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Old 22nd February 2012, 08:50   #151
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Default Re: Fiat Palio MJD - Known Problems

I have an SDX, that has now clocked 66830 km. Just yesterday, I took the car for a small repair (the driver door's lock was not working), and the customer relationship manager at KHT Motors told me that the clutch master cylinder needs to be replaced. It was once replaced at around 18000 km.

Today morning, there was a superslow truck in the right lane, so I tried overtaking it from the left (in my defence, I did not want to crawl at 20 kmph behind the truck, where the limit is 60 kmph). I accelerated hard (just for fun, since the road was empty and I could see at least half a km ahead). At this point, the steering wheel was slightly to the right. I could see in the corner of my eye that the RPM was approaching 4000 RPM, and suddenly, the steering wheel turned more right without my input! I could feel it, since it slipped from my hands. For a moment there, I thought I had lost control, but nothing. Next moment, I had turned the wheel slightly to the left and I was back in the right lane. I could not feel there there was any loss of control.

I have never reached that RPM, and most of the times, I have not even exceeded 3000 RPM. So, I have never experienced it before.

Was it really a problem that I should try to get fixed, did the car misbehave because I was trying to push the limits of the car beyond what it is designed to do? Sincerely, I hope it is the latter!
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Old 22nd February 2012, 15:42   #152
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Originally Posted by rohanjf
At this point, the steering wheel was slightly to the right. I could see in the corner of my eye that the RPM was approaching 4000 RPM, and suddenly, the steering wheel turned more right without my input! I could feel it, since it slipped from my hands. For a moment there, I thought I had lost control, but nothing.

Was it really a problem that I should try to get fixed, did the car misbehave because I was trying to push the limits of the car beyond what it is designed to do? Sincerely, I hope it is the latter!
Hi Rohan,

Your experience is similar to what is called "torque steer". This happens in cars which have driveshafts of unequal length to right n left front wheels.

One driveshaft (longer one) will get twisted more than the other. This causes the car to steer to one side.

Its only experienced on high revs, mostly in lower gears.

Its normal for cars with unequal driveshaft length to behave so. Since your car has accumulated 60k + kms you may get the suspension n steering checked for wear.
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Old 3rd March 2012, 13:49   #153
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Unhappy Re: Fiat Palio MJD - Known Problems

Quote:
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Now moving on to my temperature issue.........
I just faced this issue after a drive of 25kms at 40-50kmph with AC ON.
The temperature guage shot up way above Halfway mark and just touched the White line below H (Red).That is almost 75-80% of the meter

Switched off the car for nearly 45 minutes.But when resumed drive ,the same case of Temperature guage shooting up upto white line below H.
Observed that both the fans,including Monster fan were not activating.Coolant level remained the same in the tank,but the plastic coolant tank was too hot to the touch!!!No leakages around the coolant tank or below the car.
What could have gone wrong? Guys please suggest!!!
Regards

Last edited by suhaas307 : 3rd March 2012 at 17:44. Reason: fixed quote tags
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Old 3rd March 2012, 14:12   #154
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Default Re: Fiat Palio MJD - Known Problems

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Originally Posted by Alton View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by ByDesign View Post
Now moving on to my temperature issue.........
I just faced this issue after a drive of 25kms at 40-50kmph with AC ON.
The temperature guage shot up way above Halfway mark and just touched the White line below H (Red).That is almost 75-80% of the meter

Switched off the car for nearly 45 minutes.But when resumed drive ,the same case of Temperature guage shooting up upto white line below H.
Observed that both the fans,including Monster fan were not activating.Coolant level remained the same in the tank,but the plastic coolant tank was too hot to the touch!!!No leakages around the coolant tank or below the car.
What could have gone wrong? Guys please suggest!!!
Regards
You might want to fix your quote codes friend. Ok so to help you with your problem, here goes.

1. First things first, you say that your AC was on when this happened. The 'jet engine' fan should have turned on!
2. How many kms on the odo?
3. When was the car last serviced? Or in other words, when was the coolant topped up/re-filled fresh last?
4. After the car has stood still for at least 12 hours (for the pressure in the cooling system to come back to normal), please check the viscosity of coolant in the tank. It should be slightly slimy between your fingers. If it's like water, with some green (if you have an MJD palio) particles in it, you need fresh coolant asap.
5. Check your car's manual, locate the fuse for the monster fan (in my MJD, its one of the fuses in the fuse box that is located under the bonnet), and check the fuse. The manual will tell you how to check for a blown fuse. If it is just loose, you can press the fuse back in properly. This should solve any loose contacts with your fan electrical system.

I'm just trying to understand your car better, which is why I'm asking so many questions.

Hope that helps.

PS: If you need more help locating the fuse, let me know, I will consult my manual for you. But please indicate whether it's a Palio MJD or a petrol

Last edited by ByDesign : 3rd March 2012 at 14:13.
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Old 3rd March 2012, 14:41   #155
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Default Re: Fiat Palio MJD - Known Problems

Quote:
Originally Posted by ByDesign View Post
You might want to fix your quote codes friend. Ok so to help you with your problem, here goes.

1. First things first, you say that your AC was on when this happened. The 'jet engine' fan should have turned on!
2. How many kms on the odo?
3. When was the car last serviced? Or in other words, when was the coolant topped up/re-filled fresh last?
4. After the car has stood still for at least 12 hours (for the pressure in the cooling system to come back to normal), please check the viscosity of coolant in the tank. It should be slightly slimy between your fingers. If it's like water, with some green (if you have an MJD palio) particles in it, you need fresh coolant asap.
5. Check your car's manual, locate the fuse for the monster fan (in my MJD, its one of the fuses in the fuse box that is located under the bonnet), and check the fuse. The manual will tell you how to check for a blown fuse. If it is just loose, you can press the fuse back in properly. This should solve any loose contacts with your fan electrical system.

I'm just trying to understand your car better, which is why I'm asking so many questions.

Hope that helps.

PS: If you need more help locating the fuse, let me know, I will consult my manual for you. But please indicate whether it's a Palio MJD or a petrol
Thanks ByDesign.And checked by quote codes
Mine is an Palio MJD SDX,done 75K kms,serviced just 500kms before.
The coolant has been topped up during recent service - checked it,greenish fluid and slightly slimy.No leakages or drops under the car.Everything's fine.I now suspect the fuse.Will check fuses through manual handbook.
Infact the service at 64K kms ,coolant was flushed and engine oil was Mobil 1 5W40 diesel oil,fully synthetic.
Current oil is Castrol Edge 5W40 fully synthetic @ 1050/litre.
Any effect of engine oil? Or just a blown fuse for electrical fan?
In the worst case scenario,do I need to replace both the fans - Monster fan and Radiator fan if the fuse case shows no wrong?
Anything to do with Coolant pump ? or something like that which circulates the coolant in the engine?
Sorry,too many questions .But just trying to understand the problem!!!
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Old 3rd March 2012, 16:40   #156
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Default Re: Fiat Palio MJD - Known Problems

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Originally Posted by Alton View Post
Thanks ByDesign.And checked by quote codes
Mine is an Palio MJD SDX,done 75K kms,serviced just 500kms before.
The coolant has been topped up during recent service - checked it,greenish fluid and slightly slimy.No leakages or drops under the car.Everything's fine.I now suspect the fuse.Will check fuses through manual handbook.
Infact the service at 64K kms ,coolant was flushed and engine oil was Mobil 1 5W40 diesel oil,fully synthetic.
Current oil is Castrol Edge 5W40 fully synthetic @ 1050/litre.
Any effect of engine oil? Or just a blown fuse for electrical fan?
In the worst case scenario,do I need to replace both the fans - Monster fan and Radiator fan if the fuse case shows no wrong?
Anything to do with Coolant pump ? or something like that which circulates the coolant in the engine?
Sorry,too many questions .But just trying to understand the problem!!!
Please don't apologize. Ask as many questions as you please. As part of team-bhp, we'll help all we can and learn along the way too!

I haven't yet heard any problems regarding actual replacement of fans, even for a 75k kms MJD. Engine oil doesn't seem to be the cause here, that is only a lubricant for your crank case etc. i.e., moving parts of the engine itself. I suspect its a loose or blown fuse. Just find the fuse number and location, remove it, check it, jam it back in, and try your car again.

I wouldn't worry about the coolant pump. It seems like a minor problem with the electrical system, or temperature sensors, due to which the fans are not triggering. First try the fuses, and report back, we'll take it from there. Palio engines are quite robust, and are known for their reliability. Small niggles with electricals, fuses, etc. are known. Don't worry.
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Old 3rd March 2012, 16:59   #157
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Default Re: Fiat Palio MJD - Known Problems

Mr Alton, if the fuses are OK take some time off and take your car to A.S.S and describe the problem. Don't waste time troubleshooting beyond that.
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Old 3rd March 2012, 21:47   #158
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Default Re: Fiat Palio MJD - Known Problems

Thanks ByDesign and Zaks.
Checked fuses with Manual' help.Everything fine.Took to a Fiat specialist here because I really doubt the Authorised guys since they may bang me with unjust replacements and costly ones too!!
So,the mech here checked everything - fuse,coolant and the wiring near the fans.Reported everything fine!.But he expressed doubt about the Relay for the fans receiving the power!.So,he's planning to start from checking the wiring right from ignition switch from the dash board.Tomorrow is the D-day to dismantle the Dash and begin the wire checks.
Earlier there has been an issue on the Right headlamp - power cord eaten away by rats! This guy caught and rectified the problem.A.S.S. simply replaced the bulb without even checking whether its working or not and charged me 310/ for the replacement!
Unfortunately thats the case with A.S.S making me stick to Fiat Specialists!
Please advise.
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Old 4th March 2012, 11:40   #159
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Default Re: Fiat Palio MJD - Known Problems

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alton View Post
Thanks ByDesign and Zaks.
Checked fuses with Manual' help.Everything fine.Took to a Fiat specialist here because I really doubt the Authorised guys since they may bang me with unjust replacements and costly ones too!!
So,the mech here checked everything - fuse,coolant and the wiring near the fans.Reported everything fine!.But he expressed doubt about the Relay for the fans receiving the power!.So,he's planning to start from checking the wiring right from ignition switch from the dash board.Tomorrow is the D-day to dismantle the Dash and begin the wire checks.
Earlier there has been an issue on the Right headlamp - power cord eaten away by rats! This guy caught and rectified the problem.A.S.S. simply replaced the bulb without even checking whether its working or not and charged me 310/ for the replacement!
Unfortunately thats the case with A.S.S making me stick to Fiat Specialists!
Please advise.
Alton,

I've had this problem with the Petra and with the Opel Astra, but not with my Palio as yet. Sounds like a relay fault. As far as I can understand, a relay malfunction (either due to a loose connection or physical damage (read: rats)) leads to varying fan speeds - usually on the lower side - and delayed/no actuation of the fan itself.

The relay isn't too expensive. It retails for under Rs.1,200 if I remember correctly. It looks like a piece of wheat bran with wires coming out of its short sides.
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Old 4th March 2012, 18:59   #160
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Unhappy Re: Fiat Palio MJD - Known Problems

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Alton,

....Sounds like a relay fault. As far as I can understand, a relay malfunction (either due to a loose connection or physical damage (read: rats)) leads to varying fan speeds - usually on the lower side - and delayed/no actuation of the fan itself.

The relay isn't too expensive. It retails for under Rs.1,200 if I remember correctly. It looks like a piece of wheat bran with wires coming out of its short sides.
Thanks Ice.The Relay is fine but the wiring going out to the fans is damaged ,as suspected by rats.This has lead to short circuit of both fan motors!!
Now I need to replace both fan motors.
Everything else is fine - coolant connections,fuse box,Relay unit except the wiring.
How much should the Fan motors cost?
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Old 4th March 2012, 19:23   #161
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Default Re: Fiat Palio MJD - Known Problems

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Thanks Ice.The Relay is fine but the wiring going out to the fans is damaged ,as suspected by rats.This has lead to short circuit of both fan motors!!
Now I need to replace both fan motors.
Everything else is fine - coolant connections,fuse box,Relay unit except the wiring.
How much should the Fan motors cost?
They should cost around 800 to 1000 each, Depends on tha wattage.
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Old 5th March 2012, 20:50   #162
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They should cost around 800 to 1000 each, Depends on tha wattage.
The fan motors are of 2 types - Black type and Gate/Cate make types.Black ones cost - 4800/motor. Gate/Cate - 3900/motor approximately as informed by mechanic.
Enquired at KAVA Mumbai,they dont have Cate/Gate types but said will cost around 12K.Also stock will arrive only after 7 days!.Black ones are available costing 4800 / each.

My car is currently using Gate/Cate types but of a different model!

The great A.S.C. quoted - " No individual parts will be available.The whole set including the fans need to be replaced.There is no stock.No guarantee that they will be available.Will have to inform FIAT Head office.If,available from FIAT,will take atleast 5 days to come,total cost will be Rs.18K + labour = Rs.20K"
Unfortunately ,the motors are such that they are completely sealed without any screws.Hence no question of any repair.Just use and throw types.
Ranigunj market here in Hyderabad ,offered to source an imported motor but not of either make as above as in FIAT.But they said it does work.Quoted - 6900 for 2 sets .Hence,mechanic is bringing a sample for testing.Maybe if goes well,I will have to fit them,to start using the car again.
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Old 5th March 2012, 20:55   #163
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The fan motors are of 2 types - Black type and Gate/Cate make types.Black ones cost - 4800/motor. Gate/Cate - 3900/motor approximately as informed by mechanic.
Enquired at KAVA Mumbai,they dont have Cate/Gate types but said will cost around 12K.Also stock will arrive only after 7 days!.Black ones are available costing 4800 / each.

My car is currently using Gate/Cate types but of a different model!

The great A.S.C. quoted - " No individual parts will be available.The whole set including the fans need to be replaced.There is no stock.No guarantee that they will be available.Will have to inform FIAT Head office.If,available from FIAT,will take atleast 5 days to come,total cost will be Rs.18K + labour = Rs.20K"
Unfortunately ,the motors are such that they are completely sealed without any screws.Hence no question of any repair.Just use and throw types.
Ranigunj market here in Hyderabad ,offered to source an imported motor but not of either make as above as in FIAT.But they said it does work.Quoted - 6900 for 2 sets .Hence,mechanic is bringing a sample for testing.Maybe if goes well,I will have to fit them,to start using the car again.
Wow! I have changed fan motors for ikons and esteems , I can tell you they are not so costly, True the motors cannot be repaired(not worth) but a new motor is not 6.5k. Please check with an FNG , If you were in noida i could them changed myself for 2k,
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Old 5th March 2012, 21:23   #164
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Well Thanks Catalyst_Delhi.I knew 6.5K is costly for 2 motors.But,maybe I can justify myself on the high price since my car's replacement for a day is the local cab which costs me around 1600/day as I need to move around 50 km daily.My car costs me around 200/day.That's the difference!
Thanks again for the lead to Noida.If my car needs anything else in future,it would first knock your car' door for any inputs!!!
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Old 5th March 2012, 21:49   #165
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Well Thanks Catalyst_Delhi.I knew 6.5K is costly for 2 motors.But,maybe I can justify myself on the high price since my car's replacement for a day is the local cab which costs me around 1600/day as I need to move around 50 km daily.My car costs me around 200/day.That's the difference!
Thanks again for the lead to Noida.If my car needs anything else in future,it would first knock your car' door for any inputs!!!
With this math , the fan at 6.5k is an investment, i'd say peace of mind beats everything.
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