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Old 3rd March 2010, 00:02   #16
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Guys, appreciate your answers very much.

The M.A.S.S guy said that the coil is weak & bearing is shaking slightly too. They also said that the vehicle can run several more Kms (not sure if they meant in 100s or 1000s) but they said this conking is bound to happen; when it happens just change the gears to 3/4 times & then give a try & it should start. Infact that's what the mech did to start the car.
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Old 3rd March 2010, 15:16   #17
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Not sure if you have posted this, but what is the cost of a new starter vs the cost of repairing it?
I did get a Maruti 800 starter repaired at a Lucas A S S a long time ago & they did a good job. I saved some $$$ too.
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Old 3rd March 2010, 18:15   #18
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Update - The M.A.S.S guy placed an order for the Denso armature before I could say I need the full self unit & he said its not possible to change it (kind of requested), so couldn't say NO; looks like the bearing were not of same size (that's the message I got) & hence it was sent back & their mechs went today again to the distributor & got an armature with exact bearing match; the work is in progress & will take the car tomorrow morning;

I want to say sorry to all the guys who recommended me to replace the self 'cause by the time I called up the M.A.S.S guy, he'd placed the order.
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Old 3rd March 2010, 18:45   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aargee View Post
...an order for the Denso armature...
...got an armature with exact bearing match.
Do remember to take back the old armature and keep it as a spare. Get an independent auto electrician to check it some day...
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Old 3rd March 2010, 19:03   #20
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Experienced BHP'ians might answer this.

Even if it is not TVS Lucas and is Denso, can it not be re-wound by any industrial electrician? Is it so technical or equipment dependent?

Last edited by vasanthn21 : 3rd March 2010 at 19:04. Reason: spelling correction
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Old 3rd March 2010, 19:12   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vasanthn21 View Post
Even if it is not TVS Lucas and is Denso, can it not be re-wound by any industrial electrician? Is it so technical or equipment dependent?
ANY armature can be rewound. To put matters simply, the technical parts are (1) the gauge of the wire used for rewinding; (2) the number of turns the wire is wound; and (3) the quality of varnishing.
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Old 3rd March 2010, 19:20   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vasanthn21 View Post
Experienced BHP'ians might answer this.

Even if it is not TVS Lucas and is Denso, can it not be re-wound by any industrial electrician? Is it so technical or equipment dependent?
Quote:
Originally Posted by SS-Traveller View Post
ANY armature can be rewound. To put matters simply, the technical parts are (1) the gauge of the wire used for rewinding; (2) the number of turns the wire is wound; and (3) the quality of varnishing.
True, but in case of the Lucas TVS armature, there is the Lucas TVS authorized service center that can usually be trusted to do a good quality job. They do not warranty the work but from personal experience, I can say that they do an excellent job. I have had them rewind the dynamo and self armatures on my Fiat, the self armature on my M800 and the rewound armature has always been trouble free.

For Denso armature, you might have to look at the un-organized sector (if your friendly neighborhood Lucas TVS service refuses to do so).
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Old 3rd March 2010, 20:38   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SS-Traveller View Post
Do remember to take back the old armature and keep it as a spare. Get an independent auto electrician to check it some day...
Yes, I keep doing this all the time & soon you can find a mini junkyard at my home

vasanth actually reminded a point to tell me; the M.A.S.S guy said that once the coil in armature is weak, it cannot be rewound it seems; though I don't see a point, but the reason he gives is that the armature is kind of sealed; he tried making a point that once the armature is opened for rewinding, it cannot be put back as one piece.
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Old 3rd March 2010, 21:31   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aargee View Post
...once the coil in armature is weak, it cannot be rewound it seems; ...the armature is kind of sealed; ...once the armature is opened for rewinding, it cannot be put back as one piece.
I am afraid I shall have to disagree on that. So will anyone with a basic knowledge of DC motors. However, now that the armature is changed, happy driving!
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Old 5th March 2010, 09:52   #25
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Update - Total bill costed around 2.5K; I'd ordered about 4 mudflaps, but still the cost was more than what they told me; I haven't been able to check the bill completely yet.

Car was washed, cleaned & polished throughly, seat was vaccumed (Cars India has never done this to my car till date); they adjusted something on my gear knob due to which the ply on gear stick is very less; I'm yet to drive it thoughly which I intend to do this weekend & will post an update. Overall, yes, the work is good; he promised to order a workshop manual for WagonR & provide a towing chain from Maruti.

If you wonder the reason for why I'd a great service experience - A new M.A.S.S in our locality
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Old 5th March 2010, 17:17   #26
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Price of Armature - 1550
Bearing Needle - 2 X 168 = 336
Mudflap - 223
Labour 3.5 X 100 = 350

Now the fun part - Tax
Service Tax - 35, Surcharge - 1.05, Vat - 263.63
Unknown payment - 0.32
Total = 2759

Proud to have contributed the tax for the law & order maintained & potholed roads.
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Old 5th March 2010, 20:05   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aargee View Post
Price of Armature - 1550
Bearing Needle - 2 X 168 = 336
Mudflap - 223
Labour 3.5 X 100 = 350

Now the fun part - Tax
Service Tax - 35, Surcharge - 1.05, Vat - 263.63
Unknown payment - 0.32
Total = 2759

Proud to have contributed the tax for the law & order maintained & potholed roads.
Good to see that you put in two new needle bearings
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Old 6th March 2010, 17:10   #28
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Originally Posted by vigsom View Post
Good to see that you put in two new needle bearings
What's that? Could you shed some light pls?

BTW, I started the car today & felt absolute smooth & I could feel the power & the car starts in 2-3 cranks; Not sure how to explain, but I could feel the difference; May be it would've been more better if I'd replaced the motor, however I felt a very good difference.
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Old 7th March 2010, 09:25   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aargee View Post
What's that? Could you shed some light pls?

BTW, I started the car today & felt absolute smooth & I could feel the power & the car starts in 2-3 cranks; Not sure how to explain, but I could feel the difference; May be it would've been more better if I'd replaced the motor, however I felt a very good difference.
A new armature and a serviced starter would always make a difference.

Most often,people just service the starter and don't bother about the needle bearing on the starter body -this allows the armature(with its shaft) to move free and prevents play.

Since starters generally require servicing at long intervals,checking and replacing the needle roller bearing(s) makes good sense.

You can google needle roller to see images.
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