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Old 13th March 2012, 18:23   #271
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Default Re: Swift DDIS Turbo issues: Report & Resolution thread

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Team,

Iam still trying to figure out why this 2 diff behaviours with the same Diesel in the tank ,

Any ideas ?
Team,

I have finally found the cause of the changes in Engine response , loss of Turbo aka Surge aka pickup in my DDIS.

I had topped up the tank as usual 2 weeks back and after 100kms odd of driving noticed the Pickup going down , this was a regular occurence for me now hence was not all surprised and had accepted this behaviour and almost learned to live with it , but this time it was different .. in the sense there was no Boost for almost 2 consecutive days which was way too much , thats when a thought struck me ( It was God for sure cause had given up hope on everthing else by now )

I thought of pulling the floor mat a little backwards , a few inches away from the pedals and was surprised to find the Boost revive itself that was almost dormant for the previous 2 days !!

I have driven the car for the past almost 12 days now with no performance issues whatsoever , what stumps me is how come the Floor mat be impairing the performance in any way of the Accelerator pedal when the movement of the pedal was free all the way down to the floor.

Anyway guys I found this resolution a bit funny hence tested out for 12 days prior to posting this.

Cheers
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Old 14th March 2012, 01:47   #272
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter

Team,

I have finally found the cause of the changes in Engine response , loss of Turbo aka Surge aka pickup in my DDIS.

I had topped up the tank as usual 2 weeks back and after 100kms odd of driving noticed the Pickup going down , this was a regular occurence for me now hence was not all surprised and had accepted this behaviour and almost learned to live with it , but this time it was different .. in the sense there was no Boost for almost 2 consecutive days which was way too much , thats when a thought struck me ( It was God for sure cause had given up hope on everthing else by now )

I thought of pulling the floor mat a little backwards , a few inches away from the pedals and was surprised to find the Boost revive itself that was almost dormant for the previous 2 days !!

I have driven the car for the past almost 12 days now with no performance issues whatsoever , what stumps me is how come the Floor mat be impairing the performance in any way of the Accelerator pedal when the movement of the pedal was free all the way down to the floor.

Anyway guys I found this resolution a bit funny hence tested out for 12 days prior to posting this.

Cheers
Thats odd. Can the more informed folks comment on whether the position of the floor mat can influence the electronics of the throttle position sensor?
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Old 14th March 2012, 07:49   #273
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Default Re: Swift DDIS Turbo issues: Report & Resolution thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter View Post
Team,

I have finally found the cause of the changes in Engine response , loss of Turbo aka Surge aka pickup in my DDIS.

I had topped up the tank as usual 2 weeks back and after 100kms odd of driving noticed the Pickup going down , this was a regular occurence for me now hence was not all surprised and had accepted this behaviour and almost learned to live with it , but this time it was different .. in the sense there was no Boost for almost 2 consecutive days which was way too much , thats when a thought struck me ( It was God for sure cause had given up hope on everthing else by now )

I thought of pulling the floor mat a little backwards , a few inches away from the pedals and was surprised to find the Boost revive itself that was almost dormant for the previous 2 days !!

I have driven the car for the past almost 12 days now with no performance issues whatsoever , what stumps me is how come the Floor mat be impairing the performance in any way of the Accelerator pedal when the movement of the pedal was free all the way down to the floor.

Anyway guys I found this resolution a bit funny hence tested out for 12 days prior to posting this.

Cheers


This is the most common and highly ignored cause for loss of pick up in any vehicle. People tend to add up mating in their cars. I have seen upto 3 layers of mating like rubber plastic coir heatlon etc. What this does is it restricts the travel of the accelerator lever resulting in loss of power.

Anyway congrats to you as you have found out the fault yourself otherwise you would have ended up paying for the same.
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Old 14th March 2012, 14:12   #274
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Default Re: Swift DDIS Turbo issues: Report & Resolution thread

Hi experts,

I'm facing a problem in my Swift Dzire Diesel.

For the last few weeks, I observed that the turbo sounds very harsh in the peak turbo range (1900-2200 RPM), only in the 4th and 5th gears. In the 1st and 2nd gear, there's no harshness at all, in the 3rd gear, the harshness is easily heard/felt, in the 4th gear it is quite loud and bad, and in the 5th it is downright annoying. Once I cross 2200 RPM, the harshness disappears.

This wasn't the case earlier, where the turbo sound used to be a sweet whistle in all the gears.

I got it checked by Sagar Automobiles, Bangalore, and they couldn't figure out the problem. Also, in Bangalore it is difficult to reach the 4th and 5th gears easily . Note that I don't feel any loss of power. It's just the sound. I've done about 25000 kms.

I'm not sure if this should be a separate thread. Anyway, any pointers on what could be wrong will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!

Last edited by PearlJam : 14th March 2012 at 14:14. Reason: Wrong sentence
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Old 14th March 2012, 15:03   #275
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Default Re: Swift DDIS Turbo issues: Report & Resolution thread

Check if the plumbing of the turbo and intercooler is ok and no leaks have cropped up.
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Old 14th March 2012, 19:26   #276
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Hey folks, In having owned for Swift diesel for 1.3 lakh KM, here are the problems that I faced.

1) There was oil leak issues in intake manifold, and this oil builds up inside the intercooler which completely puts apart the turbo performance.

2) Turbo pretty much becomes ineffective after 1 lakh KM. The turbo bearings seems to have lost their agility so there is gruff sound.
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Old 14th March 2012, 20:52   #277
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Default Re: Swift DDIS Turbo issues: Report & Resolution thread

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Originally Posted by vishnugs View Post
Hey folks, In having owned for Swift diesel for 1.3 lakh KM, here are the problems that I faced.

1) There was oil leak issues in intake manifold, and this oil builds up inside the intercooler which completely puts apart the turbo performance.

2) Turbo pretty much becomes ineffective after 1 lakh KM. The turbo bearings seems to have lost their agility so there is gruff sound.
Have you discussed this with some MASS ?
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Old 17th March 2012, 15:26   #278
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Yep, discussed it with two MASS. They were kind of convincing me that I have already extracted the life out of the engine and suggested me to sell the car. There are two reasons one is in well wishing me while the other is, they were uncertain about the remedy, procedures, parts and cost. In addition to these problems, I had injector related issues, two were worn out which was causing knock and clatter. I was told by MASS that 2007 DDIS had a design issue in working with Indian fuel conditions related to diesel pressure used for lubricating the pump which was addressed later. So all these inputs discouraged me to continue the ownership.
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Old 17th March 2012, 16:42   #279
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Default Re: Swift DDIS Turbo issues: Report & Resolution thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by vishnugs View Post
Yep, discussed it with two MASS. They were kind of convincing me that I have already extracted the life out of the engine and suggested me to sell the car. There are two reasons one is in well wishing me while the other is, they were uncertain about the remedy, procedures, parts and cost. In addition to these problems, I had injector related issues, two were worn out which was causing knock and clatter. I was told by MASS that 2007 DDIS had a design issue in working with Indian fuel conditions related to diesel pressure used for lubricating the pump which was addressed later. So all these inputs discouraged me to continue the ownership.
i have one of the oldest DDIS on the forum (bought in feb 2007 ). The engine is excellent. Turbo does show some signs of loss of power but that is because of two common reasons -
1. oil in intercooler
2. EGR value blocked with soot.
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Old 17th March 2012, 17:36   #280
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Default Re: Swift DDIS Turbo issues: Report & Resolution thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by vishnugs View Post
Yep, discussed it with two MASS. They were kind of convincing me that I have already extracted the life out of the engine and suggested me to sell the car. There are two reasons one is in well wishing me while the other is, they were uncertain about the remedy, procedures, parts and cost. In addition to these problems, I had injector related issues, two were worn out which was causing knock and clatter. I was told by MASS that 2007 DDIS had a design issue in working with Indian fuel conditions related to diesel pressure used for lubricating the pump which was addressed later. So all these inputs discouraged me to continue the ownership.

The oil in your inlet pipe /intercooler is due to the following reasons,
1. If the airfilter is clogged/not replaced for a long time the suction pressure of the turbo sucks oil along with air
2. The bushings in the turbo have worn out resulting in oil coming into the inlet pipe.

In your case please confirm the air cleaner is clean and find out when it was replaces last time. If the air filter is ok then check the turbo shaft for play.

Open the pipe from the airfilter to the inlet of the turbo. Make sure that the engine is cold enough and check for the play in the turbo shaft. If you find play then the turbo needs replacement.

Turbo for swift DDIS are available for around Rs15000/-. full assembly. If you get the core assembly then it will cost a bit less.

The Fuel Injection Pump and Injectors can also be repaired completely. So If you are satisfied with the overall performance of your Swift and do not plan to change your car you can go in for the above repairs.

I dont think there was any major issue with the Swift DDIS engines at all.

Regards

Samir
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Old 17th March 2012, 18:11   #281
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Default Re: Swift DDIS Turbo issues: Report & Resolution thread

The main cause for turbo failure in any engine and especially FIAT engines is improper grade, quality and quantity of engine oil. As regarding Indian conditions there is also the possibility that during one of the services of the car, oil was billed to you but was not changed. In all diesel cars the oil will stay clear till about 500 km if all the oil was drained completely but will darken earlier if oil was not completely drained from a hot engine. Usually oil is drained in our service centers after the oil has cooled and the sludge has once again settled to the bottom of the pan.

For example when oil in my Junkindica is changed unattended it darkens completely in 500km but if its changed with me in attendance and drained with a hot engine then its stays clear for about 1000km. In my Cruze it starts darkening after 800km but the last time the oil was changed it darkened in about 100km. Something amiss in the last oil change of my Cruze which I shall ensure is done right the next time. Ah!! yes and the massage of my Cruze was done by Siddharth after about 2000km of the oil change so thats got nothing to do with it.

Bottom line is "Ensure the oil is changed before the sludge has a chance to settle to the bottom"
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Old 22nd March 2012, 12:18   #282
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Default Re: Swift DDIS Turbo issues: Report & Resolution thread

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Check if the plumbing of the turbo and intercooler is ok and no leaks have cropped up.
Thanks. Got it checked today and there are no leaks. They still can't diagnose the exact problem. Boost numbers are as expected too. Looks like I will have to live with it.

One thing the SA advised me is to change the engine oil, which was last "done" (hopefully) 6000kms ago. What he says tallies with the post by drpullockaran about turbo and oil change - it looks like they may not have done the oil change at all.
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Old 23rd March 2012, 11:02   #283
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CRDIsamir

The oil in your inlet pipe /intercooler is due to the following reasons,
1. If the airfilter is clogged/not replaced for a long time the suction pressure of the turbo sucks oil along with air
2. The bushings in the turbo have worn out resulting in oil coming into the inlet pipe.

In your case please confirm the air cleaner is clean and find out when it was replaces last time. If the air filter is ok then check the turbo shaft for play.

Open the pipe from the airfilter to the inlet of the turbo. Make sure that the engine is cold enough and check for the play in the turbo shaft. If you find play then the turbo needs replacement.

Turbo for swift DDIS are available for around Rs15000/-. full assembly. If you get the core assembly then it will cost a bit less.

The Fuel Injection Pump and Injectors can also be repaired completely. So If you are satisfied with the overall performance of your Swift and do not plan to change your car you can go in for the above repairs.

I dont think there was any major issue with the Swift DDIS engines at all.

Regards

Samir
Hi Samir, thanks for your views. I got the problems checked with multiple Maruti outlets and the issue was not related to air filter.

Also I went ahead and got the injectors services with Bosch outlet through Maruti. They charged a whooping 8k per injector and one week of downtime. This exercise just reduced the problem to a small extent but gave birth to a lot of new problems including exhaust leak around injectors, black smoke, etc. Then I was advised to change injectors for which 18k per injector including calibration was the estimate given. That plus turbo plus connection rod did not make sense for continuing the ownership.

Anyway, my experience was personal so please do not mistake that I m trying to defame the image of DDiS. IMHO don't expect DDIS to run like Logan or Innova for 2+ lakh km, set a realistic expectation of 1.5 lakh KM considering the Indian conditions and the fact that a good amount of power is extracted from the engine.

All that said, I had a wonderful purchase experience, comfortable ownership for 1.3+ lakh km and got a very good resale value when I wanted to sell. Things can't get better in acquiring, using and selling the car. So I highly recommend Maruti products for Indians. No wonder why Maruti is the most preferred brand for common citizens.
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Old 2nd July 2012, 19:32   #284
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Default Re: Swift DDIS Turbo issues: Report & Resolution thread

Dear Bhpians,

A friend of mine has this curious issue with his DDIS ( SX4 ) ,

There is a noticeable loss of turbo , or at least the turbo seems to be lethargic everytime he tanks up his car ( Full tank )

After the fuel indicator drops down say to 3/4 as per the fuel indicator there is a difference in performance , the Car itself feels lighter and the turbo just responds like ready for a sprint.

The above behaviour seems to continue for every tank full he has done so far ... hence he now refills only to half , maybe sometimes 3/4 the tank capacity only to avoid the lethargic approach that he experiences on a Full tank.

Please note : The Fuel station has always remained the same .

What do you make of this ? :(
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Old 3rd July 2012, 12:50   #285
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Default Re: Swift DDIS Turbo issues: Report & Resolution thread

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What do you make of this ? :(
Will guess, any issue with breather system that is putting load on the fuel pump? Something like air lock. Ask him to tank up and leave the tank cap little loose, ensure this is not done during rains or car wash
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