be worse.
3. some stupid maneuver by a fellow road user or a pedestrain, you try to brake or take other avoiding action, that is not possible on the limit

so, you can be fast, but always maintain a factor of safety.
Very well said. I hope we keep making progress like this from now on.

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Originally Posted by rippergeo View Post
The Qualis is no slouch if in the right hands(i'm not claiming to be the person with the right hands).
I agree with you Ripper. Been there, done that.

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I'm told that my driving looks erratic and out of control, even at 40kmph. I tend to believe that,but I rarely take a car above 140kmph.
What I would like to gain from this thread is to learn how to be smoother and more considerate to my passengers,whom I normally treat like inanimate objects.
To begin with, be gentle with the steering wheel. From what I was taught on track, it helps to cut down on lap times by a lot just by being smooth. Brake smoothly, change lanes smoothly, accelerate smoothly. If you can, watch this Top Gear episode where Jackie Stewart (???) teaches James May how to drive on a track. Very informative show that is. He explains how to brake, how to accelerate, how to steer etc.
Quote:
I've had passengers who refuse to belt up, ricochet off the windscreen, make short trips from the back seat to kiss the gear lever and sometimes throw up all over my car seats.
I know certain members like memo, v1p3r, tadu, cmiuc, jay, myself who refuse to move an inch until the passengers wear the seat belts. Initially even my friends made fun of me, but after they realized I wasn't going to budge they just buckled up. Maybe you should try the same .
Quote:
Dont tell me to slow down, Please....
That is something I will never tell anyone.

Quote:
BTW- Does reading about how to drive better, make one a better driver?
From personal experience I can say YES! Not only did reading up help me to relate to the way the car handles on roads or track but at times you try to defy the textbook logic only to find out that your old habits are the one that were wrong. That builds confidence that what you are learning now is the correct path to follow. Because some habits (mainly bad) die hard. The sooner a man accepts that he isn't perfect and has to learn a bit from a book/web page/or from others half the battle is won.

Personally trying everything I learnt on track days did help me a lot. And I can, and so will many others who have attended track days vouch that driving on track only made them better drivers and never the contrary.
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Old 12th December 2008, 21:15   #72
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Originally Posted by ananthkamath View Post
I don't remember a single panic braking situation in my 9-odd years of driving where I had the time to downshift, specially in a car with an H-pattern gearbox. In a motorcycle, maybe, yeah, with a lot of practise. But otherwise this is purely academic.
Hurried braking, yes, frequently --- but panic braking, no. What's more, the amount of time you spend with the clutch disengaged probably negates the increased engine braking of the lower gear when engaged.

Emergency braking: Stand on the brake. That's all!
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Old 12th December 2008, 21:54   #73
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Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom View Post
Emergency braking: Stand on the brake. That's all!
Thats what a normal human being like me does
@Mclaren- You are quiet lucky to drive on a track. No idea how we in delhi can experience the same and gain some good experience and tips(rather than driving in the meniac delhi traffic)
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Old 12th December 2008, 22:06   #74
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@Mclaren- You are quiet lucky to drive on a track. No idea how we in delhi can experience the same and gain some good experience and tips(rather than driving in the meniac delhi traffic)
Harry, if you can fly down to Bangalore. I shall take you to the track and even get you a car you can drive on track. Saloons or single seaters.
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Old 12th December 2008, 22:23   #75
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This 'Driving Fast' thing is not something that can be learnt by reading posts and memorizing what-to-do and what-not-to-do in different situations.. You may learn all the engine braking and all that but its how much your able to use them in a panic situation. And its something that can only be learnt my driving on highways a lot of times and by experience and lots of it.

And i dont think what car you drive really matters.. Haven't we seen cabbies ripping their Indicas like no other and overtaking everything on road and giving bigger cars a run for their money. Its all about how much you know your car and what speed you and your car can handle. Driving on a track will surely help improve driving skills, but its nothing like driving on a public road where anything and everything can happen at any time.
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