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Old 16th September 2009, 14:38   #16
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The MUL guy is right, use pure IOC diesel for a smooth and silent engine, the note will improve as you gather more kms. By 10-12k kms it will be purring fine, thats when these diesel engines settles in.

Yes System D doesnt work for DDIS, OWS on the other hand gave some good results but it will last as long as the additive is in the tank. Since your car is brand new, i wouldnt insist on trying it out.

After trying Delvac MX, 1300 and Servo i personally would recommend going with MX which gives the best results. MUL also recommends Servo as the last option.
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Old 16th September 2009, 14:53   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaggu View Post
I havent gone to RNS yeshwanthpur after last fiasco.
Jaggu,

This is totally OT and i sincerely apologize, but am very tempted to ask. Do the service standards of MASS deteriorate over a period of time as they get to know the customer better?

E.g: If you go to their workshop for the first time (say 1'st service) they treat you well and service is top notch, then as you get better acquianted, their service quality drops a few noticeable notches (say from the 4'th service onwards)?

I ask this because you mentioned RNS (Y'pur) and I have had a simlar experience in the past with Mandovi, Wilson Garden.

Thanks,
gpa
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Old 16th September 2009, 15:19   #18
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@Jaggu:
I agree completely with you.

Also, based on below link. (Awesome info)
Car maintenance bibles: Oil Additives
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Old 16th September 2009, 17:02   #19
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@ Jaggu
Mine has already done 11K. I am using the oil supplied by the MASS guys. By the way what is System D?
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Old 16th September 2009, 19:03   #20
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@Ganesh:
System D is an additive to remove residues.
IFTEX- fuel additives
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...thread-11.html
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Old 23rd December 2009, 10:20   #21
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ganeshtvpm, blackstallion76, Jaggu:

Any more updates on this?

I'm facing the exact same issue with my DZire Zdi. The sound is heard only with a warm engine, and only at an RPM between 1400-1900. And it happens most of the time, but not always.

I have done about 5000 Kms and the knocking sound has reduced compared to initial days, but it's still very noticeable. MASS guys at Sagar said the same expected thing - "Use IOC fuel, don't use additives, this is a normal sound, all Swifts have this, this is called Knocking sound, it is expected, etc, etc".

MASS uses mineral oils, and the service engineer suggested switching to Synthetic oils in the next 10000Kms service. He wasn't trying to push for this and get me to spend, saying it's not really required. So I have more reason to believe him now :-)

I hope this reduces as I near the 10K mark
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Old 23rd December 2009, 10:49   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gpa View Post
Jaggu,

This is totally OT and i sincerely apologize, but am very tempted to ask. Do the service standards of MASS deteriorate over a period of time as they get to know the customer better?
I dont know its a natural phenomenon that familiarity reduces the satisfaction. On the contrary i would want to believe that any service oriented stream will try to improve the customer satisfaction to keep the repeat business high.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PearlJam View Post
ganeshtvpm, blackstallion76, Jaggu:

Any more updates on this?
==============
I hope this reduces as I near the 10K mark
Yes the engine sound will go down as you run more, it will stabilize only by 10-15k based on your driving style.

I would recommend using Mobil Delvac MX instead of expensive synthetic oil and sticking to a 5k kms oil change. This has given me good results.

Also do ask the workshop to do a air bleed of diesel filter/pump circuit when you give the car for service. Try to always keep the fuel level above 1/4th so that chances of air lock are reduced.
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Old 10th February 2010, 12:27   #23
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Update:

Thanks Jaggu! After the oil change at 5000 Kms (normal mineral, not synthetic), and strictly sticking to IOC regular fuel, the last 1000 Kms have been a big difference! The engine has really quietened down and is much more smoother!

Last edited by PearlJam : 10th February 2010 at 12:29.
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Old 10th February 2010, 12:36   #24
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My Swift VDI 2009 also had a similar issue. The MUL service guy remapped the ECM to the second level. Apparently, they have 2 programmable modes. One for FE and the other for power.

All cars are mapped to the FE mode when they are delivered. When the turbo dies at 3200 RPM in this mode.

If & only if you ask for better power they re-program the ECM. After I got the ECM reprogrammed the knocking has reduced considerably. The engine can be revved till 4300 RPM without any issues now.

Try getting the error codes in your ECM removed (if any)
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Old 13th May 2010, 13:33   #25
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Hello folks,

Can you suggest which dealership is skilled enough to do the ECU related changes. I do service my car in RNS motors, Hosur Road and they always try to convince me that the knocking sound is a part of all Swift diesels, which is not true.

Actually my car has clocked 90000 KMS and is all fine, except for the knocking sound which is very pronounced. The car still manages to give 20+km on highway and 16 in the city. I'm sure it can clock another 1 lakh KM without much issues. I use synthetic oil (Selenia / Mobil) for the last 45k KM, there is no smoke, no reduction in performance, still cold starts in the first crank but the knorrr sound persists especially after the engine becomes warm. The mechanics say that the engine has hydraulic adjustments which are completely controlled by the ECU unlike other engines where they can tweak it.

I guess it has do with the wrong ECU program that deals with the injection settings right when the engine is warm and applies wrong ratios when the engine is warm which is not suiting the engine. Because the same engine has no traces of the knocking sound when it is cold.

I have tried all fuels in the 90k KMS, the amount of sound varies marginally, but it has always been there in my car. Filter cleaning, pump cleaning, engine flushing, decarbonizing hasn't helped. Please suggest good workshops who have been technically sound enough to deal with this problem.

Thanks,

Vishnu
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Old 16th May 2010, 09:33   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VTEC_Rocks View Post
My Swift VDI 2009 also had a similar issue. The MUL service guy remapped the ECM to the second level. Apparently, they have 2 programmable modes. One for FE and the other for power.

All cars are mapped to the FE mode when they are delivered. When the turbo dies at 3200 RPM in this mode.

If & only if you ask for better power they re-program the ECM. After I got the ECM reprogrammed the knocking has reduced considerably. The engine can be revved till 4300 RPM without any issues now.

Try getting the error codes in your ECM removed (if any)
Trying to hear something like that from a swift owner. Is it possible to remap the stock engine at MASS itself. Anyway I will talk to MASS here in Tvm regarding that.
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Old 16th May 2010, 12:31   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackstallion76 View Post
Hi Folks,

Met the Maruti Engineer in RNS. We went for a good 15-20mins test drive.
I highlighted him about all the issues and the engine sound.

First thing he pointed out was, Diesel Knocking is present in all DDiS and other diesel vehicles as well.

The knocking is due to carbon residues used up from additives and adultered Diesel.
MASS cannot rectify this issue. He showed me his DZire VDI. Even that vehicle had the same knocking sound. This sound pops up at particular RPM. (He called it as Partial Knocking).



One more thing, he pointed out was; there were some missing dampners in the wiring harness from the engine compartment. These were removed during central locking and power windows aftermarket fitment.
He suggested to close them so that engine noise would be reduced to enter the cabin.

Overall, I have accepted with the reason and have to live with it.
He suggested to get the Air Filter cleaned every 5K/10K/15K/20K service and use good & trusted diesel pumps.

If this knocking is more and sounds harshness then he suggested to clean the engine mounts/injectors etc. I did not want to go for this since mine is just 1 month car.
I will get this cleaned during 5K service.

Also, he suggested not to use any additives like System D or Barnahl.
It does develop some corrosion after removing the residues. Maruit does not suggest this.

Maruti Engineer Suggestion:
Just Normal Diesel from good pump (Either IOC, HP, Shell) and no additives
And put Mobil Delvac MX or 1300 or Servo PRIDE
Get the vehicle serviced at regular intervals

Now the question for me is:
Which are the best diesel outlets in bangalore?
I live in Banashankari 3rd stage. With the latest fill, I see the IOC Outlet on RV Road beside Ganesha temple is trustable.

Any suggestions please.
i have a feeling this is not a problem. the knocking you hear is because of the engine mapping. it happens when the fuel injection shifts from multiple pilots to zero pilot. i.e. only main injection is active.
do you feel the 'knocking' when you are accelerating or when the accelerator pedal is past 40% mark? if so, then it is not a concern.
at low idle and low loads, there are up to 3 injections per stroke from the injectors. this is to reduce noise. when the operatin points shifts from partial load to high load, EGR is reduced and injection is single (all at one time).
i guess you should not worry about it.
though, i would like to understand your problem better. it would be great if you can send a PM. we ll discuss more.

nitro
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Old 16th May 2010, 14:31   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VTEC_Rocks View Post
My Swift VDI 2009 also had a similar issue. The MUL service guy remapped the ECM to the second level. Apparently, they have 2 programmable modes. One for FE and the other for power.
Now this is news to me. My Swift Vdi is due for 2nd service. Which MASS did you go to remap the ECM?
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Old 26th October 2014, 09:39   #29
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Default Re: Swift Diesel - Engine sound

Quote:
Originally Posted by sgiitk View Post
@blackstallion: I do not understand that while Servo Pride is only API CF4 or CG4 (depending on where you read the spec sheet), Delvac MX is CI4+ and Delvac 1300 CI4. In other words these are far superior oils. So take the advice with a pinch of salt. Remember MGO for petrols from IOC is only API-CC while the specs call for API-SG!
Sir, What would be the best oil for swift diesel? No one uses Shell/Mobil 1 in Bhubaneswar. Only MGDO Castrol is available.
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Old 27th October 2014, 16:59   #30
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Default Re: Swift Diesel - Engine sound

The best suitable oil for the 1.3 in Swift is Mobil Delvax MX 15W40. This is a mineral oil and does its job very well.

For Synthetic oil, you can try - Mobil 5W40. This makes the engine run silky smooth, you can feel the difference in the engive revs.

Back in the year 2009, I had tried Mobil 5w40 on my 2008 Swift DDiS. The observations were a smooth engine, but we saw an drop in engine oil on long highway runs.

Infact on a hot summer day, after running 600kms there was an oil level drop observed. On draining & measuring the engine oil at MASS, we saw that it was short by 750ml. The case here was that the car had run 300 kms and was given a break and then ran another 300 kms. The next day was when i observed the drop in engine oil.

On discussing at MASS, i heard few others also had observed dropping engine oil levels when using Synthetic. All these cases were with continuous highway running. After that we switched back to Delvac 15w40.


Recently last year, in my friend's second generation swift DDiS, a minor oil level drop (~200-250ml) was observed after a good highway run of about 350kms. This too was synthetic oil (not sure of the brand). But this car is continuing to run on synthtic and is doing good, but this is mainly used in city and short highway drives.
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