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Old 10th August 2017, 16:32   #496
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Default Re: Zen engine bay

Quote:
Originally Posted by T1000 View Post
it was lxi, CNG. I wanted to sell the car quickly, i sold it in 2 days.
if i had waited i could have got 10-15k more.
My car was in a good shape, it wasn't rusted at all.
I could get 55K cos of CNG n sunroof, without that it was going for 35k.

The dealer was trying to sell it for 1.1 lakh the very next day after he bought from me
But now he is quoting 80K after so many months.
Just saw that you have sold your Zen. The Zen owners community has lost a valuable member. All the best for the new ride.
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Old 10th August 2017, 17:46   #497
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fighterace View Post
Just saw that you have sold your Zen. The Zen owners community has lost a valuable member. All the best for the new ride.
Hey, im still here and can contribute :-)

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Originally Posted by fighterace View Post
What do you mean by "seemed to have"? It either works or it doesn't. Swap with a working car and see if it is actually at fault. Check the contacts and the wiring. Only then get a new one if needed. Sensors rarely fail, and when they do they are expensive to replace. Try sourcing a used part from a scrapped car.
I agree with you.

These sensors normally don't fail.
The sensor costed me 3800 (in 2012), it was difficult to procure.
But the new sensor did not solve the problem.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crank View Post
Hi All,

My Zen's Air Mass flow sensor seemed to have failed. Any idea how much this would cost? Maruti GP is not listing it in their website.

Thanks in advance.
Are you referring to MAP SENSOR( MANIFOLD ABSOLUTE PRESSURE SENSOR).
I guess, Zen does not have mass air flow sensor.

Can you share the symptoms?
Its easy to diagnose MAP sensor with a multi-meter, please refer the manual for the voltage values.

Attached is the parts list for all maruti vehicles, along with the price(its an old doc, prices quoted are incorrect, but will give you a rough idea about the cost)

Attaching the workshop manual for your reference.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Maruti Zen 16V MPFI Service Manual.PDF (6.16 MB, 266 views)
File Type: zip Maruti_Parts_Prices_new.zip (1.39 MB, 36 views)

Last edited by aah78 : 10th August 2017 at 18:18. Reason: Posts merged.
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Old 13th August 2017, 16:23   #498
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Default Re: Zen and the art of maintaining it

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Originally Posted by T1000 View Post
Are you referring to MAP SENSOR( MANIFOLD ABSOLUTE PRESSURE SENSOR).
I guess, Zen does not have mass air flow sensor.

Can you share the symptoms?
Its easy to diagnose MAP sensor with a multi-meter, please refer the manual for the voltage values.
I am not sure. Car's pick up was not good with the AC on and the engine was not idling for more than 30 seconds after which it shuts off. Mechanic was a reliable one and may be he was not sure about the part name. He fixed this and the part is mentioned as "ignition coil with wire cable" - certainly doesn't look like a sensor to me. Including labour I was charged Rs. 2000. The car runs smooth and the acceleration is good with the AC on.
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Old 26th December 2017, 15:11   #499
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Default Re: Zen and the art of maintaining it

I picked up a used ZEN (a 2001 ZEN Vxi deluxe) in early 2016 for my college duties. Except for one battery replacement the ownership experience so far has been pretty smooth.

My car has a leaky distributor cap, but every mechanic that I have visited has assured me that leaky distributor cap is common in old zen, esteem & there is nothing to be worried about. But I don't think that a leaky distributor cap is normal.

Zen and the art of maintaining it-zen-distributor.jpg

It is a known fact that the A.C of ZEN is not that powerful. I was until recently okay about my A.C performance till I swapped my ZEN with a 09 M800 for 2 weeks. The A.C on the 800 was better, mostly in terms of air flow. The Air coming out of ZEN was also chilly but blower speed III of ZEN felt like blower speed II of the M800.

The M800 recently had gone through a full A.C servicing, but my ZEN being from 2001 runs on R12 gas which is banned (& hence not available). So I visited a few A.C repairing shops, MASS for this peculiar problem.

Following are the advises I received.

1) MASS - They advised me to get an A.C conversion kit, after which R134 gas could be used. Cost 8000-9000.

2) FNG 1 - They advised that after changing some compressor oil R134 gas could be used, no need to change anything else. Cost 2000-2500.

2) FNG 2 - They advised that R134 gas can be filled in the existing system without any change. Cost 1500.

3) FNG 3 - This was the most absurd advice, they would pour some 3M chemicals through the A.C vent & the air flow will improve.

So I am a bit confused after all these advises. After a extensive search on team-bhp, it seems that I only need to get the cooling coil cleaned to improve the air flow. Can the cooling coil be cleaned without releasing the gas? What would you guys advice?


Zen and the art of maintaining it-ac-system-zen.jpg

Last edited by chiranjitp : 26th December 2017 at 15:12.
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Old 26th December 2017, 17:57   #500
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Default Re: Zen and the art of maintaining it

Chiranjitp,
The leaky distributor can be fixed and you can have a squeaky clean engine. All it requires are two original O rings and a gasket maker.
For the AC you need to clean the blower fan and then you shall get a better flow of air. Try that first and then think of changing the gas. Usually once you open the system its advisable to change all o rings etc. The coil can also be cleaned with a hand water spray that you usually see with barbers. Keep paper and spray in the coil, you should be able to clean it atleast seventy percent if not completely. I never changed the gas in mine for 16 years and just did what i mentioned above.
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Old 26th December 2017, 19:34   #501
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Default Re: Zen and the art of maintaining it

Quote:
Originally Posted by chiranjitp View Post
I picked up a used ZEN (a 2001 ZEN Vxi deluxe) in early 2016 for my college duties. Except for one battery replacement the ownership experience so far has been pretty smooth.
1. Distributor leak: yes its a common problem in zen, but changing the correct size O-ring will solve the issue. Its a challenge to find the right size. After hunting for it at many places, i got one from amco.(had to make multiple visits) The shop guy will ask you to buy the entire distributor, as they don't sell the O-ring separately. O ring costs less than rs100. If the leak is minor, one can live with the problem.

2. A/C: Cleaning the cooling coil, which is below the dash requires gas to be removed. I spent 1500 to clean the coil. It does improve cooling.
The gas was pumped to a small cooking cylinder and pumped back into the system after cleaning. They did a top of the gas from a new spray can.(not sure which gas was it).

I didnt go for any conversation, A/C was working fine for me.
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Old 27th December 2017, 12:16   #502
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Default Re: Zen and the art of maintaining it

Thanks guys for the prompt reply & the wonderful advice.

Quote:
Originally Posted by scorpian View Post
Chiranjitp,
For the AC you need to clean the blower fan and then you shall get a better flow of air. The coil can also be cleaned with a hand water spray that you usually see with barbers. Keep paper and spray in the coil, you should be able to clean it atleast seventy percent if not completely. I never changed the gas in mine for 16 years and just did what i mentioned above.
I had a good peek under the dashboard & it seems that to remove the blower one has to first remove the whole dashboard. Whereas in a M800 it seems that the blower can be removed without dashboard removal. I think it would be better if I let my FNG remove the blower rather than going DIY way.

ZEN blower

Zen and the art of maintaining it-zen-blower.jpg

Easier to access M800 blower

Zen and the art of maintaining it-m800-blower.jpg


The cooling coil seems to be behind this black plastic box. Am I correct? Here again FNG option seems better. First I would make them clean the coil using a hand water spray like you suggested. Can I use a toothbrush to clean the coil or is their a chance that it will damage the coil?

Zen and the art of maintaining it-zen-cooling-coil.jpg


Quote:
Originally Posted by T1000 View Post
1. Distributor leak: yes its a common problem in zen, but changing the correct size O-ring will solve the issue. Its a challenge to find the right size. After hunting for it at many places, i got one from amco.(had to make multiple visits) The shop guy will ask you to buy the entire distributor, as they don't sell the O-ring separately. O ring costs less than rs100. If the leak is minor, one can live with the problem.
It seems that to find the correct size O-ring will be a big task, still I will give it a try. About the leak being minor or not, please advice after looking at my engine bay.

Note- Engine bay is not being cleaned for at least the last 18k kilometers.

Zen and the art of maintaining it-zen-distributor-1.jpg

Zen and the art of maintaining it-zen-distributor.jpg
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Old 27th December 2017, 12:17   #503
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Here's a picture of my 15 year old zen engine clicked recently.
I too had issues just like you of oil leakage from distributor which made the engine bay look dirty and am obsessed with a clean looking engine bay.
I replaced both O rings, and used a gasket maker to seal the mating surface,one thing to remember is to wait couple of minutes or so and then mate the two surfaces having the gasket maker applied,second thing is to leave it overnight to cure completely. in my experience this has resulted in no leakages compared to using the car immediately after apply gasket maker.i used the grey one.

I also repeated the process on my other two zens and have zero oil leakage from distributor area.

Finding the O ring is very easy, you shall get it at any part store, just make sure you buy the best quality possible and buy a set extra and keep them so that you dont have to search them again.

Feel free to ask any further information you need.You can clean the blower with a paint brush,it wont damage your fins.
Attached Thumbnails
Zen and the art of maintaining it-zen-engine-4677.jpg  


Last edited by Eddy : 27th December 2017 at 23:47. Reason: Merged
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Old 27th December 2017, 12:47   #504
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Default Re: Zen and the art of maintaining it

Quote:
Originally Posted by chiranjitp View Post

I had a good peek under the dashboard & it seems that to remove the blower one has to first remove the whole dashboard. Whereas in a M800 it seems that the blower can be removed without dashboard removal. I think it would be better if I let my FNG remove the blower rather than going DIY way.
Cleaning the coil is not a DIY job.
Dashboard needs to be partially removed and the black box removed.
A water jet is helpful to loosen the dirt around the fins.

To know the amount of oil leak, clean the engine bay and look for traces of oil around the distributor after a week. the problem is manageable as long as the engine oil level doesn't drop drastically.

Remember to set ignition timing properly when you change the O-ring
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Old 27th December 2017, 12:51   #505
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Default Re: Zen and the art of maintaining it

Quote:
Originally Posted by scorpian View Post
Here's a picture of my 15 year old zen engine clicked recently.
I also repeated the process on my other two zens and have zero oil leakage from distributor area.
That's a clean looking engine bay. You own 3 Maruti zens, that is awesome. How many kilometers in each?

Quote:
Originally Posted by scorpian View Post
Finding the O ring is very easy, you shall get it at any part store, just make sure you buy the best quality possible and buy a set extra and keep them so that you dont have to search them again.

Feel free to ask any further information you need.You can clean the blower with a paint brush,it wont damage your fins.
How do you remove the blower? FNG or DIY? I am not that worried about damaging the blower, but the fins of the cooling coil being delicate has me worried. I think it would be better if I use a hand water spray like you suggested.
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Old 27th December 2017, 13:02   #506
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Default Re: Zen and the art of maintaining it

I usually do the water spray method and it dislodges enough dirt etc for me to feel the difference in cooling, i also feel peace of mind knowing its way cleaner then what it was before cleaning. The Blower just requires to be again be cleaned by brush, you could remove it or else just clean it as much as possible.

The pic i have posted if of my Oct 2002 zen clocked 154000 kms.
My other zen has covered 272000 odd kilometers, the third one is a carb one which is a vx version and no power-steering but super smooth in all terms has done over 2 lakh kilometers.
Please do set your timing as mentioned by T1000. A perfect timing will make your engine run superb with great economy and perfect engine note.I have noticed if your timing is set perfect you will observe water droplets exiting from your exhaust, a sign i always look out for regularly in my zens.
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Old 27th December 2017, 13:04   #507
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Default Re: Zen and the art of maintaining it

It's generally the O-Ring which gets damaged, and the correct part details are:

Part Name: 11162-71C10
Name: O RING CASE
Price: Rs. 112

Also get the tappet cover gasket checked. I guess that is leaking too in your Zen. Also that GB Breather hose plug is missing in your car. Get a new one ASAP.

Zen and the art of maintaining it-capture.jpg

Regarding lesser flow of air, most likely either your blower motor has become weak and/or the evaporator coil has got clogged. Since our cars doesn't get an air filter, it can get clogged up pretty badly with leaves etc. In my case, it was leaves and pieces of newspaper too, thanks to some rodent.

Evaporator
Zen and the art of maintaining it-evaporator.jpg

Crap which came out:
Zen and the art of maintaining it-crap1.jpg

Zen and the art of maintaining it-crap2.jpg

The best approach will be to remove the dash carefully, clean the evaporator, possibly wash it and then spray Evaporator cleaner(I used Liqui Moly's Clima fresh). Also when the dash is removed, make sure all the vent pipes are washed and cleaned. 3M's foam spray does nothing but only cleans the dust in pipe.

You'll need to remove the gas for this.

Regarding your query about R134, I have a conversion kit for the same. First make sure if your compressor is healthy. If it is, you can go either way: conversion kit, or changing the oil and refilling. R134, IIRC is more corrosive, hence the oil seals are different.

If your AC system(compressor etc) is Delphi then the conversion kit costs Rs. 2600 approx. I had to go for the conversion kit since my AC gas used to leak in 1 year, and people here weren't ready to fill R134 in my R12 system. But after the conversion, there has been absolutely no leaks.

Last edited by Leoshashi : 27th December 2017 at 13:07.
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Old 27th December 2017, 13:09   #508
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Originally Posted by scorpian View Post
I have noticed if your timing is set perfect you will observe water droplets exiting from your exhaust, a sign i always look out for regularly in my zens.
Oh yes, for me it's a great satisfaction to see water droplets at the exhaust, tells all is well with the engine :-)
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Old 27th December 2017, 13:13   #509
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Oh yes, for me it's a great satisfaction to see water droplets at the exhaust, tells all is well with the engine :-)
Hope excessive water isn't a dangerous thing?? I sometimes freak out on seeing the amount of water coming out of my 800's exhaust.

Link to the post:

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/long-t...ml#post4320113 (The love of my life: A 2000 Maruti 800 DX 5-Speed)
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Old 27th December 2017, 13:25   #510
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Hope excessive water isn't a dangerous thing?? I sometimes freak out on seeing the amount of water coming out of my 800's exhaust.

Link to the post:

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/long-t...ml#post4320113 (The love of my life: A 2000 Maruti 800 DX 5-Speed)
Not sure about the 800 Video.

When i noticed water droplets for the first time, i was suspecting the cooling system leaking water through the exhaust :-)
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